When Hasek was a Sabre...

[dbr2]

I wish I saw more of Belfour in his prime.

 

[RECsGuy*]

The only thing more amazing than his regular season stats is that he only win one Stanley Cup, and did so on a sickeningly stacked Red Wings team over a laughable Hurricanes squad. Literally took a perfect storm for him to win a championship.

 

[Rhiessan71]

Yeah, goalies these days could never get...oh, let's say, .938sv%, 2.00 GAA and 9 SO

...and these goalies doing it for a single year today...how high would you rank their respective teams exactly?

Hasek's Sabre's, even with Hasek were barely cracking 90 points a season.
BIG difference there between those Sabre teams and Vancouver, Boston and Nashville from last season me thinks


Either way, I have Hasek for prime and regular season but give me Roy for any day of the week and twice on Sunday's for the Playoffs.

 

[Corto]

Either way, I have Hasek for prime and regular season but give me Roy for any day of the week and twice on Sunday's for the Playoffs.

This is something I can't grasp really.

Hasek always performed in the playoffs, and raised his game for big show-downs.
The only difference is he played behind Peca, Satan, Zhitnik and Smehlik, as opposed to behind Forsberg, Sakic, Foote, etc.

He won everything in the game, Stanley Cup, Vezina, Olympics, etc.

 

[Unaffiliated]

The only thing more amazing than his regular season stats is that he only win one Stanley Cup, and did so on a sickeningly stacked Red Wings team over a laughable Hurricanes squad. Literally took a perfect storm for him to win a championship.

Apart from his regular season stats, only thing Gretzky ever did was win cups on a ridiculously stacked Edmonton dynasty team.

 

[RECsGuy*]

Apart from his regular season stats, Gretzky only ever won cups on a ridiculously stacked Edmonton dynasty team.

...and did so a bunch of times.

Oh, and Dom's bail job on Detroit, the Ottawa years, and getting benched for Ozzi are all greaaaat additions to his legacy.

 

[Unaffiliated]

...and did so a bunch of times.

Did you not read my post? I said "cups". You don't need to tell me that "cups" means more than one.

Oh, and Dom's bail job on Detroit, the Ottawa years, and getting benched for Ozzi are all greaaaat additions to his legacy.

Did you read the OP? This thread is not about legacy.

 

[RECsGuy*]

This is something I can't grasp really.

Hasek always performed in the playoffs, and raised his game for big show-downs.
The only difference is he played behind Peca, Satan, Zhitnik and Smehlik, as opposed to behind Forsberg, Sakic, Foote, etc.

He won everything in the game, Stanley Cup, Vezina, Olympics, etc.

LOL Hasek fans would have you believe that he achieved his glory behind expansion teams. Those Buffalo teams were very good without Dom.

BTW, I had no idea that Patrick won all four of his Stanley Cups with the Avs.

 

[Corto]

LOL Hasek fans would have you believe that he achieved his glory behind expansion teams. Those Buffalo teams were very good without Dom.

They were? Post-Lafontaine/Mogilny, the Sabres teams that reached the ECF in 98 and SCF in 99, those look good to you?

Miro Satan led the team in points in 97-98.
Wanna guess the number of points?
79 gms, 46 points.
Yep, 46.

Those teams had a beastly Mike Peca to play shutdown, Miro Satan in his prime for the regular season in 98-99, but other than that?

I loved those teams, I loved their grit and effort and relentlessness, I loved Curtis Brown and Vaclav Varada, I loved the underrated Smehlik, but put those names against Modano, Nieuwendyk, Zubov, Hatcher, Lehtinen, Sydor, etc....
And you'll quickly realize that only Hasek was the equalizer in all those playoff matchups (even against the emerging Ottawa or the playoff-built Toronto, skater vs skater, you'd have to think the other teams had better teams on paper).

 

[Fish on The Sand]

The only thing more amazing than his regular season stats is that he only win one Stanley Cup, and did so on a sickeningly stacked Red Wings team over a laughable Hurricanes squad. Literally took a perfect storm for him to win a championship.

The same could be said of Lemieux and Gretzky though.

 

[feffan]

Since I have watched hockey, the guys who could, on a regular basis, carry a team nearly by themselves.... would go like this:

Hasek/Lemieux
Gretzky
Roy/Messier/Forsberg/Jagr/Lindros/Crosby/Ovechkin
Fedorov/Sakic/Datsyuk/Selanne/Bure/etc.

That´s probably the list I´ve seen that´s most accurate to my view on things. That´s because I didn´t get to see Gretzky in his Edmonton-years and not enough of Yzerman in his greatest producing years I would guess. Would even consider putting Lindros in the top layer for his play cirka 93-97, a true force on the ice... Maybe even Forsberg during some runs... Best way to measure could be how scared you are when a player is on the ice while playing for the opposite team.

And to answer the question:
Was there a more dominating goalie youve ever seen?
I would say no. Roy is close and some of his playoffruns would probably make my answer yes on occassions. On the other hand Roy had some "downruns". Especially on the ones he had a knack for fetching the puck on dump ins. Roy was no Brodeur with the stick...

Did he get into players heads?
He would make the softest of hands stiff up when given a scoring chance (must be a joke in there...).

Would have loved to see Prime-Hasek in todays shootouts. Prime-Datsyuk v.s. Prime-Hasek...

 

[TheDevilMadeMe]

I think it's widely acknowledged that in all the best goalies debates, Hasek had the highest prime. He was flat out dominant.

It's arguable he was the best player in the league during that period too. Granted, Lemieux wasn't playing (and Gretzky was towards the end of his career), but the only other player during that time who could truly dominate the game was Peter Forsberg.

That's the majority opinion, but there is also a case for Sawchuk.

How good or highly regarded was Hasek in Chicago? Did he outshine Belfour many times?

The improvement in SV% and GAA from 92-93 to 93-94 is enormous.

One of my favorite players of all time for sure, I started following him in 1994 or 1995 when I saw him make a great save in TV's sporting news on Finnish national television.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dominik_Hašek

Nobody in North America had any idea how good Hasek was until after he was traded to the Sabres. Belfour was firmly entrenched as Chicago's #1 at the time.

 

[GuineaPig]

What was Hasek's reputation before coming to North America? There's some youtube videos kicking around of him in action at the Canada Cup during the '80s, and the commentators seemed to have some prior knowledge of him.

 

[overpass]

Smehlik, Woolley, Warrener, McKee, Zhitnik, Patrick.

Looks like a pretty solid bunch to me defensively. Probably a bit unheralded.

First and last time you'll see "Woolley", "solid", and "defensively" together.

Some of the others were solid, but there wasn't a Scott Stevens or Derian Hatcher in the group.

 

[MadLuke]

So yeah, to answer the question, Hasek was the best I've seen. He was into my head, not just the players. I knew Canada was already dead going into that shootout in 1998.

Says a lot when Canada goaler was a certain Patrick Roy.

 

[tjcurrie]

Sakic is by my favorite player ever, but he really doesn't belong in this conversation, nor does Yzerman. Modano isn't even close.

Im a Modano fan, probably the biggest out there, but back in Hasek's earlier days as a Sabre none of those guys were overly dominating. Hasek's later years as a Sabre you could argue it, of course Yzerman wasn't really the same by that point. But as far as Hasek himself, that guy won games all by himself and at his best you could easily argue he was the best ever.

 

[John Flyers Fan]

He wouldn't be my first choice of goalies if I was starting a team of scratch, but his prime is certainly the best of my lifetime.

He's the only goalie I've ever feared, and the only one I felt could consistently "steal games".

I never felt the same way about Roy, Brodeur, Belfour, Fuhr or Smith.

 

[JaymzB]

Says a lot when Canada goaler was a certain Patrick Roy.

Ironically, Roy probably faced tougher chances that game (not counting the shootout), as the Czech's played a great defensive game against Canada

 

[tony d]

I agree Hasek had the highest prime of any goalie. What he did in Buffalo was tremendous. If he had been a starter for a few years more I think he'd be my choice as the #1 goalie of all time.

 

[La Cosa Nostra]

LOL Hasek fans would have you believe that he achieved his glory behind expansion teams. Those Buffalo teams were very good without Dom.

BTW, I had no idea that Patrick won all four of his Stanley Cups with the Avs.

No, those Sabre teams were horrible. Hasek was the whole team.

Hasek>Roy and I hate hasek as a person.

 

[Sanderson]

The only thing more amazing than his regular season stats is that he only win one Stanley Cup, and did so on a sickeningly stacked Red Wings team over a laughable Hurricanes squad. Literally took a perfect storm for him to win a championship.

Oh, and Dom's bail job on Detroit, the Ottawa years, and getting benched for Ozzi are all greaaaat additions to his legacy.

Funny how you hand him only one Stanley Cup, yet mention that he was benched for Osgood. Did you somehow forget that year during your first post, or is there an actual reason for not mentioning it?
It's not like Hasek being the backup in the final makes him the only player being a Cup-winner without being important in the playoffs.

Beyond that, it's hardly Hasek's fault that he played on average teams all the time. He had 3 1 /2 years on a true contender, ended up with two Cups, one conference final apperance and one injury.

Apart from that, Hasek only spend one year in Ottawa, not multiple as your post suggests. Not to mention that he was on pace to win another Vezina that year - at age 40/41 no less - when he got injured at the Olympics. Not being able to return from injury is hardly something that ruins someone's legacy, or was Roy's legacy ruined by pouting and demanding a trade over not getting pulled?

 

[Rhiessan71]

This is something I can't grasp really.

Hasek always performed in the playoffs, and raised his game for big show-downs.
The only difference is he played behind Peca, Satan, Zhitnik and Smehlik, as opposed to behind Forsberg, Sakic, Foote, etc.

He won everything in the game, Stanley Cup, Vezina, Olympics, etc.

Oh you mean like a corps consisting of Desjardins, Schneider, Odelein, Daigneault, Haller and Brisebois?

...and he didn't win everything, there is this trophy called the Conn Smythe.

Lets not forget about Roy's playoff OT record either, especially with the Habs. It's absolutely ridiculous and no one is even remotely close to him.
I'd have to look it up but if I remember right, he was like 24-6 with the Habs and like 40-18 overall....that's just crazy!


Like I said though, I have Hasek #1 overall, Roy for the playoffs. I believe that is a fair evaluation.

 

[overg]

My favorite player.

I wish there was more of Hasek on Youtube but there is this:

The most remarkable save in that sequence is probably at 2:55. Lemieux used to score with that shot *at will*. It doesn't look that impressive in isolation, but Lemieux's patience and skill level was so godlike he used to snipe the top of the net on the move nearly every damn time.

To answer the original question, I think Sabres' era Hasek "singlehandedly won" more games for his team than any other player I've ever seen by a huge margin. No one was the slightest bit afraid of the Sabres' skating roster, but Hasek alone made the Sabres at least a 50/50 shot to win any particular game or series.

Patrick Roy had his playoff beast mode, where he clearly got into his opponents' heads and made them stop believing they could outscore the Habs/Avs. Hasek was like that for entire seasons. The best scorers in the world routinely took terrible shots against him because they lost hope they could beat him with good shots.

 

[TheDevilMadeMe]

Like I said though, I have Hasek #1 overall, Roy for the playoffs. I believe that is a fair evaluation.

It's also backed up statistically. Roy has the best career goals-versus-threshold numbers in the playoffs of any goalie by an enormous margin.

 

[GuineaPig]

It's also backed up statistically. Roy has the best career goals-versus-threshold numbers in the playoffs of any goalie by an enormous margin.

Probably more a result of him playing more games than anyone else, though.

For overall performance, I'd give a slight edge to Hasek. But I think he and Roy stood head and shoulders above anyone else in the league during that time period, in the playoffs.