You're assuming Bertuzzi comes back. With the back problems he's having, he might be on long-term IR permanently.
When did Datsyuk get demoted to the 4th line?
- Thread starter SortaExtremist
- Start date
Cursed Lemon
Registered Bruiser
Is the best part of his offense his defense?
If Datsyuk has the puck, the other team has no offense. As one of the best puck possession guys in the world, that's how he does most of his defense.
There are a lot of ways to defend.Blocking shots, back checking, intercepting passes, takeaways, taking away passing lanes. But some of those ways, while very effective, are no good for transition into offense. You take away a lane, you take away options, but that doesn't give you the puck. Same with blocking shots.
Datsyuk gets the puck back. And when he gets it, he rarely loses it. That's his defense. Even just this year he has 3-4 goals/assists from pure takeaways. Remember his shorty pass to Cleary? Pure takeaway. Or Nashville? Takeaway and wraparound to score. He's a pick possessing wizard.
Vladdy84
L-O-Y-A-L-T-Y
The Zetterberg Era
Ball Hockey Sucks
possibly this?
This is fantastic and I am guessing is about to get a lot of run around these parts.
Syckle78
Registered User
I expect someone to have it as an Avatar soon.
Bench should get some credit for the idea though.
we need to look at scoring chances for/against, shots for/against, etc for datsyuk's lines for each game over last several games.
abdelkader - datsyuk - cleary is ugly as hell, but may not actually be much worse in results. a sample size of a few games isn't enough when looking at GF/GA.
that is the basic idea of puck possession that DRW have relied on for almost 20 years.
there are opposite cases of players who are less effective defensively than they seem b/c they are not very good possession players so they spend too much time in the defensive zone.
probertrules24
Registered User
Looks like Babs wants Abby and Cleary in the top 6. Why not split them up.
Abby Zetterberg Brunner
Cleary Datsyuk Franzen
Z and Brunner do what they do and Datsyuk can spend 20 minutes a night feeding Franzen gifts all night.
Abby Zetterberg Brunner
Cleary Datsyuk Franzen
Z and Brunner do what they do and Datsyuk can spend 20 minutes a night feeding Franzen gifts all night.
Brick Top
LANA!!!!!
NOOOOO, what makes you say that?
Gotta love that we are trying to figure out how to minimize the damage these 2 are doing to our top 6. Do we play them on one line and utterly murder the offensive potential for that line while leaving the other unscathed, or split them up on the top 2 lines and drag down both units? It's the age old ****ed if you do, ****ed if you don't debate.
The whole argument over which of the 2 guys should or shouldn't be in the top 6 is like choosing between gonorrhea and syphilis... pretty sure there are no winners there.
Enough with the Abdelkader experiment. One goal in the past 37 games on an empty net. Datsyuk hasn't scored a goal in the last 8 games. Abdelkader is taking Datsyuk down the toilet with him!
earlier this decade i was watching datsyuk and it was fun. but since this season its really painful to watch. only the highlight vs nashville is what i can remember.
just send cleary and abdelkader to somewhere. doesnt matter where. i would even accept a cap penalty to get rid of them.
just send cleary and abdelkader to somewhere. doesnt matter where. i would even accept a cap penalty to get rid of them.
SortaExtremist
Registered User
It is pretty sad when the 3rd line is having more chances and impact in the game than the 2nd line. Helm centering andersson and Tatar would be one of the best 3rd lines in the league.
The only problem is that when others get healthy, Abdelkader and cleary is going to have someone else who is playing well pushed out of the lineup. Abby will do well on the 4th line and cleary should get the Ian White treatment.
The only problem is that when others get healthy, Abdelkader and cleary is going to have someone else who is playing well pushed out of the lineup. Abby will do well on the 4th line and cleary should get the Ian White treatment.
That highlight was also him skating end to end against the entire Nashville team.
He's had some sweet highlights but one of the best was an across ice backhand pass to Z.
They desperately need a person with Offensive ability on Datsyuks line. Semin would be really nice right now.
Someone mentioned an interesting point on Reddit yesterday that basically said that Babs has setup Datsyuk's line as a shutdown line to the best offensive lines of the opposing team.
"Babcocks post game pretty much sums up why cleary and abby are with datsyuk despite their lack of points. He said he is using datsyuks like as a shutdown line against top lines neutralizing the oppositions best players. He is not relying on it for offense, he is relying on it to make sure other teams dont score. That sounds pretty Datsyukian to me. Maybe that is why the wings GA has been around 1.2 over the last 7 or 8 games and the other teams top guys cant manage to score on us. If you drag your mind away from the offense (only 1/2 of hockey) and look at the defense you see that a abby-pav-cleary line is an incredibly strong defensive unit.
Perhaps Babcock had a chat with Datsyuk in the last month about what its going to take to win games. Being the player that Datsyuk has been for the last 11+ years im sure he was more than willing to sacrifice the points to make sure they win games. Instead of playing with Tatar who would produce more points than abby/cleary but will give up more defensively."
Pretty good point, I'd say. Points are great from shutdown units, but if we can keep their team from scoring, while getting production from a good 1st and 3rd line...
"Babcocks post game pretty much sums up why cleary and abby are with datsyuk despite their lack of points. He said he is using datsyuks like as a shutdown line against top lines neutralizing the oppositions best players. He is not relying on it for offense, he is relying on it to make sure other teams dont score. That sounds pretty Datsyukian to me. Maybe that is why the wings GA has been around 1.2 over the last 7 or 8 games and the other teams top guys cant manage to score on us. If you drag your mind away from the offense (only 1/2 of hockey) and look at the defense you see that a abby-pav-cleary line is an incredibly strong defensive unit.
Perhaps Babcock had a chat with Datsyuk in the last month about what its going to take to win games. Being the player that Datsyuk has been for the last 11+ years im sure he was more than willing to sacrifice the points to make sure they win games. Instead of playing with Tatar who would produce more points than abby/cleary but will give up more defensively."
Pretty good point, I'd say. Points are great from shutdown units, but if we can keep their team from scoring, while getting production from a good 1st and 3rd line...
Uh OH.... don't look now, but more logic seeping into the thread.
Winger98 and Bench have done a very good job of describing what is going on in terms of lines and match-ups. Some people just don't want to see it.
It is one thing if the critics don't agree that the 8 13 11 line is the best way to go right now. It is quite another to suggest that Babcock is "incompetent" for sticking with it and suggesting it is not working.
The record clearly indicates that it is working.
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i mentioned days ago that datsyuk is being used in a checking role, but he has been used in a checking role often since '07, while still being a star scorer. he was checking scoring lines when he played with homer, who was one of the worst ES players in the NHL.
same for zetterberg
datsyuk's and zetterberg's ability to check opponents effectively and still score a lot is what makes them special. neither have needed to play with grinders to accomplish it before.
same for zetterberg
datsyuk's and zetterberg's ability to check opponents effectively and still score a lot is what makes them special. neither have needed to play with grinders to accomplish it before.
Andersson, Tatar, and Eaves dominated the Oilers last night. Even Emmerton couldn't be kept away from the net.
I want Datsyuk to have better players with him too, but for right now, this is working pretty well. 5-1-1 over the last 7 is hard to argue with, even with Datsyuk's production stagnant.
The defense has been stingy and the bottom 6 looks more productive. I don't think this is a winning strategy long term, but with injuries to Filppula and Helm it's been a pretty good adjustment.
There's also the musings by Holland that suggest Nyquist will be making an appearance, so there's hope to inject more offensive players to the mix as well.
I want Datsyuk to have better players with him too, but for right now, this is working pretty well. 5-1-1 over the last 7 is hard to argue with, even with Datsyuk's production stagnant.
The defense has been stingy and the bottom 6 looks more productive. I don't think this is a winning strategy long term, but with injuries to Filppula and Helm it's been a pretty good adjustment.
There's also the musings by Holland that suggest Nyquist will be making an appearance, so there's hope to inject more offensive players to the mix as well.
Seeing as you were just complaining about an ad hominem, maybe you should hold off on using a straw man...At least for a couple shifts or so.
Though I can't say that I am surprised.
omg,
if i would want to watch rubbish like this i would watch live chess matches. taking the entertainment out of a hockey team let the ppl fall asleep in front of the tvs.
watching the wings at the moment is like watching someone playing hockey manager. has something to do with hockey but is boring like hell.
the last 5 games i fell asleep or switched over to exciting games like philly vs penguins. i dont go often into hockey arenas but i cant imagine spending 50 dollar for watching 60 minutes of hockey chess.
and just trying to destroying the game of the opponent instead of playing the game your way is not a feature or a heroic achievement it is only showing you the lack of skills to beat the opponent.
i am surprised that babcock is admitting the lack of skill on a direct way like that.
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