What's the underlying problem?

[SEALBound]

lol...

"Sid, you wanna be a Penguin still?"

"Yes."

"K"

/conversation on Sid's future with the team.

Sid is not going to screw over the franchise where he built his legacy. That includes his understanding that the value he returns to the team is not fair compensation to what he brings. A team is not going to give up fair value for Sid and we are not getting it back. That said, I could see Montreal or even the Rangers foaming at the mouth for a chance.

 

[sovietsanta87]

The roster has warts. Especially with five defensemen out. But the nature of the league is that coaches do not last very long. The message gets stale.

I would like to see a change behind the bench. It’s nothing against sully. He’s been awesome as a coach and led us to back to back cups. He made some ballsy decisions that led to rings. But it’s time.

 

[Gurglesons]

My entire argument is that they have not scored goals like they were. And this is true. They have scored one goal collectively in the last three. What you're saying here has no bearing in the discussion.

They’ve led to goals being produced. That’s all I care about. If you want to state goal stats are reflective of success never say Crosby is better than Ovechkin.

 

[Gurglesons]

"Sid, you wanna be a Penguin still?"

"Yes."

"K"

/conversation on Sid's future with the team.

Sid is not going to screw over the franchise where he built his legacy. That includes his understanding that the value he returns to the team is not fair compensation to what he brings. A team is not going to give up fair value for Sid and we are not getting it back. That said, I could see Montreal or even the Rangers foaming at the mouth for a chance.

The Pittsburgh Penguins are happy to announce our new player / GM Sidney’s Crosbone

 

[Beauner]

The roster has warts. Especially with five defensemen out. But the nature of the league is that coaches do not last very long. The message gets stale.

I would like to see a change behind the bench. It’s nothing against sully. He’s been awesome as a coach and led us to back to back cups. He made some ballsy decisions that led to rings. But it’s time.

This is where I'm at. I don't have nearly the same annoyance and frustration with him that I had with Bylsma and Johnston. But like you said, the message gets stale.

 

[LOGiK]

it looked more like 2-1-2 to me...they sent two forecheckers really high and unlike Pens fly-by forechecking these guys create havoc...

Yeah, it's layerd.

1 deep 1 right behind him, 1 mid helping either forword or the defense, mostly choking out the middle.

Whatever you want to call it... 2-1-2, 1-1-1-2 ... it's not 2 deep every time though and that also contributes to penguins having no clue what to do.

It's 2-1-2 when they press no doubt.

 

[Pens x]

Yea, I don’t think you can pinpoint the blame to any player.

The only group that might be immune from criticism is the defense because of the injuries. The top 6 isn’t scoring, the bottom six isn’t scoring, and the goaltending has been embarrassing. The players all look lost out there.

Firing the coach is the easiest solution, because you aren’t going to trade half of the players right now. Plus, we uhhhh kind of don’t have a GM. But unfortunately, the team won’t do that because of Sully excessively long contract.

Ownership is more or less holding the team hostage right now by refusing to dump Sully. Firing him might not fix anything, but you have to try something. At lease you will know if it’s the coach or the players on the team.

 

[Mario_is_BACK!!]

They’ve led to goals being produced. That’s all I care about. If you want to state goal stats are reflective of success never say Crosby is better than Ovechkin.

They didn’t score goals. That’s what my discussion is based on. You’re trying to argue something entirely different, which is also a much broader argument (you saying someone was on ice for a goal means nothing, even Ceci’s goal the contributions were minor). I’ve said from the start their goal production has seized and I’m right. One goal in three games. You made your own argument that had nothing to do with mine. I still remain correct. They have scored one single goal in three games. That’s a fact.

 

[JRS91]

It's tough to say.

The defense has been decimated and we all know Crosby and Malkin historically tend to get off to slow starts. That said, I see some issues with this team that I saw the past 4 seasons. Lack of bottom-six scoring. Now I know most people will say, but McCann, Blueger and Tanev are doing fine. Yes, but our fourth line sucks.

The reason the Penguins were successful in 2016 and 2017 was their depth. It allowed them to hurdle teams like Washington, Tampa Bay, San Jose and Nashville because we had superior depth. Now I don't expect a Kessel-type player on the third line or even someone like Hornqvist on the third line, but fourth line production matters too. I know right now, the bigger issues aren't the fourth line. It's the lack of top-six scoring, but given the fact that I think those can be fixed with time and a few roster changes, I don't see it as a huge issue. They've been eliminated 3 years in a row because of poor depth scoring. I don't see that changing this season if they do make the playoffs.

 

[Lukin1978]

There should be an option to pick more than 1 reason

 

[Honour Over Glory]

The Core is tanking on another Coach

This usually happens when the coach can't find a better way to advance the system. The tweaks he's made haven't been conducive to a system that works and it's not even just the bottom 2 lines that are affected it's the top 6. If the top 6 was playing the system Sullivan claims should work then the rest would follow but even they don't seem to be playing whatever his system is, well. The arguments with players, the firing of assistants, the utilization of the roster, it grows tiresome. He's on his 6th season now, Bylsma was also zoned out by the staff in his last 3 seasons.


Pretty familiar.

 

[SEALBound]

The Pittsburgh Penguins are happy to announce our new player / GM Sidney’s Crosbone

I would be shocked if Crosby didn't join the front office in some capacity. He seems destined to follow in the footsteps of a guy like Yzerman.

 

[Gurglesons]

They didn’t score goals. That’s what my discussion is based on. You’re trying to argue something entirely different, which is also a much broader argument (you saying someone was on ice for a goal means nothing, even Ceci’s goal the contributions were minor). I’ve said from the start their goal production has seized and I’m right. One goal in three games. You made your own argument that had nothing to do with mine. I still remain correct. They have scored one single goal in three games. That’s a fact.

Bleuger kept the puck in the zone that led to Ceci’s goal.

Your take is terribly wrong. The Zucker goal was assisted by O’Connor and McCann btw.

 

[OswaldBates]

This usually happens when the coach can't find a better way to advance the system. The tweaks he's made haven't been conducive to a system that works and it's not even just the bottom 2 lines that are affected it's the top 6. If the top 6 was playing the system Sullivan claims should work then the rest would follow but even they don't seem to be playing whatever his system is, well. The arguments with players, the firing of assistants, the utilization of the roster, it grows tiresome. He's on his 6th season now, Bylsma was also zoned out by the staff in his last 3 seasons.


Pretty familiar.

Mike Johnston & Michel Therrien, this "Core" has a well known history of it

 

[JRS91]

Blueger has been a fine third line center. He should've started the season there.

The issue is, we have very little talent to fill the holes like we had in 2016 and 2017. Trading all those 1st round and 2nd round picks the past 4 years have hurt. Yes, Shero also did this, but not nearly as recklessly as Rutherford. Perhaps that's why he jumped ship. He knew he wrung the team dry of it's assets and decided to bail.

 

[Gurglesons]

Blueger has been a fine third line center. He should've started the season there.

The issue is, we have very little talent to fill the holes like we had in 2016 and 2017. Trading all those 1st round and 2nd round picks the past 4 years have hurt. Yes, Shero also did this, but not nearly as recklessly as Rutherford. Perhaps that's why he jumped ship. He knew he wrung the team dry of it's assets and decided to bail.

Our talent is fine. The offense issues aren’t because of talent.

 

[ownal]

Our talent is fine. The offense issues aren’t because of talent.

What is your opinion on the Penguins being better at home with the Sullivan having the last change?

 

[KIRK]

Our talent is fine. The offense issues aren’t because of talent.

At 5 on 5 this year, Evgeni Malkin has 0 goals, 2 assists, and is a -3 in 8 games.

In the same 8 games at 5 on 5, Sidney Crosby has 0 goals, 2 assists, and is a -4.

When favorite player is every bit as anemic at 5 on 5 as the lazy Russian Man Bad, talent may not be as issue, but productivity certainly is . . . and it starts at the very top.

BTW, Letang at 5 on 5 has 0 goals, 2 assists, and is only a -2, so technically he's the least noxious of the three headed shit show.

 

[Mario_is_BACK!!]

Bleuger kept the puck in the zone that led to Ceci’s goal.

Your take is terribly wrong. The Zucker goal was assisted by O’Connor and McCann btw.

Assists are handed out like candy. Doesn’t change the fact that the bottom six hasn’t scored a goal in three games.

 

[KIRK]

What is your opinion on the Penguins being better at home with the Sullivan having the last change?

Sullivan can protect Crosby, who's a -6 on the road?

 

[Gurglesons]

At 5 on 5 this year, Evgeni Malkin has 0 goals, 2 assists, and is a -3 in 8 games.

In the same 8 games at 5 on 5, Sidney Crosby has 0 goals, 2 assists, and is a -4.

When favorite player is every bit as anemic at 5 on 5 as the lazy Russian Man Bad, talent may not be as issue, but productivity certainly is . . . and it starts at the very top.

BTW, Letang at 5 on 5 has 0 goals, 2 assists, and is only a -2, so technically he's the least noxious of the three headed shit show.

Yes, I'm speaking to people complaining about the pieces insulating that top talent.

Zucker, Guentzel, Rust, Kapanen, Blueger, Tanev, McCann is a solid enough top nine to surround Crosby and Malkin with if Crosby and Malkin feel like actually playing hockey and not just throwing loose pucks around the ice.

I'll give Letang a pass # 1 because I am me and # 2 because his lineman has been the worst defenseman on the team after Marino and Sullivan is not insulating Letang at all at 33 and expecting him to play 30 minute a night which is another reason to fire Sullivan.

 

[KIRK]

Yea, I don’t think you can pinpoint the blame to any player.

The only group that might be immune from criticism is the defense because of the injuries. The top 6 isn’t scoring, the bottom six isn’t scoring, and the goaltending has been embarrassing. The players all look lost out there.

Firing the coach is the easiest solution, because you aren’t going to trade half of the players right now. Plus, we uhhhh kind of don’t have a GM. But unfortunately, the team won’t do that because of Sully excessively long contract.

Ownership is more or less holding the team hostage right now by refusing to dump Sully. Firing him might not fix anything, but you have to try something. At lease you will know if it’s the coach or the players on the team.

First Ferragamo shoes, now this.

Second look at @Pens x?

cc: @ColePens, @Honour Over Glory

 

[Gurglesons]

Assists are handed out like candy. Doesn’t change the fact that the bottom six hasn’t scored a goal in three games.

The bottom six has been on the ice when goals are going in the net and assisting on said goals.

 

[KIRK]

Yes, I'm speaking to people complaining about the pieces insulating that top talent.

Zucker, Guentzel, Rust, Kapanen, Blueger, Tanev, McCann is a solid enough top nine to surround Crosby and Malkin with if Crosby and Malkin feel like actually playing hockey and not just throwing loose pucks around the ice.

But you said Yohe assured us today that Sid is trying, and it's just Russian Man Bad and Stupid But Pretty Frenchie who are the issues in terms of individual play.

 

[Gurglesons]

What is your opinion on the Penguins being better at home with the Sullivan having the last change?

Luck and the fact Sullivan can hide Crosby's line which has been horrendous.