What would Richard's suspension be like today and others

[Big Phil]

What would some famous incidents warrant for a suspension nowadays?

Maurice Richard - 15 games for hitting referee Cliff Thompson in 1955. You'd think it might be a little bit more than that. I dotn know why I say it but a half of a season doesnt seem out of reach

Mike Milbury 1979 - His famous brawl with the ignorant MSG fans that led to him (and O'Reilly among others) crawling up into the stands and beating a fan with his shoe. He got either 2 or 4 games for that I believe. I think in 2007 that would fetch him 30 games. I dont think that would be fair but he'd probably get it

Eddie Shore 1933 - clubbing Ace Bailey over the head ending his career believe it or not only got him 16 games. He was still a 2nd team all-star that year. I think a Bertuzzi-like sentence would be waiting for him today

Click to read more...

 

[Hawker14]

Mike Milbury 1979 - His famous brawl with the ignorant MSG fans that led to him (and O'Reilly among others) crawling up into the stands and beating a fan with his shoe. He got either 2 or 4 games for that I believe. I think in 2007 that would fetch him 30 games. I dont think that would be fair but he'd probably get it

There should be no punishment for beating someone with their own shoe. That's how beat-downs should happen.

 

[melubsdonna]

I think any of those are for sure half season suspension worthy.

 

[Doc Scurlock]

From the sound of it that Milbury incident would be at least a season long suspension. I'm sure the NHL would look to the NBA and what they game Artest for his actions of jumping into the crowd and attacking a fan.

 

[pappyline]

Richard got off pretty easily considering he punched a referee. Probably because he was a marquee player. Habs have a history of getting off easy for socking referees. In the 61 semi-finals 3rd game between Hawks & Habs, Murray Balfour scored in the 3rd overtime to give the Hawks a 2-1 victory. Earlier in the OT, Montreal had a goal disallowed. The Habs were also penalized 5 times in OT & Balfour scored on the 5th power play. Right after Balfour's goal, an incensed Toe Blake charged onto the ice and punched referee Dalton McArthur. Blake was fined $2000 which was the largest fine ever up to that time. Amazingly he was not suspended. Poor referee Mcarthur fared worse. His contract was not renewed & he never refed in the NHL again. I guess , in those days, if the Habs lost, it was the ref's fault.

 

[Wooty]

Hitting an official is an automatic arrest in California.


243.8. (a) When a battery is committed against a sports official
immediately prior to, during, or immediately following an
interscholastic, intercollegiate, or any other organized amateur or
professional athletic contest in which the sports official is
participating, and the person who commits the offense knows or
reasonably should know that the victim is engaged in the performance
of his or her duties, the offense shall be punishable by a fine not
exceeding two thousand dollars ($2,000), or by imprisonment in the
county jail not exceeding one year, or by both that fine and
imprisonment.
(b) For purposes of this section, "sports official" means any
individual who serves as a referee, umpire, linesman, or who serves
in a similar capacity but may be known by a different title or name
and is duly registered by, or a member of, a local, state, regional,
or national organization engaged in part in providing education and
training to sports officials.

 

[Hockey Outsider]

Eddie Shore 1933 - clubbing Ace Bailey over the head ending his career believe it or not only got him 16 games. He was still a 2nd team all-star that year. I think a Bertuzzi-like sentence would be waiting for him today

There are two big differences between Shore/Bailey and Bertuzzi/Moore.

First, Bailey forgave Shore immediately, so that might cause the league to be a bit more lenient. During the night of the hit, Bailey said (while drifting in and out of consciousness), "It's all part of the game". Bailey also said (in the future) "I hold no grudge... I see Eddie often when he comes up to Toronto for the games. It was just one of those things that happens." So, Bailey clearly forgave Shore at the time of the injury, and in the future. The same can't be said about Moore.

Second, Shore's hit on Bailey appears to have been accidental. Shore was quoted as saying "I was skating with my head down and I didn't see Bailey until it was too late... There was no bad feeling between us. It was purely accidental". I can't find any evidence of past feuds between Shore and Bailey. Some accounts indicate that Shore was looking to attack Red Horner when he checked Bailey, further suggesting that the incident was accidental. On the other hand, Bertuzzi's attack was clearly pre-meditated and intentional.

So, I think the league would have been more lenient towards Shore given those two factors.

 

[Roughneck]

What would some famous incidents warrant for a suspension nowadays?

Maurice Richard - 15 games for hitting referee Cliff Thompson in 1955. You'd think it might be a little bit more than that. I dotn know why I say it but a half of a season doesnt seem out of reach

3 games

Mike Milbury 1979 - His famous brawl with the ignorant MSG fans that led to him (and O'Reilly among others) crawling up into the stands and beating a fan with his shoe. He got either 2 or 4 games for that I believe. I think in 2007 that would fetch him 30 games. I dont think that would be fair but he'd probably get it

3 games

Eddie Shore 1933 - clubbing Ace Bailey over the head ending his career believe it or not only got him 16 games. He was still a 2nd team all-star that year. I think a Bertuzzi-like sentence would be waiting for him today

3 games

 

[arrbez]

There are two big differences between Shore/Bailey and Bertuzzi/Moore.

First, Bailey forgave Shore immediately, so that might cause the league to be a bit more lenient. During the night of the hit, Bailey said (while drifting in and out of consciousness), "It's all part of the game". Bailey also said (in the future) "I hold no grudge... I see Eddie often when he comes up to Toronto for the games. It was just one of those things that happens." So, Bailey clearly forgave Shore at the time of the injury, and in the future. The same can't be said about Moore.

Second, Shore's hit on Bailey appears to have been accidental. Shore was quoted as saying "I was skating with my head down and I didn't see Bailey until it was too late... There was no bad feeling between us. It was purely accidental". I can't find any evidence of past feuds between Shore and Bailey. Some accounts indicate that Shore was looking to attack Red Horner when he checked Bailey, further suggesting that the incident was accidental. On the other hand, Bertuzzi's attack was clearly pre-meditated and intentional.

So, I think the league would have been more lenient towards Shore given those two factors.

Heh, there's so many conflicting stories. I heard Shore got hit by Horner, thought it was Bailey, and just turned around a like body-slammed him on his head...

 

[God Bless Canada]

What did O'Reilley get for socking Van Hellemond? 20 games? I think that would be a similar suspension for Richard. Keep in mind that Richard was suspended for the season, which cost him the scoring title and it cost the Habs a shot at the Cup.

Milbury would have likely received a season-long suspension. Shore probably half a season. I think if Hunter-Turgeon occurred today, it would likely be three to five games.

 

[Crows*]

Steve moore should have got 2 games.

 

[Hawker14]

Steve moore should have got 2 games.

Naslund should have got five for failure to be a man. Iginla would've taken care of it himself, even though it was a clean hit.

 

[Resolute]

3 games



3 games



3 games

You have no idea how close you are...

Richard would get the star player treatment today. 3 games.

The fan interactions would be interesting. Sasha Lakovic got two games for going after a fan in Edmonton in 96. Though Milbury's incident was obviously much worse.

As far as Shore goes, yeah, a Bertuzzi like sentence: 20 games.

 

[weaponomega]

The Milbury incident was before I was born, but how similar/dissimilar was it to the Ron Artest incident a couple years ago?

 

[Zine]

The Milbury incident was before I was born, but how similar/dissimilar was it to the Ron Artest incident a couple years ago?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nZD94xhcONg

 

[#66]

Eddie Shore 1933 - clubbing Ace Bailey over the head ending his career believe it or not only got him 16 games. He was still a 2nd team all-star that year. I think a Bertuzzi-like sentence would be waiting for him today

With equipment the way it is today, Bailey might not have had such a brutal injury. Plus you know how the good ol' NHL handles things. They punish the injury to another player and not the act itself.

 

[Wetcoaster]

With equipment the way it is today, Bailey might not have had such a brutal injury. Plus you know how the good ol' NHL handles things. They punish the injury to another player and not the act itself.

Which is according to how supplementary discipline is to be administered. The CBA provides specifically that the injury to the player is to be taken into account and it has been that way since the policy was put in place in 1994.

EXHIBIT 8
PROCEDURES RELATING TO COMMISSIONER DISCIPLINE

6. Factors In Determining Supplementary Discipline

In deciding on supplementary discipline, the following factors will be taken into account:

(a) The type of conduct involved: conduct outside of NHL rules; excessive force in contact otherwise permitted by NHL rules; and careless or accidental conduct. Players are responsible for the consequences of their actions.

(b) Injury to the opposing Player(s) involved in the incident.

(c) The status of the offender, and specifically whether he is a "first" or "repeat" offender. Players who repeatedly violate NHL rules will be more severely punished for each new violation.

(d) The situation of the game in which the incident occurred: late in the game, lopsided score, prior events in the game.

(e) Such other factors as may be appropriate in the circumstances.

Both criminal and civil law also consider the nature and severity of the injury to the victim suffered in determining sentence or damages. I see nothing untoward with the NHL doing the same. It makes sense to me.

 

[Wetcoaster]

Steve moore should have got 2 games.

For what?

The NHL reviewed the hit and determined it was legal. Also it did not meet the criteria of a legal hit that involved excessive force:

The type of conduct involved: conduct outside of NHL rules; excessive force in contact otherwise permitted by NHL rules; and careless or accidental conduct. Players are responsible for the consequences of their actions.

It was legal hit that resulted in an injury - a not uncommon occurrence in a contact sport like hockey.

 

[Wisent]

Heh, there's so many conflicting stories. I heard Shore got hit by Horner, thought it was Bailey, and just turned around a like body-slammed him on his head...

I heard that one too.

 

[Big Phil]

I've said it before and I'll say it again. If Bertuzzi didnt like Moore's hit on Nalsund he should have fought him. Sure the instigator rule comes into effect but wouldnt it be worth taking the extra two minutes to make a point?

Moore's hit was clean but like many this year Armstrong on Letowski, Torres on Williams, even last year Campbell on Umberger you could say he's vulnerable. So if a player doesnt like it he has the choice to dorp the gloves. It happened on the Umberger and Williams hit (not sure about the Letowski one) so why didnt Bertuzzi do that? Or Jovo even? Or Brad May?

I remember Marc Crawford complaining about how Moore hit "the best player in the NHL." At that time Crawford was pretty close to being right. But all it was, was just a bunch of hot air being thrown around. If you dont like the hit, then fight. If not shut up. I thought it was clean but still. There could have been a fight that lasted 25 seconds or we could have had the other result........................

 

[jiggs 10]

Richard: 30 games

Milbury: 10 games, maybe 15

Shore: depends on the version of the incident, but if he was going after Bailey thinking it was Horner (as most versions I have read say) I think 25 games would not be out of the question.

BTW, Bertuzzi got off easy. He should have gotten a one-year suspension, plus had to pay medical costs to Moore for his gutless, pre-meditated attack from behind. Bettman once again dropped the ball on that one!

 

[MXD]

What would some famous incidents warrant for a suspension nowadays?

Maurice Richard - 15 games for hitting referee Cliff Thompson in 1955. You'd think it might be a little bit more than that. I dotn know why I say it but a half of a season doesnt seem out of reach

Mike Milbury 1979 - His famous brawl with the ignorant MSG fans that led to him (and O'Reilly among others) crawling up into the stands and beating a fan with his shoe. He got either 2 or 4 games for that I believe. I think in 2007 that would fetch him 30 games. I dont think that would be fair but he'd probably get it

Eddie Shore 1933 - clubbing Ace Bailey over the head ending his career believe it or not only got him 16 games. He was still a 2nd team all-star that year. I think a Bertuzzi-like sentence would be waiting for him today

Richard : I'd be surprised if he would get over 20. The hit wasn't exceedingly dirty from what I've seen, but... it's was a ref. I don't think Alexander Ovechkin (the best comparison in today's game in regards to Richard status back then) would be sent in the stands for half a year, unless he would play for Toronto, Montreal, and markets who wouldn't need him to play in order to sell.

Milbury : one year ban. Especially if he would play for the Devils, the Hawks, or any team who have problems selling tickets to begin with! Sorry, you just DON'T jump into the stands, especially in a league trying to attract more people in some key locations... Plus, the player status question isn't very relevant here. You don't treat Richard, Shore and Milbury the same way... Or Ovechkin, Chris Pronger and, let's say, Jamie Langenbrunner the same way.

Eddie Shore : Marty McSorley. As simple as that.

 

[Poignant Discussion*]

Richard - Lifetime suspension, if you hit a ref...you are gone period

Milbury - 25 Games, The fan stole the players stick and started the situation, the Bruins never should have went into the crowd though

Shore - Suspension of one year (Review with the commish after the one year is up) You just don't swing your stick at another player, its a deadly weapon

 

[04' hockey]

Richard got off pretty easily considering he punched a referee. Probably because he was a marquee player. Habs have a history of getting off easy for socking referees. In the 61 semi-finals 3rd game between Hawks & Habs, Murray Balfour scored in the 3rd overtime to give the Hawks a 2-1 victory. Earlier in the OT, Montreal had a goal disallowed. The Habs were also penalized 5 times in OT & Balfour scored on the 5th power play. Right after Balfour's goal, an incensed Toe Blake charged onto the ice and punched referee Dalton McArthur. Blake was fined $2000 which was the largest fine ever up to that time. Amazingly he was not suspended. Poor referee Mcarthur fared worse. His contract was not renewed & he never refed in the NHL again. I guess , in those days, if the Habs lost, it was the ref's fault.

There's gotta be a BIG mistake here, sure this didn't happen in PHILLY and to a FLYER??, CLASSIC HOCKEY??

 

[reckoning]

Richard - Lifetime suspension, if you hit a ref...you are gone period

That's a little bit overboard for something done in the heat of the moment. If that rule was in place than Alexander Mogilny's career would've ended over 10 years ago. I think Mogilny only got 10 games. Tom Lysiak got 20 games for tripping a linesman.

Lifetime suspensions are not realistic, unless it's a Bertuzzi-like situation where he says beforehand that he's going to get the referee, then attacks him from behind.