What makes Yzerman rated so high

Discussion in 'The History of Hockey' started by Ziostilon, Mar 15, 2011.

  1. Ziostilon

    Ziostilon Registered User

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    I think he's ranked at around the right spot, but I don't know why. Only know its popular opinion.

    He never won an Art Ross nor a Hart, however I'm not sure where in terms of voting he was each year.
    and he didn't get it done in the playoffs until much later in his career.

    Prime years are usually around 28 - 33 y.o.
    He wasn't exactly spectacular, not finishing top 5 in scoring during that time
     
  2. canucks4ever

    canucks4ever Registered User

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    I personally find steve yzerman to be overrated, IMO syll apps and bill cook were easily better than him.
     
  3. HF007

    HF007 nWo

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    When he was in his offensive prime he was competing against Gretzky and Mario thus no harts or art ross trophies.
    Another reason he is highly regarded is his transition into a leader and a defensive force.
     
  4. Blizzard

    Blizzard Registered User

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    Sixth All-Time scoring leader. Had a 155 point season only Gretzky and Lemieux have had better single seasons.

    10 All Star appearances (only one first team but consider the competition Gretzky, Lemieux, Messier...)

    A Pearson, Smythe, Selke, Masterton, and Patrick.

    3 Stanley Cups and a Gold Medal.

    The epitome of a "Captain". Longest serving Captain for a team in history. Longevity, two-way player, and an epic performance in the 2002 playoffs on a knee that needed reconstruction.

    Not sure the exact spot I'd put him in All-Time but with his resume it would definitely be in the top 50.
     
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  5. Dimensha

    Dimensha Registered User

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    His two way play and more importantly his incredible leadership ability are probably his two biggest attributes. These two things cannot be underestimated. Most teams can only dream of having a player like him on their team.
     
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  6. jkrx

    jkrx Registered User

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  7. Dreakmur

    Dreakmur Registered User

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    Yzerman completed head-to-head with both Wayne Gretzky and Mario Lemieux. Here's what Yzerman looks like if you ignore those two players:

    Hart Trophy Winner (1989)
    Art Ross Winner (1989)

    2 x First Team All-Star (1989, 2000)
    2 x Second Team All-Star (1988, 1990)


    Hart Voting – 1st(1989), 2nd(1988), 5th(1987), 6th(1990), 6th(1992), 7th(1993), 8th(2000), 12th(1999)
    All-Star Voting – 1st(2000), 1st(1989), 2nd(1988), 2nd(1990), 3rd(1991), 4th(1992), 4th(1993)


    Points – 1st(1989), 2nd(1990), 3rd(1993), 5th(1992), 6th(1991), 10th(1987), 10th(1988), 10th(2000), 11th(1997), 16th(1999), 17th(1996)

    Goals – 2nd(1989), 2nd(1990), 2nd(1991), 5th(1988), 5th(1993), 6th(1992), 11th(2000)

    Assists – 1st(1989), 1st(1997), 5th(1987), 6th(1993), 9th(1990), 10th(1998), 12th(1985), 12th(1992), 14th(1991), 17th(1994), 16th(1996), 18th(2000), 20th(1999)


    Between 1989 and 1993:
    1st in Points with 117% of 2nd place
    2nd in Goals with 87% of 1st place
    3rd in Assists with 97% of 2nd place


    Between 1988 and 1997:
    1st in Points with 111% of 2nd place
    2nd in Goals with 81% of 1st place
    3rd in Assists with 100% of 2nd place
     
  8. TheMoreYouKnow

    TheMoreYouKnow Registered User

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    I don't know why anyone would look at a certain age to find a guy's prime. Yzerman's offensive prime occurred in his age 22 to 29 years, between 1987 and 1994, and at that time he had a point per game of 1.55, 3rd only behind Gretzky and Lemieux. Even at a time of "goal inflation" that's a stat of which you take note.

    What really set him apart though was the fact that he could have gone on like that, he could have picked his spots and played into his high 30s picking up just goals and assists and he'd be in the HOF too. Quite a few scorers have done that. Instead however he adjusted his game and became a great two way forward for the better of his team and the Cups that followed doubtlessly had something to do with that. Mind you, he was still a point per game guy until 2002 in the "Dead Puck era" which given the changed focus of his play is pretty telling about the man's natural offensive talent.

    If you look at career value, you get a guy who maintained a well above point per game career average over 1500+ games with quite a few of those games coming in an era not exactly noted for scoring, that's pretty rarified air there. Lack of trophies? Bad timing.
     
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  9. IggyFan12

    IggyFan12 Registered User

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    Everything you need to know about Yzerman can be summed up with one shift in the 1996 Playoffs where he strips Gretzky in game 7 OT and fires a rocket to win the series.

    As a Flames fan when he went down in 04 I knew we won the series cause Detroit lost their leader.
     
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  10. Epsilon

    Epsilon #basta

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    Despite having seemingly flawless credentials when they are simply listed out, Yzerman is a bit of a tricky player to evaluate due to the dual nature of his career when it's considered on a year-by-year basis. I'd venture to guess (although I could very well be wrong about this) that he would be even more highly regarded (by historians, not by fans who overrate him to begin with by calling him a top 10 or 20 player of all-time, etc.) if his offensive peak had coincided with his period of team success.
     
  11. tarheelhockey

    tarheelhockey Highest Boss

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    I think this is what elevates him beyond many of his peers. It's not just about his numbers and awards, but his development beyond being a mere stat compiler. His two-way play and leadership, and especially the role he played in breaking Detroit's multi-generation Cup drought, push him into a peer group with the Messiers and Bourques of the era. Guys who carried that "all time" aura, and in their best moments seemed a little larger than life.
     
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  12. Stephen

    Stephen Registered User

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    I would have to disagree. The fact that Yzerman 'changed' his game adds to his legend, as if he overcame huge obstacles to finally triumph.

    Curiously, I would say that Joe Sakic was the same player, and his team success came during the peak of his offensive abilities. You could also say his entire career was a peak. Yet he's rated a bit lower than Yzerman for some reason.
     
  13. ColdSteel2

    ColdSteel2 Registered User

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    Great player played for a great team and was very clutch. Guys like that are always going to rated higher than their stats would suggest.
     
  14. tarheelhockey

    tarheelhockey Highest Boss

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    Another thing about Yzerman that I just thought of: he never really played the "villain" the way some great players do. I don't remember anybody having issues with him, especially later in his career, so when retirement rolled around he was hailed as a class act by pretty much everybody. Contrast with peers like Messier, Hull, even Gretzky and Lemieux who had their haters for one reason or another.
     
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  15. TheMoreYouKnow

    TheMoreYouKnow Registered User

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    Well he wasn't a nasty piece of work like Messier or quite a few other greats or a loudmouth like Hull or someone perceived as a "whiner" like Lemieux or Gretzky. I think the Yzerman legend beyond his ability as a hockey player to some extent rests on the fact that for a large % of hockey people Yzerman summed up quite succinctly what a hockey player should be.
     
  16. Stephen

    Stephen Registered User

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    Probably because his cup wins came against Washington and Carolina, some more anonymous teams as well as Philly, which is a villain team...
     
  17. Robbler

    Robbler #FireHolland

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    Happened in 06 too.
     
  18. jepjepjoo

    jepjepjoo Registered User

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    What the heck are you talking about? He only has 1 post season 1st team all star selection (2000) and no 2nd team selections. Did you confuse all star games with post season all star selections?
     
  19. Blizzard

    Blizzard Registered User

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    Speaking games not post season hence appearances. Understand the confusion because I mentioned the first team postseason selection in the same sentence. 3 AM clarity was not the best.
     
  20. tarheelhockey

    tarheelhockey Highest Boss

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    I don't think that had as much to do with it, as his generally clean style of play and spotless reputation off the ice. To be a captain for 20 years in an Original Six market on an elite team and never be involved in major controversy is quite the achievement. The worst thing you can pin on him is his friction with Scotty Bowman, which puts him in the same category as anyone else who ever played for Bowman.
     
  21. steveott

    steveott Registered User

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    And Forsberg was better than sakic! (couldnt resist...:laugh:)
     
  22. Blizzard

    Blizzard Registered User

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    This and in a way I think having Lemieux and Gretzky above him helped because the media never focused on him as much or tried to compare him to anyone which inevitably results in a semi-hatred among the mixed camps. Lemieux vs Gretzky, Crosby vs Ovechkin, etc.. If Gretzky or Lemieux wasn't around and Yzerman was being compared to either at that time as the second best player I'm sure the Lemieux or Gretzky lovers would have taken more offense to him.
     
  23. steveott

    steveott Registered User

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    And Forsberg was better than sakic! (couldnt resist...:laugh:)
     
  24. TheDevilMadeMe

    TheDevilMadeMe Registered User

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    I pick Sakic over Yzerman, specifically because he was able to raise his defensive game without sacrificing offense.
     
  25. Seanconn*

    Seanconn* Guest

    You can do the same thing for other players, as well. specifically Teemu Selanne... except the two names would be Lemieux and Jagr instead.

    Yzerman was great, but he get's so much unanimous praise, while with Selanne, people rarely bring up that he had to compete against Jagr and Lemieux, like they do with Yzerman having to compete with Gretzky and Mario.
     

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