We have to trade for Nylander

[Navin R Slavin]

I mean, if you only want to selectively look at the last week instead of taking the whole 3-4 month standoff into consideration. Whatever you need to tell yourself to think that the leafs lost.

Of course the Leafs "lost". They wasted two whole months of playing time of a good young player and got none of what they wanted, and paid him basically what he asked for all along.

 

[Blueline Bomber]

Of course the Leafs "lost". They wasted two whole months of playing time of a good young player and got none of what they wanted, and paid him basically what he asked for all along.

And by eventually caving to his demands instead of letting him sit out, they've basically made it "acceptable" for players to do this.

 

[oooooooooohCanada]

Insanity. Rewarded with a $24M bonus for sitting at home, Matthews and Marner's agents are licking their chops, and, to be honest, probably is Aho's.

All agents of high-level RFA's would be absolutely stupid not to attempt this.

Signing bonuses are pretty standard business now. Tom Wilson's contract is almost entirely signing bonuses. It's to lockout proof the deals.

Are we really going to act now like the entire conversation around Nylander for the past week wasn’t a ~$6.5 million Leafs offer vs. a Nylander $6.9 million ask? I have personally half a dozen posts about how dumb that specific gap in negotiations is.

Come on now. Not on the Canes board. Go celebrate your fantasies on the Leafs board. Dubas should have signed this deal months ago.

Just because the gap was apparently 400k for the last week doesn't mean it wasn't significantly more before that. It shrunk as we got closer to the deadline.

 

[zman77]

Nylander will be traded at the 2019 NHL Draft

 

[GoldiFox]

Signing bonuses are pretty standard business now. Tom Wilson's contract is almost entirely signing bonuses. It's to lockout proof the deals.



Just because the gap was apparently 400k for the last week doesn't mean it wasn't significantly more before that. It shrunk as we got closer to the deadline.

Doesn’t this tweet support everything I have been saying? That Toronto should have signed this deal months ago and that the Leafs gave in?

No GM in recent history has had such trouble signing their RFA. At the end of the day Nylander got his ask, Leafs didn’t want to go above $6.5 million and they relented at the last moment.

 

[Ahoy there]

This makes losing Zykov on waivers even more curious to me. Thought it was clearing up roster spots.

 

[GoldiFox]

This makes losing Zykov on waivers even more curious to me. Thought it was clearing up roster spots.

They called up Bishop yesterday. There was no open roster spot that required filling.

 

[dogbazinho]

So does this deal make him more attractive to us? Assuming TO pays the bonus and this next year, we can trade for him at 6.77 real dollars years 2 - 7?

 

[Negan4Coach]

They signed him to $42M for 5+ years or 7.5M per. Because of the holdout and signing bonus his cap hit is only 6.9M for the remaining years after this one.

So they lost a third of the season for $500k-$600k a year in cap space.

Is that worth all the acroimony and weirdness generated as a result? Plus a player coming in cold right in the middle of an important season?

 

[Big Daddy Cane]

So does this deal make him more attractive to us? Assuming TO pays the bonus and this next year, we can trade for him at 6.77 real dollars years 2 - 7?

If the Leafs trade him after they pay his bonus next year, his real salary cost will average out to ~$4.94 mil. That's very attractive for budget teams at a macro level. At a micro level, it's a little less attractive. In each of the final 4 years of his contract, he'll make $6 mil, with $3.5 mil coming in the form of a signing bonus. That includes the potential lockout year.

...

Nylander did well. He basically got the inflation adjusted Pastrnak comp. I imagine the $8 mil figure cited was for the max term. If you scale ~$7 mil x 6, you're looking at something in the neighborhood of an $8 mil AAV.

 

[TheBigKahuna]

Is that worth all the acroimony and weirdness generated as a result? Plus a player coming in cold right in the middle of an important season?

Groin injury.....

 

[The Faulker 27]

 

[Finlandia WOAT]

Dubas caved.

I don't think this sets a precedent. This happened because both parties really wanted Nylander in a Leafs kit. If, say, McGinn tries this, cya Brock. Like college ufa, it's a route few can exploit bc its so situational.

Big signing bonus on July 1st 2019 is trade protection. It hurt RoRs value.

 

[CandyCanes]

What was the point of all of this? Why wasn't that offer made months ago?

Rumor has it the Leafs really wanted to give Nylander a $7mill average all along. But Nylander insisted on a $6.9 average, cause that’s his favorite position in bed. The Leafs said they were too classy to 6.9 with Nylander so a deal couldn’t be made. They finally caved and decided to get in bed with Willy, and they 6.9’d.

 

[The Faulker 27]

Rumor has it the Leafs really wanted to give Nylander a $7mill average all along. But Nylander insisted on a $6.9 average, cause that’s his favorite position in bed. The Leafs said they were too classy to 6.9 with Nylander so a deal couldn’t be made. They finally caved and decided to get in bed with Willy, and they 6.9’d.

Sounds like they got backdoored too.

 

[7even]

Now you are just being silly. I don’t think the Leafs lost. This is the same deal any GM would have given their RFA in the offseason. It is a contract in line with every recent RFA of this quality in recent history when adjusted for Cap inflation. Mirtle wrote a The Athletic article about it today which I made multiple comments on it making sense.

Dubas tried to show some muscle with Marner/Matthews in line next and it blew up in his face. ALL reports say that Toronto made a final desperation offer to Nylander. That offer was in line with what everyone expected. That should tell you all you need to know about who kowtowed to who.

:thinking:

Of course Toronto made the last offer, they're the ones offering.

Who knows how it went down. It's all boring ass conjecture.

 

[Lempo]

:thinking:

Of course Toronto made the last offer, they're the ones offering.

Who knows how it went down. It's all boring ass conjecture.

Both sides of the negotiation can make an offer for a contract.

 

[Lempo]

If the Leafs trade him after they pay his bonus next year, his real salary cost will average out to ~$4.94 mil. That's very attractive for budget teams at a macro level. At a micro level, it's a little less attractive. In each of the final 4 years of his contract, he'll make $6 mil, with $3.5 mil coming in the form of a signing bonus. That includes the potential lockout year.

...

Nylander did well. He basically got the inflation adjusted Pastrnak comp. I imagine the $8 mil figure cited was for the max term. If you scale ~$7 mil x 6, you're looking at something in the neighborhood of an $8 mil AAV.

It's kind of noticeable that 2020-21 and 2022-23 don't have a higher signing bonus. On the other years it don't really matter if the salary gets paid July 1st or bi-monthly (except for trading purposes), but for a specific lockout protection there should be an anomalously high signing bonus and a negligible base salary for those years in comparison to the others.

Obviously he does get paid the $3.5M whether or not seasons 2020 and 2022 happen so that is a protection, but this is devised as a highly tradeable deal.

 

[Lempo]

Nylander will be traded at the 2019 NHL Draft

Signing Bonus of $8.3M payable on July 1st, 2019 (a week or so after the Draft) says he won't be.

July 2nd, 2019 he's very tradeable, assuming TML don't value real money. I would assume Matthews and Marner will be extended before they run out of contract on July 30th (unless Matthews really wants to be Offer Sheeted for max contract). They'll know if they can afford to keep Nylander at that point.

... am I allowed to hope that Islanders offer sheet Matthews despite it screwing up the Metropolitan for us?

 

[Lempo]

Nylander's ask was $8.5 million a month ago according to the same insiders. He moved on his ask more than the leafs did.

Was that for 8 years though, buying two UFA years. Or, a Draisaitl.

 

[Lempo]

That contract, the hold out, and the precedent it sets probably just guaranteed us the owners opt out of the CBA next September.

I don't think the owners can expect the CBA to be tilted any more to their favor regarding the RFAs. Nylander took the only thing that's in his favor, the freedom of contracting, and tried muscling his case through that. The owners got their Right of First Refusal, their four-year demand for Arbitration eligibility, their everything. The one thing they can't get away from is that the player has to consent to sign himself up.

After the supreme class of RFAs all get signed by the next summer, Nylander's contract negotiations and the outcome of it will be a footnote. Matthews Marner Laine Rantanen Aho... Nylander didn't get the Draisaitl contract. It ended up like the strike my union did some years back. We got exactly the same as everyone else got without striking. Everyone can sign the rest of the RFAs now.

 

[Big Daddy Cane]

It's kind of noticeable that 2020-21 and 2022-23 don't have a higher signing bonus. On the other years it don't really matter if the salary gets paid July 1st or bi-monthly (except for trading purposes), but for a specific lockout protection there should be an anomalously high signing bonus and a negligible base salary for those years in comparison to the others.

Obviously he does get paid the $3.5M whether or not seasons 2020 and 2022 happen so that is a protection, but this is devised as a highly tradeable deal.

The Leafs already had $17.84 mil in bonus obligations for the 20-21 season before Nylander. Now it's $21.34 mil. Matthews and Marner will undoubtedly get the bulk of their salary in a bonus payment for that year. We don't know how all of those bonuses are structured, but they could be looking at dropping $40 mil (+) in one go a year and a half from now with no guarantee of revenue. The Leafs are absurdly rich, but perhaps they even have limits.

 

[Lempo]

The Leafs already had $17.84 mil in bonus obligations for the 20-21 season before Nylander. Now it's $21.34 mil. Matthews and Marner will undoubtedly get the bulk of their salary in a bonus payment for that year. We don't know how all of those bonuses are structured, but they could be looking at dropping $40 mil (+) in one go a year and a half from now with no guarantee of revenue. The Leafs are absurdly rich, but perhaps they even have limits.

CapFriendly has a slightly different number. $20.59M in Signing Bonuses all together with Nylander included in the active roster, and a couple of non-roster guys with Performance Bonus of $532,5k total (Liljegren with $400k Schedule A bonus and Lindgren with $132.5k of what I assume is a Games Played bonus).

Toronto Maple Leafs - CapFriendly - NHL Salary Caps

There's no mystery in Signing Bonus, it's payable on July 1st. Performance Bonuses get paid when and if they get earned.

 

[Big Daddy Cane]

CapFriendly has a slightly different number. $20.59M in Signing Bonuses all together with Nylander included in the active roster, and a couple of non-roster guys with Performance Bonus of $532,5k total (Liljegren with $400k Schedule A bonus and Lindgren with $132.5k of what I assume is a Games Played bonus).

Toronto Maple Leafs - CapFriendly - NHL Salary Caps

There's no mystery in Signing Bonus, it's payable on July 1st. Performance Bonuses get paid when and if they get earned.

I added in the Leafs' portion of Kessel's bonus (15% of $5 mil.)

Signing bonuses can be paid before or after July 1. See Bobby Ryan:

 

[oooooooooohCanada]

Doesn’t this tweet support everything I have been saying? That Toronto should have signed this deal months ago and that the Leafs gave in?

No GM in recent history has had such trouble signing their RFA. At the end of the day Nylander got his ask, Leafs didn’t want to go above $6.5 million and they relented at the last moment.

No because Nylander's ask wasn't 7m months ago. That wouldn't have made any sense as the two would have just met in the middle at 6.5m. The reports months ago were that he asked for 8m and the Lebrun is reporting that Dubas was offering 6m. So they ended up meeting in the middle at 7m essentially.