We are in phase 2 of the rebuild, next year we need to contend for the playoffs

[BonHoonLayneCornell]

Tkachuk- White- Duclair
Paul-Chlapik-Ryan
Balcers-Pageau-Boedker
Smith-Gibbons-UFA

Replace the 3 boat anchors with players worth their salary and that forward group would at least be fun to watch.

 

[Micklebot]

Tkachuk- White- Duclair
Paul-Chlapik-Ryan
Balcers-Pageau-Boedker
Smith-Gibbons-UFA

Replace the 3 boat anchors with players worth their salary and that forward group would at least be fun to watch.

I have no issues with Smith as a fourth liner other than salary. He is great on the PK and no where near as bad as some portray him. That 2nd line though is terrible

 

[God Says No]

I have no issues with Smith as a fourth liner other than salary. He is great on the PK and no where near as bad as some portray him. That 2nd line though is terrible

I disagree partially. I find him lazy 5 on 5 and makes a lot of mistakes. For some reason he becomes a beast on PK. If he is kept, his minutes should be scaled down 5 on 5. That's the only way I keep him.

 

[BonHoonLayneCornell]

I have no issues with Smith as a fourth liner other than salary. He is great on the PK and no where near as bad as some portray him. That 2nd line though is terrible

I'm not a fan of his, on the fourth line he's fine like many others, but he's a 1-2 mil player at best imo. If we replaced him with a player justifying the 3.5 mil or so he makes though, it would still theoretically improve the group.

 

[Sens of Anarchy]

Dorion doing his best Ted Knight (Judge Smails) Pucker hmm hmm hmm

I wonder if Randy Randy dropped by in the audience

 

[slamigo]

I disagree partially. I find him lazy 5 on 5 and makes a lot of mistakes. For some reason he becomes a beast on PK. If he is kept, his minutes should be scaled down 5 on 5. That's the only way I keep him.

Yup, I see many plays 5 on 5 where he is lazy and often takes his time getting back to the bench. That is my personal pet peeve and it tells you a lot about the character of a player when they selfishly saunter back to the bench at 1/4 speed.

 

[coladin]

Tkachuk- White- Duclair
Paul-Chlapik-Ryan
Balcers-Pageau-Boedker
Smith-Gibbons-UFA

Replace the 3 boat anchors with players worth their salary and that forward group would at least be fun to watch.

But then we might not tank. I would like to finish low, have the young guys improve and maybe add Acciari to that fourth line.

 

[Sens of Anarchy]

@ianmendes .. Hey Ian check out the poll votes. Disconnect? or would this be considered Bush League?

 

[Sens of Anarchy]

Tkachuk- White- Duclair
Paul-Chlapik-Ryan
Balcers-Pageau-Boedker
Smith-Gibbons-UFA

Replace the 3 boat anchors with players worth their salary and that forward group would at least be fun to watch.

Paul, Chlapik, Balcers ???
Boedker still here?
UFA should be in the top 6 imo.

 

[solidprospect]

It's not a rebuild!

 

[BonHoonLayneCornell]

Paul, Chlapik, Balcers ???
Boedker still here?
UFA should be in the top 6 imo.

I said fun to watch, not good. That group would still get eaten alive.

I would at least enjoy watching more if I weren't subjected to the anger inducing trio of overpaid vets.

 

[BonHoonLayneCornell]

But then we might not tank. I would like to finish low, have the young guys improve and maybe add Acciari to that fourth line.

Agreed. Just saying we have a fun group of youth, but being subjected to the veteran plugs unable to pull their weight detracts from it.

 

[salomonster]

Phase 2 will start when Eug' the Douche-tard buys out some of the dead weight on the team...

Just saying stuff like "we are now in the phase 2" is laughable...

He has no $.

 

[Knave]

You got to think in local context. Phase 2 LRT is now years behind schedule and the construction firms have missed multiple deadlines. We are in phase 2.

So yeah, we're right on track to compete in the playoffs next year... next year next year next year.

 

[coladin]

Agreed. Just saying we have a fun group of youth, but being subjected to the veteran plugs unable to pull their weight detracts from it.

I know he isn’t great by any stretch, but Boedker’s shocking lack of speed all year means he must have some sort of nagging abdominal injury. He was extremely slow which made him a sitting duck.

He is a vet, and too much youth could be even more detrimental.

 

[BonHoonLayneCornell]

I know he isn’t great by any stretch, but Boedker’s shocking lack of speed all year means he must have some sort of nagging abdominal injury. He was extremely slow which made him a sitting duck.

He is a vet, and too much youth could be even more detrimental.

I would prefer our Kids learn from Vets actually able to contribute out on the ice, but the only one left pulling their weight is Pageau, so we have no choice but to have "locker room" leaders instead.

I have to admit that while I really enjoy slagging him because my favorite player was traded for him and Boedker couldn't hold Hoff's jock, I don't really care either way since Boedker will be cast away sooner than later.

 

[JD1]

@ianmendes .. Hey Ian check out the poll votes. Disconnect? or would this be considered Bush League?

Disconnect...you think those poll votes are real? Seriously?

That'd be kinda of equivalent to polling a white supremecist group on their thoughts on immigration and passing off the results as real.

 

[Sens of Anarchy]

Disconnect...you think those poll votes are real? Seriously?

That'd be kinda of equivalent to polling a white supremecist group on their thoughts on immigration and passing off the results as real.

I think they are lopsided enough to warrant a wider poll. I wasn't suggesting he pass on the results. If this poll happened on a wider sample of fans thru TSN 1200 as an example; Do you think the results would be a lot closer? What percentage of people do you think would agree with Dorion's assessment of where the team is at regarding competing for a playoff spot next year , and competing in the playoffs the following year.

I personally have lost faith in Dorion's ability to properly assess where the team is at. That is a direct cause of where we are now.

 

[Sen sational]

If you look at a rebuild as selling off all the pieces and starting fresh then the TDL was the end of phase 1, with amassing picks being the goal. The Sens are slightly ahead as they have an elite D in Chabot, 2 very good PMD in Brannstrom and Wolanin, a 5 D in Jaros, a top 6 F in Tkachuk, and a 2C or 2F in White.

The Sens are ahead in that they took pieces that are in their 20s who have had at least 1 year playing against men: Duclair (if he has finally figured it out); Davidsson; Abramov; Verroneau; Balcers. Not clear if they can become great 3rd liners, let alone 2nd, but they have potential.

Batherson is a 2nd line F who should become a 1st. If Brown stays healthy he is a 2C who could become a 1C. Brown needs more time in AHL. Norris, if he leaves school, will be at least 1 year in AHL.

Most successful rebuilds include a few top 5 draft picks, with at least 1 top 2 OA. 2020 and 2021 are the only years we have more than the usual top end picks. They won’t be ready until 2023, 2024.

Unless they get into the UFA market to fill holes it is hard to see the team being really successful in the playoffs until 2023. Making the playoffs seems possible in 2021.

 

[JD1]

I think they are lopsided enough to warrant a wider poll. I wasn't suggesting he pass on the results. If this poll happened on a wider sample of fans thru TSN 1200 as an example; Do you think the results would be a lot closer? What percentage of people do you think would agree with Dorion's assessment of where the team is at regarding competing for a playoff spot next year , and competing in the playoffs the following year.

I personally have lost faith in Dorion's ability to properly assess where the team is at. That is a direct cause of where we are now.

Looking back i somewhat think the trigger on the Duchene acquisition was wanting to do something for Karlsson and not wanting to extend Turris. That clearly did not pan out and in fact it collapsed really quickly. We were done 20 games after the Duchene acquisition when he didn't come in "hot"

Once that collapse happened reading the tea leaves on needing to rebuild in February of 18 was to me the correct read and i suspect in part driven by the belief Karlsson would not sign.

There's lots here that says we are 5 plus years from conpeting. I don't buy that and recent NHL data does not support that. Look at any recent data on the age of forwards in their primes. We are going to have a whack of guys entering their statistical primes by the 2020 season. Are guys like Brown and Batherson going to be legit top 6 players in the NHL? You seem to live close enough that you get to see Belleville games. What do you believe? If you believe that talent like Batherson, Abramov, Brown, Balcers, Chaplik are going to be quality NHL players, post 05 lockout data says their best statistical years will be 2020 - 25. Those guys are complimenting by guys like White and Tkachuk that will also be in or entering their primes.

Then you have the D with Chabot who is / will be a superstar. Wolanin who you personally believe is a top 4. Brannstrom who is clearly going to be a quality PMD.

I don't have any issue at all with PD saying competing, in, competing while in because that aligns 100% with what the data says about peak performance of NHL players post lockout.

The question for me is more related to the quality of the talent we have. If he is correct that the players i mentioned, and i didn't mention guys like Formenton, Veronneau and Norris, are / will be NHL players, then his statements on contending align.

I guess the question comes down to me more about the talent assessment. Is it accurate? Assessing talent is PD's strength and the various talking heads seem to be supporting the view that we have a wideand deep pool.

As for polls, ask any biased crowd a question and you'll get a biased result.

 

[Mr Hat]

Looking back i somewhat think the trigger on the Duchene acquisition was wanting to do something for Karlsson and not wanting to extend Turris. That clearly did not pan out and in fact it collapsed really quickly. We were done 20 games after the Duchene acquisition when he didn't come in "hot"

Once that collapse happened reading the tea leaves on needing to rebuild in February of 18 was to me the correct read and i suspect in part driven by the belief Karlsson would not sign.

There's lots here that says we are 5 plus years from conpeting. I don't buy that and recent NHL data does not support that. Look at any recent data on the age of forwards in their primes. We are going to have a whack of guys entering their statistical primes by the 2020 season. Are guys like Brown and Batherson going to be legit top 6 players in the NHL? You seem to live close enough that you get to see Belleville games. What do you believe? If you believe that talent like Batherson, Abramov, Brown, Balcers, Chaplik are going to be quality NHL players, post 05 lockout data says their best statistical years will be 2020 - 25. Those guys are complimenting by guys like White and Tkachuk that will also be in or entering their primes.

Then you have the D with Chabot who is / will be a superstar. Wolanin who you personally believe is a top 4. Brannstrom who is clearly going to be a quality PMD.

I don't have any issue at all with PD saying competing, in, competing while in because that aligns 100% with what the data says about peak performance of NHL players post lockout.

The question for me is more related to the quality of the talent we have. If he is correct that the players i mentioned, and i didn't mention guys like Formenton, Veronneau and Norris, are / will be NHL players, then his statements on contending align.

I guess the question comes down to me more about the talent assessment. Is it accurate? Assessing talent is PD's strength and the various talking heads seem to be supporting the view that we have a wideand deep pool.

As for polls, ask any biased crowd a question and you'll get a biased result.

Do you have any evidence to support we traded for Duchene to appease Karlsson?

Here is a direct quote from GMPD the day after the trade.

“We feel we got an elite player and someone that helps us to win right now and we’re on the path to win right now.”

Assessing anything but draft talent is not PDs strength. That much is obvious to most and you have no real argument in your lengthy response to SOA. Just pure speculation.

There is no excuse for our flip flop to win now and rebuild. It's incompetence that we gave up the top lottery pick in a rebuild.

 

[Sens of Anarchy]

Looking back i somewhat think the trigger on the Duchene acquisition was wanting to do something for Karlsson and not wanting to extend Turris. That clearly did not pan out and in fact it collapsed really quickly. We were done 20 games after the Duchene acquisition when he didn't come in "hot"

Once that collapse happened reading the tea leaves on needing to rebuild in February of 18 was to me the correct read and i suspect in part driven by the belief Karlsson would not sign.

There's lots here that says we are 5 plus years from conpeting. I don't buy that and recent NHL data does not support that. Look at any recent data on the age of forwards in their primes. We are going to have a whack of guys entering their statistical primes by the 2020 season. Are guys like Brown and Batherson going to be legit top 6 players in the NHL? You seem to live close enough that you get to see Belleville games. What do you believe? If you believe that talent like Batherson, Abramov, Brown, Balcers, Chaplik are going to be quality NHL players, post 05 lockout data says their best statistical years will be 2020 - 25. Those guys are complimenting by guys like White and Tkachuk that will also be in or entering their primes.

Then you have the D with Chabot who is / will be a superstar. Wolanin who you personally believe is a top 4. Brannstrom who is clearly going to be a quality PMD.

I don't have any issue at all with PD saying competing, in, competing while in because that aligns 100% with what the data says about peak performance of NHL players post lockout.

The question for me is more related to the quality of the talent we have. If he is correct that the players i mentioned, and i didn't mention guys like Formenton, Veronneau and Norris, are / will be NHL players, then his statements on contending align.

I guess the question comes down to me more about the talent assessment. Is it accurate? Assessing talent is PD's strength and the various talking heads seem to be supporting the view that we have a wideand deep pool.

As for polls, ask any biased crowd a question and you'll get a biased result.

1. Was the collapse a blip in the assessment that we were playoff contenders due to Karlsson's injury and the disruption in the room and perhaps coaching? Weeks after you assess the team as being a contender .. and slumping bad, you conclude you now need a full on rebuild? That kind of 180 is very very strange to me.

2. The talent we have; without going into a length breakdown , evaluating where the players are; I am going just say that we have a very deep pool of potential NHL players but not a deep pool of high end NHL players. Further I think development of some will be stunted or slowed by not having quality veterans to learn from. I think that will apply more to some than to others. I think our top prospects in Belleville are closer to two years away from making a name for themselves in the NHL. In two years they will be able to hold their own, but will not emerge as impact players yet. New talent will arrive but 95+% of young players need some mentors to play with that they can learn from. I am not talking about chopping at the puck to put it off the glass.. or dumping it in from center and chasing it down. On defense I think it was a big mistake not to get a decent vet that can help insulate the young D.. Ceci and Boro are not the answer for that. Example: Lajoie. We still need that. We also need it at forward .. Stone was awesome for White especially. Tkachuk brings that break down the barn door game and he is good at it. I am advocating for a top 6 forward and a top 4 D being added for that purpose.

I think next year will be a tough year no where close to a playoff spot which is good for the rebuild regarding draft position. I'll leave my predictions there for now, and reassess when, if anything changes.

 

[FolignoQuantumLeap]

But then we might not tank. I would like to finish low, have the young guys improve and maybe add Acciari to that fourth line.

Might not tank? That's the worst group of forwards in the NHL. That is absolutely a tanking roster. Replacing those three helps but we're lacking so much talent. Unless Brown and Batherson become PPG forwards a rookies, we're still a basement dweller.

 

[Mark Stones Spleen]

I avoided this thread because I thought the title was the opinion of the OP, and I thought it was beyond stupid.

f*** me if we try contending without picking up another top pick, especially in our division of hell.

 

[supsens]

Clearly Dorion should have said all the players suck and noone is expected to try and compete. He then should have stated that there is no hope withe the current group and they are expected to sit on their asses and do nothing untill other guys show up and do it for them.