Was Vinny Lecavalier's career a slight disappointment?

[Artorius Horus T]

Was it? - a slight disappointment? - 1998 first overall pick.

He did had a good career, 400+goals, 1200+ games, 900+ points
won the Rocket once in his career, 2004 Stanley Cup champion
World Cup gold medal winner.

But also,...
Career +/- -140, his 0.78 ppg is good, but is it great?, for 1st overall pick.

Really never shined in the play-offs. Compared to his team mates,
there were always more than one better in his team in multiple play-offs,
Brad Richards,Marty St.Louis,Ruslan Fedotenko,Fredrik Modin,
Paul Ranger,Dan Boyle...

He is 3rd or probably 4th best player from the 98 draft
Pavel Datsyuk&Brad Richards, 1st and 2nd best.

Now, i wan't to clear something, slight disappointment does not = bust

Click to read more...

 

[Michael Farkas]

Really never shined in the play-offs

What's this now?

Then you listed Paul Ranger...? Ranger did nothing.

 

[sr edler]

Ranger had mystique though.

That goes a long way.

 

[GlitchMarner]

At his best he was very good, but it took him a long time to hit his peak and unfortunately he didn't maintain it very long. The Cooke hit obviously didn't help his career.

I don't know if you can put too much stock in his career plus/minus. He played on some absolutely brutal teams early on and the Lightning generally weren't very good outside of 2010-2011 in his final seasons with the team.

Overall, I guess you can say his career is somewhat disappointing in relation to the hype and his pure talent.

 

[Michael Farkas]

Original Six mystique, no less...that's like 2.3x "star power" points I believe...

 

[Nick Hansen]

He didn't become the Michael Jordan of hockey, that's for sure.

 

[The Macho King]

He didn't become the Michael Jordan of hockey, that's for sure.

I mean, maybe they were thinking his baseball career?

 

[Filthy Dangles]

My man mentioned Paul Ranger with those other guys . This is literally the only thing I can recall him doing in the NHL. Damn shame he didn't score.

 

[jj cale]

I thought so, he never did turn into that player I thought he would be given his size/skill level aside from one short period of time where he was that type of player.

He left me wanting for a lot of his career

 

[MadLuke]

Could even say a big disappointment for some (with how high is 16 year's old 102 point in 64 games was rate by some and what always felt like a bit of over hyping, than an equivalent non-Canadian prospect would have probably not had).

Only 2 top 10 in points, a prime of what 8 season that ended at 30 year's old.

Is it not related to a significant Wrist/Hand injury ?

 

[The Panther]

Great career overall, but yes he was a bit disappointing. In the first place, it took him longer than it should have to make his mark. He was nothing special until his fifth season, which is a slower development than you'd expect for a player of his size. And then after his two fabulous seasons (2006-07, 2007-08) he was never the same again. Those two years, he was only 10 points off leading the whole League in scoring, and places 3rd overall to Thornton and Ovechkin.

He contributed a lot to the '04 Cup win and again he was great in the 2011 playoffs, but after spring 2007 he was never again an elite player, but for little dribs and drabs (and the '11 playoff run).

With low expectations, we'd look at his career as a huge success, but given the expectations he had as a 1st overall who did show elite ability for a few years, it has to be a bit disappointing in the final analysis.

 

[GlitchMarner]

Could even say a big disappointment for some (with how high is 16 year's old 102 point in 64 games was rate by some and what always felt like a bit of over hyping, than an equivalent non-Canadian prospect would have probably not had).

Only 2 top 10 in points, a prime of what 8 season that ended at 30 year's old.

Is it not related to a significant Wrist/Hand injury ?

I don't think it's that big a deal that he only finished in the top ten in points twice. So did Sundin, but Sundin was consistently a high-level scorer regardless, with six top 15 scoring finishes, eight top 20 scoring finishes and 12 top 30 scoring finishes.

The bigger problem is how much of a drop-off there is between Vinny's best two seasons and his other ones. I haven't looked, but I doubt he was even a top 20 or top 30 scorer very often.

 

[Hockey Outsider]

The bigger problem is how much of a drop-off there is between Vinny's best two seasons and his other ones. I haven't looked, but I doubt he was even a top 20 or top 30 scorer very often.

That's the issue. He finished 3rd and 6th in scoring at his peak. Then he was only in the top 30 three more times in his career (17th in 2003, 27th in 2004, 26th in 2010). To put that into context, those five top-30 finishes are as many as Mike Ribeiro, and fewer than Doug Weight, Ray Whitney and Jason Spezza.

 

[Normand Lacombe]

I don't think it's that big a deal that he only finished in the top ten in points twice. So did Sundin, but Sundin was consistently a high-level scorer regardless, with six top 15 scoring finishes, eight top 20 scoring finishes and 12 top 30 scoring finishes.

The bigger problem is how much of a drop-off there is between Vinny's best two seasons and his other ones. I haven't looked, but I doubt he was even a top 20 or top 30 scorer very often.

For Lecavlier's career, he finished in the top 20 in scoring only three times.

 

[MadLuke]

I don't think it's that big a deal that he only finished in the top ten in points twice. So did Sundin, but Sundin was consistently a high-level scorer regardless, with six top 15 scoring finishes, eight top 20 scoring finishes and 12 top 30 scoring finishes.

The bigger problem is how much of a drop-off there is between Vinny's best two seasons and his other ones. I haven't looked, but I doubt he was even a top 20 or top 30 scorer very often.

That's the issue. He finished 3rd and 6th in scoring at his peak. Then he was only in the top 30 three more times in his career (17th in 2003, 27th in 2004, 26th in 2010).

Yeah you are right, 2 top 10 isn't that bad even relative to the expectation (if we remove the hyperhype).

2 top 10 is the same has Shanahan, Turgeon, Lafontaine, Sundin, Hossa, Mogilny, D.Sedin, Staal, Zetterberg, that had great career.

The number of top 20/25/30 is the much bigger issue here add 4 more of them there and he would have not been a disappointement.

 

[Artorius Horus T]

What's this now?

Then you listed Paul Ranger...? Ranger did nothing.

Well...at one play-offs Paul Ranger had 6 points, where Vinny had only 4...

 

[Artorius Horus T]

Great career overall, but yes he was a bit disappointing. In the first place, it took him longer than it should have to make his mark. He was nothing special until his fifth season, which is a slower development than you'd expect for a player of his size. And then after his two fabulous seasons (2006-07, 2007-08) he was never the same again. Those two years, he was only 10 points off leading the whole League in scoring, and places 3rd overall to Thornton and Ovechkin.

He contributed a lot to the '04 Cup win and again he was great in the 2011 playoffs, but after spring 2007 he was never again an elite player, but for little dribs and drabs (and the '11 playoff run).

With low expectations, we'd look at his career as a huge success, but given the expectations he had as a 1st overall who did show elite ability for a few years, it has to be a bit disappointing in the final analysis.

I wouldn't say a lot, players like Richards, St.Louis, Fedotenko, Modin... those contributed a lot
Yes Vinny did score quite many points, but...when compared to his team mates and to other players in those play-offs...
wasn't really that special in that Stanley Cup run.

And what comes to his 2011 play-offs...there were sill two better lightning players. . It was almost always like that thou
there were always better players in his team and in the NHL.

 

[GMR]

Not disappointing at all. What percentage of first overall picks put up better career numbers? Less than half for sure.

 

[bobholly39]

He certainly didn't live up to the hype, so yes disappointing in that sense.

But it's still a great career overall. He probably won't make the Hall of Fame - but it's not completely unrealistic to suggest he could have a shot. Anyway you slice that, that's a pretty great career.

 

[sr edler]

Not disappointing at all. What percentage of first overall picks put up better career numbers? Less than half for sure.

Not every 1st overall pick is the same, when it comes to expectations, so you can't blanket compare them all like that. Lemieux was more hyped than Joe Murphy and Wendel Clark. Lindros was probably a bit more hyped than Štefan. Crosby was probably slightly more hyped than Nugent-Hopkins. McDavid was a little more hyped than Yakupov. And when it comes to players being disappointments, junior track records and hype matters, a lot. What you do in juniors is kinda the whole point of the whole hype.

I'm not a draft nerd, at all, but from what I understand Lecavalier was pretty hyped. Not Lemieux, Lindros, Crosby, McDavid hyped, but still pretty hyped. I don't know where that whole Michael Jordan of Hockey thing came from, but it sounds like some bar to clear at least. Lecavalier being a tall big-bodied, clean-cut, good looking, nice going good old Canadian boy probably had something to do with it, along with his numbers of course.

 

[sr edler]

My man mentioned Paul Ranger with those other guys . This is literally the only thing I can recall him doing in the NHL. Damn shame he didn't score.

Was this in the pre-season or in a game that actually mattered? ^ That's more Omark than Omark himself.

 

[Michael Farkas]

Preseason, IIRC...

 

[Filthy Dangles]

Was this in the pre-season or in a game that actually mattered? ^ That's more Omark than Omark himself.

Preseason. Enroth didnt' take too kind to it.

 

[vadim sharifijanov]

tbh, after watching his first few years the career he ended up having surprised me in how good it was.

i did not see him having a long career ahead of him, and certainly not peaking as a legit superstar for a few years.

1,200 games, 950 points, a rocket, and 100 points were all beyond my wildest expectations for him. esp compared to young thornton, who looked lost too but you knew he had it in him. young vinny, i didn’t at all.

 

[MadLuke]

There is truth that deception wise, in is era he look really good:

2009 NHL Entry	New York Islanders	John Tavares	London (OHL)
2008 NHL Entry	Tampa Bay Lightning	Steven Stamkos	Sarnia (OHL)
2007 NHL Entry	Chicago Blackhawks	Patrick Kane	London (OHL)
2006 NHL Entry	St. Louis Blues	Erik Johnson	U.S. National U-18 (USNTDP)
2005 NHL Entry	Pittsburgh Penguins	Sidney Crosby	Rimouski (QMJHL)
2004 NHL Entry	Washington Capitals	Alex Ovechkin	Dynamo Moscow (Russia)
2003 NHL Entry	Pittsburgh Penguins	Marc-Andre Fleury	Cape Breton (QMJHL)
2002 NHL Entry	Columbus Blue Jackets	Rick Nash	London (OHL)
2001 NHL Entry	Atlanta Thrashers	Ilya Kovalchuk	Spartak Moscow (KHL)
2000 NHL Entry	New York Islanders	Rick DiPietro	Boston University (H-East)
1999 NHL Entry	Atlanta Thrashers	Patrik Stefan	Long Beach (IHL)
1998 NHL Entry	Tampa Bay Lightning	Vincent Lecavalier	Rimouski (QMJHL)
1997 NHL Entry	Boston Bruins	Joe Thornton	Sault Ste. Marie (OHL)
1996 NHL Entry	Ottawa Senators	Chris Phillips	Prince Albert (WHL)
1995 NHL Entry	Ottawa Senators	Bryan Berard	Detroit (OHL)
1994 NHL Entry	Florida Panthers	Ed Jovanovski	Windsor (OHL)
1993 NHL Entry	Ottawa Senators	Alexandre Daigle	Victoriaville (QMJHL)
1992 NHL Entry	Tampa Bay Lightning	Roman Hamrlik	ZPS Zlin (Czech)
1991 NHL Entry	Quebec Nordiques	Eric Lindros	Oshawa (OHL)
1990 NHL Entry	Quebec Nordiques	Owen Nolan	Cornwall (OHL)
1989 NHL Entry	Quebec Nordiques	Mats Sundin	Nacka (Sweden)
1988 NHL Entry	Minnesota North Stars	Mike Modano	Prince Albert (WHL)
1987 NHL Entry	Buffalo Sabres	Pierre Turgeon	Granby (QMJHL)

[TBODY] [/TBODY]

Between Lindros and Kovalchuck, the success rate was not spectacular, enough that the criteria could became, if you achieve to play a lot of season in a relevant role (top 4 D, top 6 F, number 1 goaltender) that more than good enough to not be a bad first pick overall.

There is only Thorton clearly above him during that 9 year's spam.