Proposal: Voracek to Boston (3 way)

[Merrrlin]

My first time, be gentle!

Boston In (7m)
Voracek ($1.25 retained)
Boston Out (7.4)
Grzelcyk
Bos 1st 2020
Backes

Philly In (7.4)
Backes
Grzelcyk
Bos 1st 2020
Ottawa 4th 2020
Philly Out (8.15)
Voracek
Hagg


Ottawa In(1.15)
Hagg
Ottawa Out (0.0)
4th round 2020


Boston gets the right winger with a left shot they've been lacking for years. Voracek can score, can defend, and can dish. They deal an upcoming salary on defence, which their depth can absorb. With Backes gone, one of the internal replacements gets a shot on an ELC. Problems don't start for 2 years when Voracek is still on the books (unlike Backes), but that 2 year period should provide 2 cup favourites while the Bergeron line is peaking. Retention on the salary brings it down to a reasonable 7m, which is about as good as you will get for a player with that pedigree (1 year removed from 85 point campaign).

Philly moves on from Voracek's deal, and takes on the shorter Backes contract, while adding a good young defender. Gryz can grow with Sanheim/Myers/Provorov, giving them one of the nicest potential top 4s in hockey. They move out salary in Hagg to make it work. Backes, while overpaid, plays a hardnosed game still and adds a little depth to the C position where Patrick is still struggling to stabalize himself. Extra 1st (even if it's low) helps build on the fly and prepare for the rise of Philly's many high end young players. Opens up salary in the long term for UFA signings to augment their core as it grows up.

Ottawa gives up a pick for a signable LD who can step in admirably while Brannstrom develops down on the farm. Should be an easy re-sign, but could also be a trade piece that many teams would be interested in at the deadline at just over 1m caphit.

Click to read more...

 

[Llamamoto]

You make it sound like Voracek is a cap dump. This is awful for Philly.

 

[HockeyDBspecialist]

You make it sound like Voracek is a cap dump. This is awful for Philly.

2019-20		$8,250,000	$8,250,000	$0	$2,000,000	$7,250,000	$9,250,000	$9,250,000
2020-21		$8,250,000	$8,250,000	$0	$4,000,000	$2,250,000	$6,250,000	$6,250,000
2021-22		$8,250,000	$8,250,000	$0	$0	$7,500,000	$7,500,000	$7,500,000
2022-23		$8,250,000	$8,250,000	$0	$5,000,000	$1,250,000	$6,250,000	$6,250,000
2023-24		$8,250,000	$8,250,000	$0	$0	$7,500,000	$7,500,000	$7,500,000

[TBODY] [/TBODY]

he kinda is

 

[Merrrlin]

You make it sound like Voracek is a cap dump. This is awful for Philly.

?

Grzelcyk is an awesome pick up, and they get a 1st as well. I think that's a decent return for a 70 point winger who's 8.25/yr contract ends at age 35. Gives Philly salary space, a signable top 4 D and a 1st just in time for their core to start turning over.

This pushes contention down the road a couple years but I think a couple years fits better with Philly's window anyways, and they pick up a defenceman who would be very hard to acquire otherwise. Not many contenders will have a way to fit a 30yr old 8.25m winger, even if he is a great player.

 

[super6646]

“Be gentle”

Hf: f*** that shit. Worst proposal EVER

 

[Merrrlin]

“Be gentle”

Hf: **** that ****. Worst proposal EVER

Haha I can take it

 

[Lo97]

My first time, be gentle!

Boston In (7m)
Voracek ($1.25 retained)
Boston Out (7.4)
Grzelcyk
Bos 1st 2020
Backes

Philly In (7.4)
Backes
Grzelcyk
Bos 1st 2020
Ottawa 4th 2020
Philly Out (8.15)
Voracek
Hagg


Ottawa In(1.15)
Hagg
Ottawa Out (0.0)
4th round 2020


Boston gets the right winger with a left shot they've been lacking for years. Voracek can score, can defend, and can dish. They deal an upcoming salary on defence, which their depth can absorb. With Backes gone, one of the internal replacements gets a shot on an ELC. Problems don't start for 2 years when Voracek is still on the books (unlike Backes), but that 2 year period should provide 2 cup favourites while the Bergeron line is peaking. Retention on the salary brings it down to a reasonable 7m, which is about as good as you will get for a player with that pedigree (1 year removed from 85 point campaign).

Philly moves on from Voracek's deal, and takes on the shorter Backes contract, while adding a good young defender. Gryz can grow with Sanheim/Myers/Provorov, giving them one of the nicest potential top 4s in hockey. They move out salary in Hagg to make it work. Backes, while overpaid, plays a hardnosed game still and adds a little depth to the C position where Patrick is still struggling to stabalize himself. Extra 1st (even if it's low) helps build on the fly and prepare for the rise of Philly's many high end young players. Opens up salary in the long term for UFA signings to augment their core as it grows up.

Ottawa gives up a pick for a signable LD who can step in admirably while Brannstrom develops down on the farm. Should be an easy re-sign, but could also be a trade piece that many teams would be interested in at the deadline at just over 1m caphit.

This Boston fan would like to know where to sign! I would do this in a heartbeat.

 

[Djp]

You cant take Backas back and have them retain.

this really isnt a 3 way. These are 2 separate deals

 

[Captain Mountain]

?

Grzelcyk is an awesome pick up, and they get a 1st as well. I think that's a decent return for a 70 point winger who's 8.25/yr contract ends at age 35. Gives Philly salary space, a signable top 4 D and a 1st just in time for their core to start turning over.

This pushes contention down the road a couple years but I think a couple years fits better with Philly's window anyways, and they pick up a defenceman who would be very hard to acquire otherwise. Not many contenders will have a way to fit a 30yr old 8.25m winger, even if he is a great player.

It's likely a late 1st, which isn't that valuable.

It also just doesn't make sense for Philly. They don't really need sign-able top-4 D. There's an expansion draft coming up and they have Provorov, Ghostisbehere and Sanheim to protect (maybe Myers too if he can progress). They also have to eat Backes' contract AND retain on Voracek.

Honestly, it looks like you forgot about Ghostisbehere. It looks like this really only serves Boston's needs (Melnyk isn't going to pay money for a player Ottawa doesn't need in a rebuild for only a 4th).

 

[Merrrlin]

It's likely a late 1st, which isn't that valuable.

It also just doesn't make sense for Philly. They don't really need sign-able top-4 D. There's an expansion draft coming up and they have Provorov, Ghostisbehere and Sanheim to protect (maybe Myers too if he can progress). They also have to eat Backes' contract AND retain on Voracek.

Honestly, it looks like you forgot about Ghostisbehere. It looks like this really only serves Boston's needs (Melnyk isn't going to pay money for a player Ottawa doesn't need in a rebuild for only a 4th).

I think Gryz replaces Ghost, is more like Sanheim (better 2 way game) and makes Ghost a tradeable asset.

I don't see the point in holding on to Voracek during his late prime and into his retirement years, and I don't think there is a better option out there for trading than Boston. I suppose they could go for Carlo instead but personally I target Gryz and possibly try to get another asset out of it.

 

[Captain Mountain]

I think Gryz replaces Ghost, is more like Sanheim (better 2 way game) and makes Ghost a tradeable asset.

I don't see the point in holding on to Voracek during his late prime and into his retirement years, and I don't think there is a better option out there for trading than Boston. I suppose they could go for Carlo instead but personally I target Gryz and possibly try to get another asset out of it.

Honestly, if Sanheim and Provorov aren't filling the young, two-way game quota for Philly, they have issues. And if it requires that have to (or should) trade Ghostisbehere from a situation of weakness, taking on Backes AND retaining on Voracek, they are significantly better off just not trading Voracek.

The point of hanging onto Voracek is that he's a good player. But if they really wanted to trade him, I'm sure there are teams out there that can beat that offer (if not need).

 

[Merrrlin]

Honestly, if Sanheim and Provorov aren't filling the young, two-way game quota for Philly, they have issues. And if it requires that have to (or should) trade Ghostisbehere from a situation of weakness, taking on Backes AND retaining on Voracek, they are significantly better off just not trading Voracek.

The point of hanging onto Voracek is that he's a good player. But if they really wanted to trade him, I'm sure there are teams out there that can beat that offer (if not need).

Disagree, but it's all a pipe dream either way. I don't think Voracek's contract looks as nice to GMs as it does to us regular joes, and I think Gryz is worth a top 6 winger on a good contract too, no problem. Philly could probably get another asset but I think getting a good young D would really solidfy that d core for the future. I've always been kind of low on Ghost, though.

 

[Captain Mountain]

Disagree, but it's all a pipe dream either way. I don't think Voracek's contract looks as nice to GMs as it does to us regular joes, and I think Gryz is worth a top 6 winger on a good contract too, no problem. Philly could probably get another asset but I think getting a good young D would really solidfy that d core for the future. I've always been kind of low on Ghost, though.

Future in this case meaning this season and next, since they'd probably lose him in the expansion draft.

And the issue is taking on Backes AND the retention on Voracek's contract. Asking any team retain money for 5 years is a big ask, especially when they're giving up the best piece and taking back the worst one.

Is Voracek's contract good? No. But guess who's not going to be bothered by it any time soon? Philly.

 

[Merrrlin]

Future in this case meaning this season and next, since they'd probably lose him in the expansion draft.

And the issue is taking on Backes AND the retention on Voracek's contract. Asking any team retain money for 5 years is a big ask, especially when they're giving up the best piece and taking back the worst one.

Is Voracek's contract good? No. But guess who's not going to be bothered by it any time soon? Philly.

That's fair.

I probably didn't come up with the best deal, but I still think they should be good partners if Philly wants to shed some older players for assets in the next year or 2. Maybe remove retention and add a piece? Krecji's contract runs out when most of Boston is up for their post-bridge, so it may work.

 

[Captain Mountain]

That's fair.

I probably didn't come up with the best deal, but I still think they should be good partners if Philly wants to shed some older players for assets in the next year or 2. Maybe remove retention and add a piece? Krecji's contract runs out when most of Boston is up for their post-bridge, so it may work.

I don't think Philly needs Grzelcyk (it seems to be based on the premise that Provorov and Sanheim are an insufficient number of young, LH, 2-way D and Ghostisbehere isn't good, all of which I'd disagree with), but even if they did need him, they shouldn't have to add any piece of significance if they're taking on Backes.

 

[StoneHands]

Voracek is a little overpaid and will be for the duration of the contract but he's still a good player and taking back Backes means we really only shed Voracek's salary for the last 3 years. Getting back a late 1st and a 3rd pairing defenseman they don't need is not enough to make it worth losing one of their best players.

 

[Dooble08]

2019-20		$8,250,000	$8,250,000	$0	$2,000,000	$7,250,000	$9,250,000	$9,250,000
2020-21		$8,250,000	$8,250,000	$0	$4,000,000	$2,250,000	$6,250,000	$6,250,000
2021-22		$8,250,000	$8,250,000	$0	$0	$7,500,000	$7,500,000	$7,500,000
2022-23		$8,250,000	$8,250,000	$0	$5,000,000	$1,250,000	$6,250,000	$6,250,000
2023-24		$8,250,000	$8,250,000	$0	$0	$7,500,000	$7,500,000	$7,500,000

[TBODY] [/TBODY]

he kinda is

So apparently guys who score 65 points per season are cap dumps now. Ok

 

[Curufinwe]

Flyers ownership & management will keep pushing hard to make the playoffs this season unless they end up way out of it at the deadline.

 

[innitfam]

Philly gets completely destroyed. Voracek is still a great player. Backes was scratched during Game 7 of the SCF. Gryzelck and a late 1st is nowhere close to making up that difference. And the Flyers retain on Voracek too, and trade Hagg too for seemingly no reason?

Boston makes out like bandits, unloading an albatross contract and picking up a vastly superior player, as well as having salary retained. All for the cost of Gryzelck and a 1st. Backes is deadweight.

Also, I see no reason at all for Ottawa to be involved in this deal.

 

[Dooble08]

I'm not opposed to trading Voracek and trading Hagg would be a godsend. I just don't really like the return. Backes is really a non-starter (the 1st doesn't really even it out either). Then while Voracek for Grzelcyk may be a fair deal, it overcrowds our defense while weakening us at RW. If we trade Hagg, I'd rather call up Myers or just allow Morin to play. Plus it creates a problem for the Seattle draft.

 

[Merrrlin]

I'm not opposed to trading Voracek and trading Hagg would be a godsend. I just don't really like the return. Backes is really a non-starter (the 1st doesn't really even it out either). Then while Voracek for Grzelcyk may be a fair deal, it overcrowds our defense while weakening us at RW. If we trade Hagg, I'd rather call up Myers or just allow Morin to play. Plus it creates a problem for the Seattle draft.

Ya, I didn't take that into account.

Probably not a good fit, but I still really like the idea of Voracek-Krecji for Boston. Philly might rather go after a top young winger, though. Something Boston can't spare.

 

[Qward]

Why is Ottawa involved in this discussion?

 

[Tripod]

It's just not well thought out.

-Jake in his "bad" years is a 60+ point winger. In his good years, is an 80 point one.

-Retention of 1.25...means this year and next year, Backes is essentially being paid 7.25 for Philly...while Jake is 7 million for Boston

-and then there is Backes himself as a cap dump, now at 7.25 million...and no compensation for taking him

-Flyers lose their highest scoring RW...all for a cap dump, a late 1st and a swap out of LHD when then already have Provy, Sanheim and Ghost.

-The Flyers did not sign Hayes and trade for Niskanen and Braun, only to sell off their top scoring RWer for a pick

 

[Merrrlin]

It's just not well thought out.

-Jake in his "bad" years is a 60+ point winger. In his good years, is an 80 point one.

-Retention of 1.25...means this year and next year, Backes is essentially being paid 7.25 for Philly...while Jake is 7 million for Boston

-and then there is Backes himself as a cap dump, now at 7.25 million...and no compensation for taking him

-Flyers lose their highest scoring RW...all for a cap dump, a late 1st and a swap out of LHD when then already have Provy, Sanheim and Ghost.

-The Flyers did not sign Hayes and trade for Niskanen and Braun, only to sell off their top scoring RWer for a pick

Ya it's pretty bad.

 

[Hunter368]

I think we can call this thread done.