Blue Jays Discussion: Vlad Jr wait/watch II: Watch Harder

[phillipmike]

If his value is that low and we are eating that much why not just keep him? He's a good vet for the kids to show them the way, could play C, backup C, 3b, Ss and if he has a good season you probably get more at the trade deadline. Maybe the 25 man roster is tight?

Before this move you had to make a 40 man roster move for Phelps. I guess there is little urgency now.

Someone mentioned playing time for Jansen, but also an opportunity for him to win a WS. It’s a favour as well, I’m sure.

And this 100%. Martin has been the ultimate professional and teammate and i would be very glad to pay that money and get what we got back to give him a better chance of winning a world series. Just a class act. The return was never going to be good for at best a 1b catcher/backup.

 

[Woodman19]

Before this move you had to make a 40 man roster move for Phelps. I guess there is little urgency now.



And this 100%. Martin has been the ultimate professional and teammate and i would be very glad to pay that money and get what we got back to give him a better chance of winning a world series. Just a class act. The return was never going to be good for at best a 1b catcher/backup.

3B/SS/C and manager*

 

[phillipmike]

3B/SS/C and manager*

He was a great Mr. Manager.

 

[ryno23]

I will give props to Shatkins for getting Rogers to eat money on Martin as they had no place to play him and they got back some warm bodies who may or may not make it but could be flipped down the line as filler in other deals.

Rogers has stepped up by eat salary on Tulo and Martin. Now the books will be clear of all monies coming up next season and they can start to add talent around the kids.

 

[dredeye]

Can’t say I’m happy about the return if we’re eating that much salary. Man the jays are paying like 35 million for two players to play elsewhere crazy

 

[phillipmike]

Its funny - our infield depth earlier in the off-season went from;

Vlad
Gurriel
Travis
Diaz
Drury
Urena
Tulo
Solarte
Martin

To

Vlad
Gurriel
Travis
Drury
Urena

Went from 9ish guys for 5 spots to 5ish guys (4 if you dont count Vlad yet) for 5 spots. I wouldnt be surprised if the Jays added another middle infielder as Vlad wont start the season with the Jays. Need someone on a 1 year deal; a guy like a Asdrubal Cabrera, Forsythe, Harrison or Iglesias would be nice but i doubt we have enough playing time to get them. A Freddy Galvis, Alcides Escobar or even Solarte might have to be the aims.

Jays are still currently starting vets at 6 of their 9 starting spots. The team is younger but still had leadership;

C: Jansen
1B: Smoak
2B: Travis
SS: Gurriel
3B: Drury
RF: Grichuk
CF: Pillar
LF: McKinney
DH: Morales

The number could easily go down to 1-2. Smoak, Travis, Drury, Pillar and Morales all can be moved or moved off their starting spots for someone in the system.

 

[deletethis]

Those players aren't nothing. Then again, LA is actually going to use Martin.

 

[phillipmike]

Brito just missed FG's top 10 Dodgers prospect in July - he may be underwhelming but not everyone is down on him;

Los Angeles Dodgers Top 10 Prospects Updated

Ronny Brito | SS | R —> Signed for $2 million back in 2015, it’s taken Brito some time to adjust to pro ball but he’s looking much improved this year with the bat. He’s also showing more pop. With that said, he’s also playing in rookie ball for a third straight year. At worst, he shows enough defensive skill to develop into a big league back-up at shortstop.

Before this ranking:

Date	G	PA	AB	R	H	2B	3B	HR	RBI	BB	IBB	SO	HBP	SH	SF	GDP	SB	CS	BA	OBP	SLG	OPS	BAbip
Jun 4 to Jul 15, 2018	26	103	93	21	32	8	0	5	23	8	0	24	1	0	1	1	0	4	0.344	0.398	0.591	0.989	0.415
per 162 games	163	642	580	131	200	50	0	32	144	50	0	150	7	0	7	7	0	25

[TBODY] [/TBODY]

After this ranking:

Date	G	PA	AB	R	H	2B	3B	HR	RBI	BB	IBB	SO	HBP	SH	SF	GDP	SB	CS	BA	OBP	SLG	OPS	BAbip
Jul 18 to Sep 5, 2018	35	159	141	19	37	6	0	6	32	15	0	54	1	0	2	1	1	2	0.262	0.333	0.433	0.766	0.373
per 162 games	162	736	653	88	172	28	0	28	149	70	0	250	5	0	10	5	5	10

[TBODY] [/TBODY]

So Brito did fall off quite a bit in the 2nd half.

KATOH Projects: Super Deep Sleeper Prospects

Name	Team	KATOH
Andrew Sopko	Dodgers	1.7

[TBODY] [/TBODY]

 

[Woodman19]

Can’t say I’m happy about the return if we’re eating that much salary. Man the jays are paying like 35 million for two players to play elsewhere crazy

$54 million

 

[Anthrax442]

Theres value in not having to deal with Tulo and Martin on this roster .who cares how much money Rogers is paying for them to "play elsewhere" . When you have a rotting foot, you cut it off and be done with it.

 

[trellaine201]

Is it confirmed the Jays are retaining 75% ($15M) of Martin's salary?

Ouch! That along with Tulo free money. It’s raining money in TO.
Can’t say the Jays are cheap lol

 

[Boutette]

Went from 9ish guys for 5 spots to 5ish guys (4 if you dont count Vlad yet) for 5 spots.

3B, SS and 2B are 3 spots not 5. 4-5 guys in 3 spots is about as much as a team can field on a 25 man roster these days. There's not really any more room when you only have roster spots for a single extra catcher, infielder and outfielder. The problem in Toronto is 3 players who can only field at 1st base. One of Morales or Smoak has to go. Preferably Morales. Or maybe convince him to retire and hire him as a coach. I'd rather have Tellez and Hernandez occupying his spot in the order.

Jays are still currently starting vets at 6 of their 9 starting spots. The team is younger but still had leadership;

C: Jansen
1B: Smoak
2B: Travis
SS: Gurriel
3B: Drury
RF: Grichuk
CF: Pillar
LF: McKinney
DH: Morales

Smoak, Pillar and Morales are the only players in that top 9 over the age of 28. Travis is 28, Drury 26, Grichuk 27. IMHO, players 28 and under aren't really "vets" as the term is used.

 

[Woodman19]

Ouch! That along with Tulo free money. It’s raining money in TO.
Can’t say the Jays are cheap lol

But many will

 

[phillipmike]

3B, SS and 2B are 3 spots not 5. 4-5 guys in 3 spots is about as much as a team can field on a 25 man roster these days. There's not really any more room when you only have roster spots for a single extra catcher, infielder and outfielder. The problem in Toronto is 3 players who can only field at 1st base. One of Morales or Smoak has to go. Preferably Morales. Or maybe convince him to retire and hire him as a coach. I'd rather have Tellez and Hernandez occupying his spot in the order.

Usually teams have 2 bench spots allocated for middle infielders plus 3B protect; hence 5 roster spots... im talking spots not positions. I used my words carefully here.

Smoak, Pillar and Morales are the only players in that top 9 over the age of 28. Travis is 28, Drury 26, Grichuk 27. IMHO, players 28 and under aren't really "vets" as the term is used.

There is no real definition for the term "vet" in baseball so there shouldnt be any random cut off. But the actual definition of veteran speaks of someone's experience or service time not age.

Im talking years of service not age. Because age isnt really indicative of anything, say Travis misses the 2019 season, so in 2020 he will be 29, does that make him a vet because of your random cut off of 28 years old even though he would have the same games played now as he would in 2020?

Morales - 10.170 Service Time
Smoak - 8.077 ST
Pillar - 4.133 ST
Grichuk - 4.033 ST
Travis - 3.163 ST
Drury 2.165 ST

Having guys with experience around a young Jays team is important. Its the number of years and games they put into being a professional, not their age.

 

[Suntouchable13]

It's sad at how quickly the 2015 got dismantled. It sucks that the window was so small. It came together so quickly and got dismantled pretty quickly too. Just reminiscing about those summer days in 2015 and how exciting it was, how electric it was. Oh well, what can you do? I hope we can get back to legit contender status soon. Man, nothing better than a rocking dome during August, Sep, October. Gives me chills just thinking about it.

 

[Anthrax442]

It's sad at how quickly the 2015 got dismantled. It sucks that the window was so small. It came together so quickly and got dismantled pretty quickly too. Just reminiscing about those summer days in 2015 and how exciting it was, how electric it was. Oh well, what can you do? I hope we can get back to legit contender status soon. Man, nothing better than a rocking dome during August, Sep, October. Gives me chills just thinking about it.

Wasn't that team the oldest in MLB? That cought up with them really quickly

 

[Anthrax442]

 

[Suntouchable13]

Wasn't that team the oldest in MLB? That cought up with them really quickly

Yea, everyone knew the window was short.

 

[stickty111]

Yea, everyone knew the window was short.

We should have won in 2015. Its too bad everything was going right for the Royals.

 

[Boutette]

Because age isnt really indicative of anything

Yes it is. Its indicative of how long a typical player has before their physical abilities peak and begin to decrease. If you're 30+ that decline is coming a lot sooner than if your 26-28. That's why I don't think of players who won't hit 30 for 2-4 years 'vets' as yet. Vet to me is a player who is on the tail end of their career, not the heart.

 

[dredeye]

$54 million

I only meant for this season

 

[dredeye]

That really was a fun run.

 

[canucksfan]

 

[phillipmike]

All Jays eligible for arb have agreed to new contracts with the exception of Tepera.

 

[canucksfan]

I will give props to Shatkins for getting Rogers to eat money on Martin as they had no place to play him and they got back some warm bodies who may or may not make it but could be flipped down the line as filler in other deals.

Rogers has stepped up by eat salary on Tulo and Martin. Now the books will be clear of all monies coming up next season and they can start to add talent around the kids.

According to this MLB 2019 Payroll Tracker they are 25th overall in team payroll. Coming into last year they were eighth. Next year with Morales coming off, who has the highest salary now, and likely Smoak they will have a lot of room to sign FAs or trade for some pieces.

This year they should identify needs and then go after targets in the off-season.