Ville de Québec Part VI:VE le Quebec Hockey

[Buck Aki Berg]

Ahem, Quebec Bulldogs (aka Quebec Athletic Club and Quebec Hockey Club) and WHA.

I can only research hockey at work for so long before the boss gets pissy

 

[GordonGraham]

Serious Question (not trolling): Should a team be moved to Quebec (be it the Coyotes or whomever), would you guys embrace a new name / logo, or would you seriously boycott the team if it was named and branded anything but the Nordiques?

no one would boycott it yeah most would ***** and moan about it and the debate would be front page news but when the puck drops the people will show up no matter what

 

[Stasis]

I actually think the Isles could end up in Quebec. There's no way I'm seeing Charles Wang acting as a tennant in a building he doesn't own for too long. The guy wanted his own lighthouse progect! A 14 thousand seats place to boot is not very attractive. I think the whole thing is meant to buy Charles time so he can assembled investors to build a new place in the Brooklyn area. And if that doesn't work then it would be bye bye to Quebec in 2015. Remember the deal with the arena in Brooklyn start in 2015, I figure Charles will try to come up with new ideas before 2015.

Nope. Islanders aren't going anywhere. This deal is what confirms they won't, not makes it a possibility they might. I see this as a chance to re-brand a little and renew as well as add interest in the franchise as a tie-in to the Nets fever we're seeing more of now. Revitalization of Brooklyn area sports if you will. Many opportunities are now present, and Wang likely is well aware of this, small arena or no.

 

[Jumptheshark]

Nope. Islanders aren't going anywhere. This deal is what confirms they won't, not makes it a possibility they might. I see this as a chance to re-brand a little and renew as well as add interest in the franchise as a tie-in to the Nets fever we're seeing more of now. Revitalization of Brooklyn area sports if you will. Many opportunities are now present, and Wang likely is well aware of this, small arena or no.

even though the arena is the smallest in the NHL it will make more money then they would playing in a 20k one in Quebec--NYC vs any city in Canada and nearly the world (because I live in London, England I think we could give NYC a run for their money)

 

[DJ Omnimaga]

no one would boycott it yeah most would ***** and moan about it and the debate would be front page news but when the puck drops the people will show up no matter what

Unless it's called the Rafales LOL

 

[Colin226]

even though the arena is the smallest in the NHL it will make more money then they would playing in a 20k one in Quebec--NYC vs any city in Canada and nearly the world (because I live in London, England I think we could give NYC a run for their money)

The key will be getting NYC attention and sponsors.. They are still in a Rangers stronghold and not a competitive team.. Also in a city with 2 teams in each of the two biggest leagues in the US (NFL and MLB) and a new NBA rivalry with the Knicks who put the Rangers to shame in terms of publicity in the area.. Up until yesterday the NY Islanders were getting less press in NYC than the NJ Devils.. They have a ways to go but I will say that being in the city does open the door though

 

[DJ Omnimaga]

I wouldn't mind if they decided to ditch the logo but kept the 1991-95 jerseys and replaced the logo with a big fleur de lys. Just as long as they don't use those horrible white bars like in the 2010 reality TV hockey show lol:

 

[Dojji*]

I wouldn't mind if they decided to ditch the logo but kept the 1991-95 jerseys and replaced the logo with a big fleur de lys. Just as long as they don't use those horrible white bars like in the 2010 reality TV hockey show lol:

That actually looks really good. Simple and complete. Work some gold into it so that you're not yet another of the many blue and white teams and you've got something.

 

[Kimota]

He's already signed a 25 year lease. He's agreed to play there from 2015 to 2040. Whether he backs out during that time, or if he backs out before the lease takes effect, I'm sure he incurs the same penalties.

Leases in sport means nothing. When a team has to leave they will leave. I'm not saying it will be the case with the Isles.

 

[Kimota]

The teeth gnashing from the relocation crowd, makes me almost as happy as the isles being locked into local leases for the next 28 yrs.

Seems to me you're taking things way too seriously. It was a theory.

 

[Kimota]

The problem is that Quebec tends to be much too artsy and abstract in their designs of logos. Or did in the 60's and 70's when most of this stuff was designed. They tried to get too much done in the symbols they created.

It's why to this day half of fans don't realize the insignia of the Expos was actually a letter M. I'm not even sure all the Expos fans knew. I only asked a former Expos fan just a few years ago whatever the heck "ELB" had stood for and that's the first time I got a clue.

So the fact that a lot of fans saw the Nord symbol as an elephant is no surprise to me. And why the Habs' insignia really does kinda look like a toilet seat. The design is too artsy and abstract to accomplish what it sets out to do in the eyes of undiscerning fans.

Who care what people thinks it means, the important thing is that it looks good. The Expos had the best logo in sport.

 

[Kimota]

I would like if the Nords' jerseys stay about the same as when they left, but I would love to see a neat new designed jersey for a third jersey.

 

[Dojji*]

Who care what people thinks it means, the important thing is that it looks good. The Expos had the best logo in sport.

Actually the Red Wings symbol is much, much better. It communicates not just the identity of the team, but the character of the town, clearly, distinctly, and without ambiguity. Because unlike the Nords and Expos, they didn't try to do too much. An automobile wheel with a red wing. Detroit Red Wings. Yep, got it in one. No Quebec-style Rorschach hoo-hah need apply.

They even managed to work a lower case letter D in there.

I'm not exactly a Red Wings fan, but I'm willing to admit and defend my belief that they have easily the best team symbol in North American sports.

The only one that close is the symbol of a team I as a New England sports fan have even less reason to love. But as soon as you see that symbol, you know exactly what you're up against: North America's richest, most storied and most prestigious sports franchise.

 

[Kimota]

Actually the Red Wings symbol is much, much better. It communicates not just the identity of the team, but the character of the town, clearly, distinctly, and without ambiguity. Because unlike the Nords and Expos, they didn't try to do too much. An automobile wheel with a red wing. Detroit Red Wings. Yep, got it in one. No Quebec-style Rorschach hoo-hah need apply.

I don't know i've seen many people wondering what the Red Wings logo meant. Especially what Red Wings had to do with a wheel.

But I think you restrict yourself with what a good and bad logo should be. There are many great easily understandable logos as great unintelligible logos. What's important is that it looks good. The old Canucks logo from the 90s was great but not everybody could see the skate.

 

[Kimota]

The only one that close is the symbol of a team I as a New England sports fan have even less reason to love. But as soon as you see that symbol, you know exactly what you're up against: North America's richest, most storied and most prestigious sports franchise.

When I was a kid, I thought it was Chinese letters. Looks good, though.

 

[Dojji*]

I don't know i've seen many people wondering what the Red Wings logo meant. Especially what Red Wings had to do with a wheel.

Not if they had any idea of what Detroit's big significance is, And I'm not talking about being the launch point of one of the invasions of Canada during the War of 1812.

Heck, when the news talks about US automakers as a group and wants to keep it to one concise word, they still call them "Detroit."

But I think you restrict yourself with what a good and bad logo should be. There are many great easily understandable logos as great unintelligible logos. What's important is that it looks good. The old Canucks logo from the 90s was great but not everybody could see the skate.

Not seeing the skate is a lot different from seeing the symbol in front of you and having no logical way to look at that symbol and arrive at what team or town it calls home. At least most of Boston's sports symbols go that far -- even the Patriots do, if you know your US history. For some reason Quebec feels the need to be ambiguous and hide their identity behind a mask of nonsense. It's like they're not even proud to be the continent's only French speaking population.

I think that if Quebec ever gets a team back it needs to make sure to use the Fleur, and not some sort of crazy marketing nonsense or overartsly symbol. The identity as a QC team is the whole point of having a QC team.

 

[Killion]

Actually the Red Wings symbol is much, much better. It communicates not just the identity of the team, but the character of the town, clearly, distinctly, and without ambiguity. Because unlike the Nords and Expos, they didn't try to do too much. An automobile wheel with a red wing. Detroit Red Wings. Yep, got it in one. No Quebec-style Rorschach hoo-hah need apply.

the Detroit logo was actually a semi-rip-off from Montreal's "Winged Wheelers", a team from "Big" Jim Norris's youth growing up in Quebec at the turn of the century. He designed it himself when acquiring the suspended Detroit Cougars NHL franchise, re-naming them the Red Wings and ya, he nailed it. Excellent logo.... the Fleur de lis & the colour scheme of powder blue & white have great significance to Quebecer's, so hopefully they'll incorporate that symbol as their main logo at minimum. But I do agree with you on the old logo; looks a bit like a cartoon choo choo train or something, the red non-complimentary.

 

[Dojji*]

When I was a kid, I thought it was Chinese letters. Looks good, though.

It looks good because they knew when to stop fooling with it. Simplicity rules.

 

[Dojji*]

the Detroit logo was actually a semi-rip-off from Montreal's "Winged Wheelers", a team from "Big" Jim Norris's youth growing up in Quebec at the turn of the century. He designed it himself when acquiring the suspended Detroit Cougars NHL franchise, re-naming them the Red Wings and ya, he nailed it. Excellent logo....

Cool bit of history there. Thanks for the data.

the Fleur de lis & the colour scheme of powder blue & white have great significance to Quebecer's, so hopefully they'll incorporate that symbol as their main logo at minimum. But I do agree with you on the old logo; looks a bit like a cartoon choo choo train or something, the red non-complimentary.

Something like the Kansas City Royals' color scheme.

Just put the Fleur de lis where the "Royals" is and turn it into a hockey jersey in your mind. Royal blue shoulders and sleeves. Possibly a bit of gold lining worked in here and there.

Symbolwise, nothing but the fleur on the front, no words.

Royal fleur on white or robins-egg blue with powder backshadows and gold trim for road games.

Reverse the home jersey (powder blue fleur, royal blue jersey) for a third jersey, and there you go. Simple and elegant.

 

[Kimota]

Not if they had any idea of what Detroit's big significance is, And I'm not talking about being the launch point of one of the invasions of Canada during the War of 1812.

Heck, when the news talks about US automakers as a group and wants to keep it to one concise word, they still call them "Detroit."

Yet not everybody knows what it means. Yet it looks good.

Not seeing the skate is a lot different from seeing the symbol in front of you and having no logical way to look at that symbol and arrive at what team or town it calls home. At least most of Boston's sports symbols go that far -- even the Patriots do, if you know your US history. For some reason Quebec feels the need to be ambiguous and hide their identity behind a mask of nonsense. It's like they're not even proud to be the continent's only French speaking population.

Quebec? What does this have anything to do with Quebec? They hired artists that produced this and they went by it. It has nothing to do with the territory. Both the Expos and the Nords were created in late 60s and 70s at a time where many logo were pretty psychadelic. Not just for Quebec teams.

I think that if Quebec ever gets a team back it needs to make sure to use the Fleur, and not some sort of crazy marketing nonsense or overartsly symbol. The identity as a QC team is the whole point of having a QC team.

That would be pretty boring.

 

[Kimota]

It looks good because they knew when to stop fooling with it. Simplicity rules.

No it looks good because the letters are positioned in an usual manner. Not because of the simplicity.

I think you restrict yourself way too much in what should be and should not be. The only thing that matters is that it looks good.

 

[Dojji*]

No it looks good because the letters are positioned in an usual manner. Not because of the simplicity.

I think you restrict yourself way too much in what should be and should not be. The only thing that matters is that it looks good.

I think you're wrong. It also matters that the symbol represents the team and the town in some way. It can do that and also look good, the way Detroit's does.

I think you restrict yourself too little. For a symbol to represent, the undiscerning fan still needs to be able to approximately understand it.

If you've ever studied heraldry, you realize pretty quickly that despite the fact that some heraldry symbols are very farfetched, they all have a logic and a meaning to them, and every symbol in a coat of arms represented something about either who the knight wearing the coat was, or what he had done, or where he came from.

That tradition of heraldry is actually passed down to us in, among other things, the symbols of our sports teams, and the symbols should for that reason if for no other, abide by that convention. And even at that, since we don't study heraldry anymore, being too fanciful will hurt your efforts to get that symbol to resonate with the modern layman and leave a confusion of meanings that is against what a symbol is about..

 

[Killion]

Symbolwise, nothing but the fleur on the front, no words. Fleur on white with powder backshadows and gold trim for road games, and reverse it (powder blue fleur, royal blue jersey) for a third jersey, and there you go.

... ya, that'd work. You could add some dimension to the Fleur de lis with tone on tone smaller images in powder blue, something to give it more bite than just a plain white crest. Ballard really messed up the Leaf logo, going from the beautiful veined leaf to that single block job in white or blue that looks like the logo of a cardboard box manufacturer or something. Down n' dirty, cheap.

 

[sipowicz]

even though the arena is the smallest in the NHL it will make more money then they would playing in a 20k one in Quebec--NYC vs any city in Canada and nearly the world (because I live in London, England I think we could give NYC a run for their money)

And you have insider information on this...

 

[Dojji*]

... ya, that'd work. You could add some dimension to the Fleur de lis with tone on tone smaller images in powder blue, something to give it more bite than just a plain white crest. Ballard really messed up the Leaf logo, going from the beautiful veined leaf to that single block job in white or blue that looks like the logo of a cardboard box manufacturer or something. Down n' dirty, cheap.

I'm actually picturing the fleur being royal blue with details in white on the home jersey, royal with powder details on the road, and powder with white or gold on the third.