Confirmed Trade: [VGK/LAK] Alec Martinez for 2020 and STL 2021 2nd round picks

[theslatcher]

Hopefully now that Vatanen is the only really good defenseman available via UFA that this raises his value with the remaining teams that could use a defenseman.

There's Gustafsson. And the market shrinks if Vegas is done shopping.

 

[Djp]

Not one of the credible sources or insiders believed anyone other that Kreider would fetch a 1st this year.

Blake now has acquired (3) 2nd rounders this year as well as (3) third rounders. Last year alone we got Kaliyev and Fagemo in the 2nd round.

we may also have (3) 2nd rounders in 2021 if TO qualifies for the playoffs and Campbell wins 6 or worse case (2) 2nds and (2) 3rds.

in the last 5 drafts our 2nd round picks

Kaliyev - 33
Fagemo - 50
Thomas - 51
JAD -41
Claugue - 51
Cernak - 43

3rd rounders are also of interest

Parik - 87
Shafigullin - 82
Villalta - 72
Dergachyov

taken after the 3rd

Nousiainen - 119
Dudas - 113
Hrenak - 144
Anderson - 103
Hults - 134
Wagner - 99
Roy - 194

don’t underestimate what our scouts have done with the picks they have been given.

only on HF boards do people overvalue 2nd round prospects.

hhistory says something different

hisotry says

1. its far easier getting a top 4 Dman than a top 6 forwards

getting a top 3 Dman/top 6 forward out of the 2nd round averages about 3 per draft. others make the NHL but they are usually lower level players who are replaceable.

If you get anything that is a regular starter in the top 9 or top 6 in the 3rd round or latter be happy. you get anything thats a top 4 or top 6 player be thrilled you won a lottery

 

[Djp]

that STL 2nd in 2021 has gone around the block a few times--floosy

gone from STL to BUF to LV to LA

 

[Paperbagofglory]

Expansion team in its third season. "We don't need no stinking draft picks. More over the hill veterans will solve all our problems"

 

[405Exit]

Expansion team in its third season. "We don't need no stinking draft picks. More over the hill veterans will solve all our problems"

You haven’t seen what Anaheim has done yet. We have Kovalchuk for the taking this trade deadline.

 

[Primakov!]

I know the 3 player cap. I would be shocked if Lewis required retention, and I doubt Carter happens. We will see though. If retaining on Martniez could would have increased the return I would have done it. I am guessing all this was debated by Blake and Vegas,

It's hard to tell with some of these potential Stanley Cup contenders that are tight to the salary cap will ask for while they're doing last minute shopping for experienced depth players. I mean, Kyle Clifford was only at a $1.6 million cap hit and Toronto asked for 50% retention so Trevor Lewis at $2 million needing it wouldn't be that surprising, you know?

Carter and Lewis are just random names out of a hat used for examples where some people put their value at something like a 4th or 5th round pick in discussions on the Board. And if retention can bump the discussions into 3rd or 4th round territory then I value an entire draft round improvement with those two as being more valuable to the team than the difference in 2nd round slots from the New Jersey to St. Louis picks.

I say that because a lot of the maneuvering to grab targeted players in the 2nd round that the Kings have pulled off in the past seem to require ammo in the 3rd and 4th rounds to entice other teams to play along. I could be wrong, but musical chair shenanigans in the 2nd round might be easier to pull off than busting back into the 1st round with how stingy some teams are being this year.

 

[funky]

only on HF boards do people overvalue 2nd round prospects.

hhistory says something different

hisotry says

1. its far easier getting a top 4 Dman than a top 6 forwards

getting a top 3 Dman/top 6 forward out of the 2nd round averages about 3 per draft. others make the NHL but they are usually lower level players who are replaceable.

If you get anything that is a regular starter in the top 9 or top 6 in the 3rd round or latter be happy. you get anything thats a top 4 or top 6 player be thrilled you won a lottery

you may be right but I will happily take 3 second round picks and Madden for 20 games of a middle 6 winger that may be back in July and an aging expensive #4 to 5 Dman having a bad year with another year tacked on. Love Marty but he isn’t what he used to be.

 

[tomd]

you may be right but I will happily take 3 second round picks and Madden for 20 games of a middle 6 winger that may be back in July and an aging expensive #4 to 5 Dman having a bad year with another year tacked on. Love Marty but he isn’t what he used to be.

I actually agree with you as long as you don’t have to watch the team on TV or god forbid pay money to see them in person! Can’t wait to see the season ticket renewal numbers this year.

 

[sxvnert]

Wow, decent deal for Vegas.

 

[KopitarFAN]

I actually agree with you as long as you don’t have to watch the team on TV or god forbid pay money to see them in person! Can’t wait to see the season ticket renewal numbers this year.

Maybe they'll offer a discount to people renewing instead of just a price freeze.

 

[KirkAlbuquerque]

Expansion team in its third season. "We don't need no stinking draft picks. More over the hill veterans will solve all our problems"

yeah who needs wins and playoffs, especially as a new fanchise in an untraditional market. Let's follow the Atlanta, Columbus, and Minnesota model instead! Maybe if we build the "right way" we can get back to the playoffs 12 years from now!

 

[KirkAlbuquerque]

Rob Blake has quietly done an excellent job as GM of the Kings...

it's pretty easy to do a teardown... especially when you don't have many good players to begin with.

 

[Primakov!]

I don't agree. He didn't know how to use Kovalchuk. He didn't utilize Grundstrom's momentum from last season (5 goals in 15 NHL games) and set him back. He didn't utilize Frk (who has 5 points in 7 games) earlier in the season. On the other hand, he has leaned heavily on Kempe, giving him big minutes and responsibility, and the results have been underwhelming (only 25 points and, obviously, where they are in the standings). It's true that McLellan hasn't had a lot to work with, but he hasn't gotten as much out of what he's had than he might've, IMO.

Do you put in place a style of play that you know works then pigeon hole players into roles and punt the players who can't find success in it?

Do you look at the personnel and put together a new system to get the maximum performance out of the players that you have available?

It's an interesting topic to chew on as I can't think of many coaches in any of the different sports that would sacrifice whatever is their bread and butter style associated with them and scrap it entirely to be practical. They probably should think about it more often though if on-ice performance and results are ultimately going to determine whether they continue to have a job or not.

Like, I'm listening to some of the Montreal radio shows and I heard them talk about how they made an adjustment to allow Kovalchuk to wind up and gather speed in his own zone so he has momentum built up to help him with offensive zone entries. I wonder if there's more to it than that because that doesn't feel like an unbridgeable gap in expectation between player and coach that could have helped in Los Angeles.

 

[tomd]

Maybe they'll offer a discount to people renewing instead of just a price freeze.

Seriously, would you honestly pay ANYTHING to watch the remaining dregs on this team play hockey? The cost of parking alone would be an over payment

 

[tomd]

it's pretty easy to do a teardown... especially when you don't have many good players to begin with.

Exactly. Most kings fans are going to hate the next 5 years except those who only track prospects and draft picks.

 

[GoldenBearHockey]

Do you put in place a style of play that you know works then pigeon hole players into roles and punt the players who can't find success in it?

Do you look at the personnel and put together a new system to get the maximum performance out of the players that you have available?

It's an interesting topic to chew on as I can't think of many coaches in any of the different sports that would sacrifice whatever is their bread and butter style associated with them and scrap it entirely to be practical. They probably should think about it more often though if on-ice performance and results are ultimately going to determine whether they continue to have a job or not.

Like, I'm listening to some of the Montreal radio shows and I heard them talk about how they made an adjustment to allow Kovalchuk to wind up and gather speed in his own zone so he has momentum built up to help him with offensive zone entries. I wonder if there's more to it than that because that doesn't feel like an unbridgeable gap in expectation between player and coach that could have helped in Los Angeles.

Scotty Bowman was the master of adapting, and not pigeon holing players

 

[Lt Dan]

only on HF boards do people overvalue 2nd round prospects.

hhistory says something different

hisotry says

1. its far easier getting a top 4 Dman than a top 6 forwards

getting a top 3 Dman/top 6 forward out of the 2nd round averages about 3 per draft. others make the NHL but they are usually lower level players who are replaceable.

If you get anything that is a regular starter in the top 9 or top 6 in the 3rd round or latter be happy. you get anything thats a top 4 or top 6 player be thrilled you won a lottery

Fun fact. Alec Martinez was a 4th round pick

 

[KopitarFAN]

Seriously, would you honestly pay ANYTHING to watch the remaining dregs on this team play hockey? The cost of parking alone would be an over payment

No I wouldn't, but I haven't had to buy a ticket in years.
That said, next season could be fun to watch, they still won't be very good, but we'll see a lot more young guys.

 

[bouncesonly]

Leafs easily could have beaten that deal....so why didn't they?

Dog turd >>>>>> Dubas

Ok, I'm curious....what would the Leafs give up for Martinez?

 

[Mike Jones]

Fun fact. Alec Martinez as a 4th round pick

Yeah - another HF thing: draft picks are trash.

 

[Vegan Knight]

Fun fact. Alec Martinez as a 4th round pick

Wasn't Muzzin a 2nd or 3rd?

 

[Ncit3]

Expansion team in its third season. "We don't need no stinking draft picks. More over the hill veterans will solve all our problems"

When they hit the wall, well, they are going to hit the wall. Going to be funny.

 

[Lt Dan]

Yeah - another HF thing: draft picks are trash.

Indeed

It is funny how almost every NHL player comes in through the draft, yet draft picks are crap shoots, worthless, etc.

Everyone forgets that development is as important as drafting

 

[CupInSIX]

When they hit the wall, well, they are going to hit the wall. Going to be funny.

Yeah because giving up a couple EXTRA second rounders is really mortgaging the future.

(btw they still have an extra 2nd next season).

 

[riznat]

Wasn't Muzzin a 2nd or 3rd?

A 5th for Pittsburgh but didnt sign with them.