Vancouver gets 2006 WJCs

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incawg

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BigDaddyMeatWhistle said:
Jeff Hunt asked them if Vancouver hosting the Olympics would give them the bid and they said it wouldn't.

I take it that you've got evidence to support this claim?

BigDaddyMeatWhistle said:
Besides, how can anyone know who had the superior bid? Hockey Canada hasn't said a damn thing about how the various bids stacked up against each other. They just said that Vancouver was the had the best combination of factors.

You would think that with two of the three voting members being from British Columbia that they would reveal in detail what made Vancouver the superior bid. But they haven't and that in itself is telling.

You need to stop reading Ottawa papers and listen to the press conference for yourself. They went into many of the details that made Vancouver a strong bid.

Bottom line is that there were many good bids, but one had to win. No matter who won you could make a case for the other. But whining about it after the fact does nothing but make Hunt look like a sore loser. This "rigged" business is absurd.
 

YellHockey*

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incawg said:
I take it that you've got evidence to support this claim?

Why would Jeff Hunt waste $100,000 if he knew he was going into the bidding process at a disadvantage beyond his control?

You need to stop reading Ottawa papers and listen to the press conference for yourself. They went into many of the details that made Vancouver a strong bid.

Tell me where I can listen to the press conference?

What details did they go into that made Vancouver a stronger bid then Ottawa or Quebec City?

Here is the press release from Hockey Canada's website? What details did they go into?

VANCOUVER, BC - Hockey Canada announced on Thursday that the bid from Vancouver, BC was chosen from five final potential groups, and will host the 2006 IIHF World Junior Hockey Championship in Canada.

The 2006 IIHF World Junior Hockey Championship will take place from late December, 2005 to early January, 2006 (exact dates tbd), in Vancouver, BC, with satellite centres in Kelowna and Kamloops, BC. The locations and game schedule will be subject to IIHF approval and will be released at a later date.

Bids from London/Kitchener, ON, Ottawa, ON, Quebec City, QC, Saskatoon, SK and Vancouver, BC were the five finalists. Originally, a total of eleven groups had expressed interest in hosting the 2006 IIHF World Junior Championship, including six that were formally eliminated from contention on January 12, 2004: Edmonton, AB, Halifax, NS, Hamilton, ON, Montreal, QC, Toronto, ON and Winnipeg, MB.

The Vancouver, BC bid was chosen by Hockey Canada's site selection committee, after in-person presentations were made in Calgary on January 18th by the five final groups to Hockey Canada's site selection committee. The site selection committee is comprised of three voting members Bob Nicholson (Hockey Canada President), Allan Matthews (Chair of the Board for Hockey Canada), David Branch (President of the Canadian Hockey League), and Hockey Canada staff resource person Scott Smith (Hockey Canada's Vice President, Business Operations).

" From the very outset of this process, the members of the site selection committee have been extremely impressed with the quality of all of the bids, and I can tell you that the decision to choose the successful group was a very difficult one," said Hockey Canada President Bob Nicholson. "After over a week of conference calls and meetings we felt, as a group, that Vancouver had presented the best combination in the areas of team services, business plan and logistics plan. Vancouver has done a tremendous job in securing this event and we know that the host committee and the province of British Columbia will do an outstanding job of hosting the 2006 IIHF World Junior Hockey Championship."

" The Canadian Hockey League congratulates the City of Vancouver and Province of British Columbia in winning the right to host the 2006 IIHF World Junior Hockey Championship," said CHL President and member of the site selection committee, David Branch. "The popularity of this event, and junior hockey in our country, both continue to grow and we strongly believe that the bid from Vancouver will be writing a new historic chapter in Canadian hockey history come December 2005."

" The City of Vancouver and the Province of British Columbia are very proud to be selected by Hockey Canada to host the 2006 IIHF World Junior Hockey Championship," said Ron Toigo, Head of the Bid Committee. "The support of junior hockey in our province is strong, and now that the Championship is officially coming to British Columbia, we know that this will become the best ever World Junior Hockey Championship, one that all Canadians will be proud of."

" All those involved in hockey in the Province of British Columbia are proud to be part of this prestigious event. We look forward to the challenges that are ahead of us in hosting the 2006 World Junior Championship," said John Furlong, President of the Vancouver 2010 Transition Team. "This is a fantastic opener to the Olympic quadrennial and the eyes of the World are beginning to look at Vancouver as a focal point of major international events."

Vancouver, who is also host of the 2010 Winter Olympic Games, will mark the seventh time that this international event has been staged in Canada and the first time it will be held in British Columbia. Other years in which Canada hosted this Championship were in 2003 (Halifax, NS), in 1999 (Winnipeg, MB), in 1995 (Red Deer, AB), in 1991 (Saskatoon, SK), in 1986 (Hamilton, ON), and in 1978 (Montreal, QC). Grand Forks, North Dakota will host the event in 2005. Canada has won a medal in the past six World Junior Championships, including a silver medal on January 5, 2004 in Finland after losing to the USA, 4-3.


Bottom line is that there were many good bids, but one had to win. No matter who won you could make a case for the other. But whining about it after the fact does nothing but make Hunt look like a sore loser. This "rigged" business is absurd.

Why would Hunt complain about it if he didn't have a justified reason to? He knows that Hockey Canada will probably punish him for speaking out about their process.
 

incawg

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BigDaddyMeatWhistle said:
Why would Jeff Hunt waste $100,000 if he knew he was going into the bidding process at a disadvantage beyond his control.

So him saying that it was rigged from the start is clearly a load of crap. If he knew it was rigged, he wouldn't have bid.

BigDaddyMeatWhistle said:
Here is the press release from Hockey Canada's website? What details did they go into?

What exactly are you looking for anyway? There's no objective measurement for this sort of thing. There's no "Ottawa scored a 8.7 on the bid scale and Vancouver was an 8.9". They look at the bids in their totality and make a subjective judgement. That's how any process like this works. They felt that Vancouver presented "the best combination in the areas of team services, business plan and logistics plan." (a direct quote from the statement you've pasted). Look at any Olympic bid decision and you'll see the same thing.

BigDaddyMeatWhistle said:
Why would Hunt complain about it if he didn't have a justified reason to? He knows that Hockey Canada will probably punish him for speaking out about their process.

Just because he's whining doesn't make it justified. AFAIK, he's a sore loser and he's expressing sour grapes. On paper the Ottawa bid was certainly not vastly superior to that of Vancouver, which would be the only situation where he'd be justified in whining this much.
 

YellHockey*

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incawg said:
What exactly are you looking for anyway? There's no objective measurement for this sort of thing. There's no "Ottawa scored a 8.7 on the bid scale and Vancouver was an 8.9". They look at the bids in their totality and make a subjective judgement. That's how any process like this works. They felt that Vancouver presented "the best combination in the areas of team services, business plan and logistics plan." (a direct quote from the statement you've pasted). Look at any Olympic bid decision and you'll see the same thing.

Why can there not be an objective measurement for this? Most things that are judged rank the factors that go into making a decision.

And you're pointing to Olympic bids to make a point that this was a fair process? But even Olympic bids have an open vote of delegates from all the interested parties to determine who won the bid. If the Olympics had a process like the one Hockey Canada used they'd have Jacques Rogge, one other Belgian and one other voting member come to a "unanimous" decision that Brussels will be holding the next Olympics because they presented "the best combination in the areas of team services, business plan and logistics plan." And the Olympics would stay in Europe 80% of the time.
 

incawg

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BigDaddyMeatWhistle said:
Why can there not be an objective measurement for this? Most things that are judged rank the factors that go into making a decision.

Why can't there be an objective measurement? Because ultimately it's a subjective decision. You can throw a nominal title onto something, but it doesn't make it objective.

BigDaddyMeatWhistle said:
And you're pointing to Olympic bids to make a point that this was a fair process?

I'm pointing at it to show that there's no purely objective measures for these sorts of things. Anybody can come along and say any of these bid judgements - be they Olympic or WJC - are rigged as a result. They end up looking like fools, however, if there isn't sufficient evidence to show that the losing bid was actually superior. Ottawa's bid proposal on paper was hardly superior.
 

Lard_Lad

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BigDaddyMeatWhistle said:
Wasn't rigged? Hockey Canada stated on several occasions the criteria that they were using to determine the winning bid. Not once did they mention the Olympics. Jeff Hunt asked them if Vancouver hosting the Olympics would give them the bid and they said it wouldn't. Now that the decision has been made Bob Nicholson is talking about how the Olympics were a factor in the decision.

Explain, please, how "was a factor" is equivalent to "automatically gave Vancouver the bid."
 

incawg

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FlyersFan said:
So, you've seen it?

As much as any of us have. What the Ottawa bid team has revealed to the public about Ottawa's bid hardly makes a convincing case that they had a superior bid. About the only thing that Hunt's been able to put forward in support of his claim is that Ottawa sold 18k packages while Vancouver got 85k signatures. As has been stated several times, however, this event would easily sell out in any major market in Canada so selling ticket packages is a moot point. In the end, it's just a whole lot of whining by Hunt with no evidence to support his claims.
 
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