Proposal: Vancouver Canucks-Montreal Canadiens

[BigHabs]

Eh.. i don't immediately hate it, but Vancouver shouldn't be trading away prospects at this point, and if we're trading away roster spots we want picks and prospects in return.

Take out Karl Alzner, throw in your other 2nd rounder and take out Jonah for like a Petrus Palmu and i like it more from Vancouver's side

To Vancouver: 3rd OV / 2 2nd rounders
To Montreal: 7th OV/ Edler/ Hutton / Palmu

Would have to replace Alzner with Schlemko at the least as the Habs would want a little bit of salary going back. Habs take on Edler’s 5mill. Schlemko atleast helps cancel out Huttons salary.

 

[Hostile Offer]

Eh.. i don't immediately hate it, but Vancouver shouldn't be trading away prospects at this point, and if we're trading away roster spots we want picks and prospects in return.

Take out Karl Alzner, throw in your other 2nd rounder and take out Jonah for like a Petrus Palmu and i like it more from Vancouver's side

To Vancouver: 3rd OV / 2 2nd rounders
To Montreal: 7th OV/ Edler/ Hutton / Palmu

I think Edler's worth 2 2nds. Downgrade from 3rd to 7th for Hutton and Palmu? No chance buddy.

 

[Vorkosh]

I can understand that, but Edler isn't a cap dump, based on his resurgence last year he's worth every bit of that 5 mill. If we're looking to balance salary as well, there's no point in trading the better player for a random 2nd rounder that may or may not pan out

 

[Vorkosh]

I think Edler's worth 2 2nds. Downgrade from 3rd to 7th for Hutton and Palmu? No chance buddy.

Shrug, your fellow Habs fan would disagree, he's trying to balance salary at this point

The difference between 4 picks is not worth more than Hutton and a prospect. Especially when the player you actually want is still gonna be there at 7. If not, we just keep it and grab a solid Dman ourselves instead of Hughes since Rasmus is out of play. You're overvaluing the pick, not the players with the pick. The difference between Hughes and a Bouchard or a Dobson is worth a Hutton and a Palmu to Canucks. The difference between Zadina and Kotkaniemi is worth Hutton and a prospect due to Kotkaniemi actually filling a position of need. If you're gonna waste your 3rd OV on Kotkaniemi.. then more power to you

 

[Hostile Offer]

Shrug, your fellow Habs fan would disagree, he's trying to balance salary at this point

The difference between 4 picks is not worth more than Hutton and a prospect. Especially when the player you actually want is still gonna be there at 7. If not, we just keep it and grab a solid Dman ourselves instead of Hughes since Rasmus is out of play. You're overvaluing the pick, not the players with the pick. The difference between Hughes and a Bouchard or a Dobson is worth a Hutton and a Palmu to Canucks. The difference between Zadina and Kotkaniemi is worth Hutton and a prospect due to Kotkaniemi actually filling a position of need. If you're gonna waste your 3rd OV on Kotkaniemi.. then more power to you

You see, it's not that much of a 'value' issue, but is Hutton worth trading down? His trajectory is not looking very good. Palmu I doubt he's ever going to play in the NHL. We would end up missing on Zadina and we might end up missing on Hughes and Kotkaniemi as well. Then we're left with possibilities that aren't BPA and aren't that big of a need. We could still get the guy we like/need but are Hutton and Palmu worth the gamble? No, no they aren't, at least to me.

 

[Captain Mountain]

Shrug, your fellow Habs fan would disagree, he's trying to balance salary at this point

The difference between 4 picks is not worth more than Hutton and a prospect. Especially when the player you actually want is still gonna be there at 7. If not, we just keep it and grab a solid Dman ourselves instead of Hughes since Rasmus is out of play. You're overvaluing the pick, not the players with the pick. The difference between Hughes and a Bouchard or a Dobson is worth a Hutton and a Palmu to Canucks. The difference between Zadina and Kotkaniemi is worth Hutton and a prospect due to Kotkaniemi actually filling a position of need. If you're gonna waste your 3rd OV on Kotkaniemi.. then more power to you

Eh, not really.

We don't know who the Habs actually want. There have been something like 5-6 names associated with them. The benefit for Montreal is that they get to pick who they actually want. Montreal's not going to value Hutton a lot and they Edler has a NTC, he's not going to waive to go to Montreal).

I'm also not sure why you raise "balancing salary" and then make it so Montreal sends NO salary to Vancouver.

And Montreal's ability to take exactly who they want and ability to take a run at Tavares (no matter how unlikely him signing in Montreal is) isn't worth Palmu or Hutton. And even if Edler would waive for Montreal, he's 32 and has one year left on his contract. Considering where Montreal finished, there isn't much reason for them to move futures for him.

 

[Maitz]

Wings might take Kotkaniemi at 6th and I’m not a fan of Dobson. I prefer Hughes at 3 so if I’m Habs I’m taking my guy 3rd overall wheter its Hughes Zadina or Kotkaniemi

 

[Spearmint Rhino]

Hmmmm........

In response to the two posts above mine, is that all it would take to move from 7 to 3? That’s not bad actually. I figured Montreal would want more.

A healthy Weber and bounce back years from Price and Pacioretty the Habs are probably a playoff bubble team but I expect Vancouver to struggle next couple of years with the Sedins gone and extra pressure on the kids, could be looking at a 10+ position swing next year when there's some good C depth, it's a game that could pay off, if it doesn't the insurance is a 2nd

 

[Shanejones]

You see, it's not that much of a 'value' issue, but is Hutton worth trading down? His trajectory is not looking very good. Palmu I doubt he's ever going to play in the NHL. We would end up missing on Zadina and we might end up missing on Hughes and Kotkaniemi as well. Then we're left with possibilities that aren't BPA and aren't that big of a need. We could still get the guy we like/need but are Hutton and Palmu worth the gamble? No, no they aren't, at least to me.

Then keep the pick

 

[Hostile Offer]

Then keep the pick

That's what I'm saying.

 

[Scintillating10]

I am finding it a little hard to believe that Montreal would trade that pick even if they only are moving down 4 spots. The need every position. Even Price's replacement needs to be drafted soon. Goaltenders usually take years to develop. Their #1 D is 32 soon to be 33, they are going to need to fill that spot too. Obviously they need centers too and they are supposedly trying to trade Pacioretty so they need every position and the prospects that they have leave something to be desired.

I think they need to draft the best player available for a couple of years with their top picks and they can try to draft certain positions with 2nd round and later picks.

Stranger things have happened though.

They have quite a few goalies in the system.

 

[xNogaitx]

Would have to replace Alzner with Schlemko at the least as the Habs would want a little bit of salary going back. Habs take on Edler’s 5mill. Schlemko atleast helps cancel out Huttons salary.

Even then this is a bad offer for Mtl.

A guy to play next to Weber for one season, a bottom pairing guy (Might as well keep a cheaper Schlemko at that point rather than Hutton), and an undersized 6th rounder winger prospect who might never play in the NHL for not only trading down from 3OA to 7OA, but also 2 of Mtl's 2nds including its earliest?

This is highway robbery if Vancouver was to pull this off. This is literally Vancouver offloading it's spare parts that have little to no effects on the team's long-term for some premium assets.

 

[Deam78]

At this point, seeing various reports saying teams in the top 5 could reach for a centre, I highly doubt Kotkaniemi makes it to the 7th selection.

That being said, I'd be really to gamble if we receive a really good prospect in a position of needs in return:
Gaudette.

So it starts with at least 7th OA + Gaudette.

 

[Cogburn]

At this point, seeing various reports saying teams in the top 5 could reach for a centre, I highly doubt Kotkaniemi makes it to the 7th selection.

That being said, I'd be really to gamble if we receive a really good prospect in a position of needs in return:
Gaudette.

So it starts with at least 7th OA + Gaudette.

For me it ends there then. Gaudette is shaping up very well, and four spots for...Zadina?...doesn't appeal to me.

One of Hughes, Dobson, Kotkaniemi, Boquist or Zadina is available, and none of them are worth any of the others plus Gaudette to me. If Svetch or Dahlin dropped....well maybe. But then something tells me Montreal won't want to trade that pick then.

 

[Shanejones]

At this point, seeing various reports saying teams in the top 5 could reach for a centre, I highly doubt Kotkaniemi makes it to the 7th selection.

That being said, I'd be really to gamble if we receive a really good prospect in a position of needs in return:
Gaudette.

So it starts with at least 7th OA + Gaudette.

It’s not horrible,however, Nucks don’t need a winger, we need defence, and 7th is gonna get us a pretty good dman, we could even afford to drop a couple of spots and maybe pick up a prospect or later draft pick so giving up a good prospect/player like him is not worth it

 

[Deam78]

It’s not horrible,however, Nucks don’t need a winger, we need defence, and 7th is gonna get us a pretty good dman, we could even afford to drop a couple of spots and maybe pick up a prospect or later draft pick so giving up a good prospect/player like him is not worth it

For me it ends there then. Gaudette is shaping up very well, and four spots for...Zadina?...doesn't appeal to me.

One of Hughes, Dobson, Kotkaniemi, Boquist or Zadina is available, and none of them are worth any of the others plus Gaudette to me. If Svetch or Dahlin dropped....well maybe. But then something tells me Montreal won't want to trade that pick then.

Exactly. I would not expect you to make the deal either. I just don't think there's a deal to be made for the reasons I highlighted in my previous comment. You will do fine with the 7th.

 

[Lebowski]

3rd overall (Zadina / Hughes)
Andrew Shaw
Mike Rielly
Jacob DeLaRose

for

7th overall (Kotkaniemi / Dobson)
Brandon Sutter
Ben Hutton
Markus Granlund

This does nothing for us.

I'd probably stick with our guys even if you took out the picks from the proposal.

 

[Shanejones]

Vancouver Canucks-Montreal Canadiens

Here’s my thought, and I might be wrong:

1) Montreal wants to draft Kotkaniemi since he fills a huge organizational need (Center). However - Kotkaniemi is a guy that can easily be had at number 7.

2) I suspect that Benning likes Hughes, but may not be entirely sold on Dobson/Bouchard/Boqvist. Hence - Benning being open to trading the #7 pick. Benning either isn’t sold at what’s available at number 7, or is simply keeping his options open to see what possibilities are out there. My personal thought is as follows:

Hughes > Hanifin > Dobson > Boqvist/Bouchard. Perhaps Benning feels similarly.

Vancouver has made inquiries on Noah Hanifin and Ryan O’Reilly, but the price tag is quite high.

I was curious to see as to what it would take on Vancouver’s end if they wanted to move up from 7 to 3? Would the required upgrade package be similar to that of what they’d have to give up for Hanifin or O’Reilly? What would be a fair deal?

By the way - I would take Hughes at the #3 spot unless for whatever reason, Svechnikov was available. I’m not sold on Zadina and believe that his developmental path will be similar to that of Jesse Puljiujarvi (possible late bloomer but those selected directly before and after Zadina will have more successful careers and faster starts).

I don’t think we need to give up to move up to 3, I truly believe we can get what we need, a good dman in Hughes,Dobson,Boqvist or Bouchard and if two or more are available come pick #7, I wouldn’t be surprised if Jim trades down a spot or two picking up a prospect or later draft pick for doing so. At this point I think our best option is to keep our pick and stick to the plan, with the draft lottery luck we have had lately, falling to 7 this year doesn’t hurt us at all(besides not getting #1 obviously) because we desperately need dman and the good ones are plentiful in the top 10 this year

 

[HuGo Sham]

Hmmmm........

In response to the two posts above mine, is that all it would take to move from 7 to 3? That’s not bad actually. I figured Montreal would want more.

they would. these are bad counter offers

 

[HuGo Sham]

Shrug, your fellow Habs fan would disagree, he's trying to balance salary at this point

The difference between 4 picks is not worth more than Hutton and a prospect. Especially when the player you actually want is still gonna be there at 7. If not, we just keep it and grab a solid Dman ourselves instead of Hughes since Rasmus is out of play. You're overvaluing the pick, not the players with the pick. The difference between Hughes and a Bouchard or a Dobson is worth a Hutton and a Palmu to Canucks. The difference between Zadina and Kotkaniemi is worth Hutton and a prospect due to Kotkaniemi actually filling a position of need. If you're gonna waste your 3rd OV on Kotkaniemi.. then more power to you

habs won't take kotkaniemi at 3. it will be zadina, tkatchuk or hughes

 

[JTmillerForA1stLOL]

If kotks is still available at 7 I say we pull the trigger on this deal.

 

[Horse McHindu]

Yeah that's fair. Personally I don't really want to move the pick- I'd rather just hope Bouchard or Dobson are there- and if both are gone we still have our choice of Hughes, Tkachuk and Wahlstrom.

I don’t know.....

Maybe it’s just me, but I think Hughes is a class above quite frankly. I think Hughes will be the Zack Werenski/Ivan Provorov of this draft. I like Noah Dobson and Evan Bouchard a lot, but just can’t see them being good 1st pairing defenseman. Maybe Bouchard but I doubt it. Dobson is a lock to be a very good 2nd pairing dman in my opinion.

Tkachuk and Wahlstrom would be nice as well, but I think the Canucks *really* need to hit a homerrun with a defenseman when all is said and done after this Summer.

 

[Horse McHindu]

why complicate things?

From what I understand you believe that the Canucks want Hughes over anyone but are scared Hughes won't be there at 7, Meanwhile Montreal is torn between Kotkaniemi and Zadina.

Just have an agreement in place that Montreal drafts Hughes with number 3. If they do that, Kotkaniemi is guaranteed to be available at 7, since Zadina still has to be picked from 4-6 (he's not going to fall to 8)

Just have the Canucks draft Kotkaniemi at 7, and trade the players, not the picks with like a 2nd and a 4th next year for Montreal's troubles or something

Trading the picks are risky for Montreal still, since between 4-6 Kotkaniemi, however unlikely, can still be drafted at which point Montreal just dropped down 4 spots for nothing since they didn't even get the guy they wanted. Yes, they would have Hughes, but not an immediate need.

It’s not a bad idea, but has there ever been an instance in the NHL where a team drafts a player (who is happy to have been selected by said team) and then trades him momentarily afterwards?

I don’t think GM’s enjoy hurting or embarrassing a young kid by doing that sort of thing. Hence - why I think picks are traded *before* the player selection is made.

 

[Just Linda]

Vancouver isnt doing montreal a favour by letting them move down. If vancouver wants the 3oa then they will have to convince montreal to let go of it. The price is far higher than fans would want to pay.

 

[Horse McHindu]

Here’s a big big big IF.

IF Benning has justifiable reason to believe that Hughes is not only a class above Dobson/Boqvist/Bouchard, but would eventually be in that Provorov/Werenski category,.........while also believing that Dobson/Boqvist/Bouchard would be decent 2nd pairing defensemen at best, would this kind of deal be advisable?

To Montreal: 7OA, 2019 1st
To Vancouver: 3OA, 2019 2nd