Confirmed Trade: [VAN/TBL] J.T. Miller for Marek Mazanec, 2019 3rd round pick, and 2020 conditional 1st round pick

[Canucks1096]

Man, I been reading a lot of stuff about Miller that is not true. Role player? Complimentary? Can't score 50 points if on a matchup role? Can't carry a line? Need a star to carry him? Middle 6 forward?

News flash Miller put up 56 points with two ok top 6 players in Hayes and Grabner. News flash, that was considered a match up line as well. Miller can definitely put up numbers without star players and in a matchup role

 

[WHISTLERNATE]

75,69,73,81 points the last 4 years . I don't see why you could consider the rebuild at the end . No team that's a lottery team should trade a future first for a non difference maker like Miller . He is a good solid player but he doesn't move the needle for the club. I dont even think the Nucks make the playoffs this year . Sorry but of course good luck this season .

How do you figure that adding a 50-60 point player who becomes your 4th best offensive forward not move the needle?

Canucks were in the playoff hunt all year until the end when their lack of depth buried them. Adding Hughes, Meyers, Ferland and Miller for next year with no significant subtractions will again keep this team in the hunt. They may not get in next year, but I would be shocked if they did not get in for 2021.

Yes, this rebuild is at the end. They have graduated 5 key players in Hughes, EP, BB. Horvat, Demko, and still a top 10 prospect pool. You can't just rebuild with prospects alone, you need to supplement them with other young established players, which is exactly what JB has done. This team will compete from now, it is no longer about acquiring future assets.

 

[LTIR Trickery]

Man, I been reading a lot of stuff about Miller that is not true. Role player? Complimentary? Can't score 50 points if on a matchup role? Can't carry a line? Need a star to carry him? Middle 6 forward?

News flash Miller put up 56 points with two ok top 6 players in Hayes and Grabner. News flash, that was considered a match up line as well. Miller can definitely put up numbers without star players and in a matchup role

Most people just sour on him because, much like many 50ish point players, there are nights where he can be dominant, and nights where you wonder what the hell he is doing. Nonetheless, he is a good pickup.

 

[Sparksrus3]

How do you figure that adding a 50-60 point player who becomes your 4th best offensive forward not move the needle?

Canucks were in the playoff hunt all year until the end when their lack of depth buried them. Adding Hughes, Meyers, Ferland and Miller for next year with no significant subtractions will again keep this team in the hunt. They may not get in next year, but I would be shocked if they did not get in for 2021.

Yes, this rebuild is at the end. They have graduated 5 key players in Hughes, EP, BB. Horvat, Demko, and still a top 10 prospect pool. You can't just rebuild with prospects alone, you need to supplement them with other young established players, which is exactly what JB has done. This team will compete from now, it is no longer about acquiring future assets.

Let's regroup. I LIKE JT MILLER AS A PLAYER . Any team would want him . I just think the potential for that first round pick slot to blow up in their face is very real. The lottery is a funny thing . Any chance at the ping pong ball could be the next top 1-3 selection. The islanders went through it with the Buffalos giving them a first in a Vanek deal and getting a first in the Hamonic deal that got us Dobson with the pick .You fans will be on pins and needles all season and I bet will start a thread about the pick by the all star break . While JT may be worth a first going to the right situation I feel the Nucks made this move a year or 2 early giving up that pick . That team could very easily put up 80 points again and you could be saying that the kids are progressing nicely but it's just not leading to wins . I don't think Miller is that difference maker to elevate a team. Did you know he had a 20 game stretch with 1 goal starting in November and finished the season with 1 goal in the last 21 . He would have to be a 60 assist man to make up for that and make a difference nightly on the scoresheet and the team win column.
I hope I'm wrong and he has a 20 - 40 - 60 season . It's time for the big dawgs to fall and the Nucks to rise from the ashes . Gino Odjick #1

 

[VanJack]

Can't can's really fault Benning for rolling the dice on J.T. Miller, at the cost of a first-round draft pick in either 2020 or 2021. If the Canucks miss the playoffs next year and are a lottery team once again, then they defer the first rounder to 2021. If they were to miss the playoffs again in 2021 then Benning wouldn't likely be around anyway, even with a new three-year agreement in his hip pocket.

They future is 'now' for the Canucks. It's the playoffs or bust for Jimbo.

 

[DFC]

Can't can's really fault Benning for rolling the dice on J.T. Miller, at the cost of a first-round draft pick in either 2020 or 2021. If the Canucks miss the playoffs next year and are a lottery team once again, then they defer the first rounder to 2021. If they were to miss the playoffs again in 2021 then Benning wouldn't likely be around anyway, even with a new three-year agreement in his hip pocket.

They future is 'now' for the Canucks. It's the playoffs or bust for Jimbo.

That's probably the logic behind it. It's a decent trade that could turn terrible if things go the wrong way for Vancouver. But if they make the playoffs this year, I think Vancouver fans will look back on this trade as a good one. I don't think either team will think of it as a win or a loss. Both sides got something they needed.

 

[LTIR Trickery]

Can't can's really fault Benning for rolling the dice on J.T. Miller, at the cost of a first-round draft pick in either 2020 or 2021. If the Canucks miss the playoffs next year and are a lottery team once again, then they defer the first rounder to 2021. If they were to miss the playoffs again in 2021 then Benning wouldn't likely be around anyway, even with a new three-year agreement in his hip pocket.

They future is 'now' for the Canucks. It's the playoffs or bust for Jimbo.

Another benefit is, hes 26 and locked up the next 4 years at what will continue to be a very economical price. Say he gets 18 minutes a night in VAN and goes off, pushes almost 60 points, you end up having a very nice asset that can be flipped into other needs.

 

[chum]

Another benefit is, hes 26 and locked up the next 4 years at what will continue to be a very economical price. Say he gets 18 minutes a night in VAN and goes off, pushes almost 60 points, you end up having a very nice asset that can be flipped into other needs.

to be honest, this seems like too complicated of a concept for benning

 

[timw33]

end up having a very nice asset that can be flipped into other needs.

The problem is that Jim Benning has a horrific trade history and almost never recoups value on his assets.

 

[Sensmileletsgo]

Sucks to give up a 1st but good for Vancouver to get some more scoring depth. He’ll tear it up if he plays with Pettersson.

 

[wetcoast]

If the offer had been conditional first (becomes 2nd if Canucks miss playoffs), I think the price would have been spot on. The deal that was made put too much risk on the Canucks, but let's not pretend the price is out of the ballpark. It's not like there was a better UFA that signed for a comparable amount, or that a better player moved for less. Benning met the cost for adding a cost controlled top 6 forward.

The problem still remains that TB was in a salary cap crunch with Point up this year and Cirelli, Sergachev, Cernak and Joseph up next year.

What you say above works great in a non Salary Cap NHL but we all live in a Cap NHL and Benning didn't use it to his advantage.

To further compound the situation he overpaid both in salary and term for Meyers in a desperate attempt to make sure that the Miller first rounder isn't a lottery pick.

If EP40, Hughes and Demko are as good as Canuck fans hope they will be the Canucks will have their own cap issues when 2 of them need to be resigned before the 21-22 season.

Although Benning was helped by Hughes having an injury last year and thus not burning a year for him so it will be 22-23 for him.

 

[wetcoast]

No doubt as wild card. We're not in a dominant position unless something goes terribly right for us.

But the pick is conditional on us making the playoffs, not whether we get home ice, or win the division, or even win a game. The teams goal has been stated, and the gauntlet thrown down.

So people really think that only one wildcard will come out of the Central?

Heck even the Black Hawks got better in the off season and that makes 6 teams in the Central for only 5 spots.

Or that the Canucks will even be the 4th best team in the Pacific?

 

[Cogburn]

So people really think that only one wildcard will come out of the Central?

Heck even the Black Hawks got better in the off season and that makes 6 teams in the Central for only 5 spots.

Or that the Canucks will even be the 4th best team in the Pacific?

Blackhawks got better.

But Columbus (especially Columbus), Minnesota, Winnipeg and arguably Colorado and Nashville all got worse. St Louis and Dallas didn't become new superpowers (relative to the start of last year) either.

As for our division, Calgary didn't improve, the Sharks got worse, and even Vegas has had to lose some talent. Edmonton, LA, and Anaheim haven't improved as much as we have, or at all, and Arizona is the only wild card (due to a lot of the same factors we've had to put up with).

I think 4th in the Pacific is a real possibility, but I also think that 7/8 in the conference isn't ridiculous. The conference has gotten worse overall, and we've got a better on ice product, compared to last year.

 

[wetcoast]

Blackhawks got better.

I think the Black Hawks are a playoff team with the addition of Lehner and a full season of Strome

But Columbus (especially Columbus), Minnesota, Winnipeg and arguably Colorado and Nashville all got worse. St Louis and Dallas didn't become new superpowers (relative to the start of last year) either.

Columbus is in the east, hard to keep track I know and Minny I have in the basement sort of the Central version of the Kings.

Even if Winnipeg and Nashville are a bit worse it won't be enough to miss the playoffs both have strong deep teams, Dallas improved and the Avs will have a full season of Makar and have added Kadri to anchor the 2nd line.

Nashville, Dallas and St Louis all have excellent top 4 defenses and good forward groups, Nashville adding Duschene certianly isn't going to hurt them.

As for our division, Calgary didn't improve, the Sharks got worse, and even Vegas has had to lose some talent. Edmonton, LA, and Anaheim haven't improved as much as we have, or at all, and Arizona is the only wild card (due to a lot of the same factors we've had to put up with).

Calgary, San Jose and Vegas are all pretty much locks to make the playoffs.

the 4th spot is up in the air but all of the Canucks, Yotes, ducks and even Oilers are in the mix for that 4th spot.

I think 4th in the Pacific is a real possibility, but I also think that 7/8 in the conference isn't ridiculous. The conference has gotten worse overall, and we've got a better on ice product, compared to last year.

the conference hasn't really gotten worse though if you look at it.

Does adding Duschene make Nashville worse? they still have a top 5 back end group in the league and adding Matt will surely improve their 19th ranked offense.

Is Dallas worse?

Colorado?

Black Hawks?

Blues?

Even with the Jets being maybe slightly worse with the loss of Trouba healthy seasons from Buff and Morrisey will help offset that as will any sort of consistency from Laine or a healthy season from Ehlers.

Too much of people saying the Canucks will make the playoffs depends on everything going right for them and everything going wrong for other teams and this simply isn't very likely.

One thing that could really help the Canucks is is they could win more than 3 games out of 12 from the Ducks, Yotes and Oilers.

If they score more timely goals and improve their goaltending to above average they might make a push but they also need some luck with other teams improvements not working out.

Even if the Canucks finish 4th in the Pacific it's hard to not see both wildcard teams coming out of the central next year.

 

[Matty Sundin]

Miller stalks thr superstar's of the lighting hiding in the spotlight just like how he will he here to

 

[LTIR Trickery]

Miller stalks thr superstar's of the lighting hiding in the spotlight just like how he will he here to

Matty been drinking again.

 

[Zwui21]

That's probably the logic behind it. It's a decent trade that could turn terrible if things go the wrong way for Vancouver. But if they make the playoffs this year, I think Vancouver fans will look back on this trade as a good one. I don't think either team will think of it as a win or a loss. Both sides got something they needed.

Oh I can tell you that, no matter what the pick end up being in term of OA, this trade is def a win in my books. (This doesn't necessary means I think it's a L for Vancouver. Trades can be win-win)
Free up necessary cap space, get rid of a decent player that was underproducing (mostly because of misuse, but still) on a 5.25M contract AND get a 1st in return.

I don't see a scenario where Lightning fans could complain about this trade.

 

[DFC]

Oh I can tell you that, no matter what the pick end up being in term of OA, this trade is def a win in my books. (This doesn't necessary means I think it's a L for Vancouver. Trades can be win-win)
Free up necessary cap space, get rid of a decent player that was underproducing (mostly because of misuse, but still) on a 5.25M contract AND get a 1st in return.

I don't see a scenario where Lightning fans could complain about this trade.

Yeah, we win no matter what. It's just a matter of how big. 31st overall is a win. ...Unless JT scores the game winning SCF goal. ...Against us.

 

[DistantThunderRep]

It's strange how both parties are saying they are happy here and everyone else is saying they disagree with one side.

 

[Zwui21]

Yeah, we win no matter what. It's just a matter of how big. 31st overall is a win. ...Unless JT scores the game winning SCF goal. ...Against us.

Also, when you think JBB was able to get a better return with JT Miller than Poile got with Subban, We got a fisrt whil freeing up cap space when Dubas paid a 1st to get cap space (obviously the value of Miller/Marleau is very different). All in all, this trade is a JBB masterpiece.

Not gonna lie, JBB has been killing it this offseason so far. Signing Point to a good contract would really be the cherry on top.

When Yzerman left us I was really worried, but Stevie wasn't lying when he said that JBB was more than ready to take on the Lightning GM spot and he would do a fantastic job.

 

[WHISTLERNATE]

So people really think that only one wildcard will come out of the Central?

Heck even the Black Hawks got better in the off season and that makes 6 teams in the Central for only 5 spots.

Or that the Canucks will even be the 4th best team in the Pacific?

I agree that 5 of the top 8 teams in the west live in the Central, which is why the Canucks may sneak into the playoffs. It may turn into a blood bath in which they all beat up on each other and keep point totals down. Meanwhile the Canucks play the Oilers, Ducks and Kings 13 times and may be able to rack up some points.

 

[Hansen]

Can't can's really fault Benning for rolling the dice on J.T. Miller, at the cost of a first-round draft pick in either 2020 or 2021. If the Canucks miss the playoffs next year and are a lottery team once again, then they defer the first rounder to 2021. If they were to miss the playoffs again in 2021 then Benning wouldn't likely be around anyway, even with a new three-year agreement in his hip pocket.

They future is 'now' for the Canucks. It's the playoffs or bust for Jimbo.

Are you going to be around in this scenario? What absurd rhetoric

 

[JTmillerForA1stLOL]

Oh I can tell you that, no matter what the pick end up being in term of OA, this trade is def a win in my books. (This doesn't necessary means I think it's a L for Vancouver. Trades can be win-win)
Free up necessary cap space, get rid of a decent player that was underproducing (mostly because of misuse, but still) on a 5.25M contract AND get a 1st in return.

I don't see a scenario where Lightning fans could complain about this trade.

This is an absolute win for TB. There is no disputing that. This will go down as Benning's worst trade (amongst many other bad ones) and is likely to set this franchise back a few years. What an embarassing time to be a Canucks fan.

 

[Barnaby]

I wasn’t a Miller fan when he played for the Rangers. He was inconsistent and makes some bone headed plays. I don’t think that’s changed based upon reports from TB fans. I also remember reading a few things about maturity issues, but for all I know that’s in the past.

I guess the value isn’t awful, but my first reaction was that it’s def an overpayment. If the pick ends up in the 20s then it’s likely not too bad. If it becomes a lottery pick then it could be a disaster.

Someone mentioned the idea that the 1st should have became a 2nd if Vancouver missed the playoffs. I think that would have been a much fairer deal.

Oh well, what’s done is done. Hopefully he pushes 60 points for you guys.

 

[notsocommonsense]

This is an absolute win for TB. There is no disputing that. This will go down as Benning's worst trade (amongst many other bad ones) and is likely to set this franchise back a few years. What an embarassing time to be a Canucks fan.

Dramatic much? Jesus, If you’re embarrassed to be a nucks fan, there’s a team getting started just south of here that you can get excited about. See ya!

Personally I’m pretty excited to watch an improved, competitive team this coming season with several key young players in place