Value of Rasmussen?

[Run the Jewels]

I don't see things playing out this way. I'm not sold on Hughes as an NHL center, so I personally will be viewing him as a player more suited for the wing. Similarly, Ras just feels like someone who won't be making the transition to center. The plan was to have him take the same path as Larkin by starting on the wing, but consider that Larkin had a very strong year in his first year on the wing and struggled when picking up the responsibilities of playing center in year 2. Rasmussen has struggled at accomplishing anything this year while playing the wing; I can't imagine he gets to take over center responsibilities until he establishes himself in some form in the NHL.

When the team is ready to start pressing for actual playoff success, I see the center position looking more like this, assuming they can land Hughes or Kakko; otherwise you can replace the UFA slot with Cozens or Dach:

1C: Larkin
2C: UFA/Veleno
3C: Veleno/UFA
4C: Ehn/Turgeon/yet to be drafted

You're slotting Larkin and Veleno too high. Now if your only goal is to make the playoffs then that would work. That's unlikely to work on a Stanley Cup contender. Particularly with how pedestrian we are on defense. Better to draft a 1C this year. We are likely picking in the top 3 at a bare minimum and there is no D-man who warrants being drafted in that spot. You need to draft a guy you truly believe will be a 1C.

 

[Ezekial]

How much production are ya'll expecting from a 19 year old kid playing 12 minutes a night?

Whatever, people bitched about Cholowski in his D+1 into his D+2 too, people expect wayyyyyyyyyyyy too much from 19 year olds in this day and age. If you don't come into the league like Elias Pettersson you're trash and not indicative of a top 10 pick.

Rasmussen definitely isn't a 4C, that's an Ehn type job, if he's prematurely labeled as anything it's a middle 6 winger.

 

[Hen Kolland]

You're slotting Larkin and Veleno too high. Now if your only goal is to make the playoffs then that would work. That's unlikely to work on a Stanley Cup contender. Particularly with how pedestrian we are on defense. Better to draft a 1C this year. We are likely picking in the top 3 at a bare minimum and there is no D-man who warrants being drafted in that spot. You need to draft a guy you truly believe will be a 1C.

Difference of opinion I suppose. I don't care if Hughes or Kakko play wing, they are better than any center or defenseman in the draft, so I won't be drafting anyone based solely on my confidence in them becoming a 1C, I just want to hoard high level talent. What my point was at the end of the day is not that they should draft something other than a center, it's more so that I'm not willing to bet on the current draft class either A) being a center (in Hughes' case) or B) will surpass what Larkin is already doing as a center at 22.

And it's hard for me to agree with your stance that you can't become a Stanley Cup contender with Larkin as a 1C when the Blackhawks won 3 cups with Toews as their 1C. Doesn't always have to be an elite offensive player to be considered a 1C. Not saying that it wouldn't be great to run into one, but we have to consider the likelihood that anyone outside of Hughes making the transition to NHL center at a higher level than Larkin's current progress is probably not great. Larkin is trending for just under 80 points this year, driving the team on a nightly basis, playing all ES, PP, and PK time, just outside of the top 10 in takeaways, and winning damn near 55% of faceoffs, and that is a 1C to me. All that being said, and it would still absolutely be a blessing if we drafted a player who could surpass him.

 

[Shaman464]

Whatever, people *****ed about Cholowski in his D+1 into his D+2 too, people expect wayyyyyyyyyyyy too much from 19 year olds in this day and age. If you don't come into the league like Elias Pettersson you're trash and not indicative of a top 10 pick.

Rasmussen definitely isn't a 4C, that's an Ehn type job, if he's prematurely labeled as anything it's a middle 6 winger.

Ras's skill set has always screamed winger. His best stats in the CHL came after he was switched to playing wing. His size, and the way he doesn't drive the play so much as he waits for the play comes to him will make him most dangerous on the wing of a play making center.

 

[Ezekial]

Ras's skill set has always screamed winger. His best stats in the CHL came after he was switched to playing wing. His size, and the way he doesn't drive the play so much as he waits for the play comes to him will make him most dangerous on the wing of a play making center.

He drove a lot of the play for Tri-City. This misconception that he parked his ass in front of the net and Geekie made all the plays is a joke.


EDIT: For example, he was amazing with the puck on his stick because he was able to fend off defenders with his size and tuck a pass by them while doing it. His possession game was so strong it opened up the other options on his line.
Once his body catches up to the frame I'm excited to watch him do a lot of similar stuff in the NHL.

 

[ricky0034]

Whatever, people *****ed about Cholowski in his D+1 into his D+2 too, people expect wayyyyyyyyyyyy too much from 19 year olds in this day and age. If you don't come into the league like Elias Pettersson you're trash and not indicative of a top 10 pick.

Rasmussen definitely isn't a 4C, that's an Ehn type job, if he's prematurely labeled as anything it's a middle 6 winger.

I agree to an extent in general

but with Rasmussen honesty I think not hitting the ground with a better performance than he has been is somewhat of a cause for concern

he's a big guy that plays a very pro ready type of game,there's a reason he looked good in preseasons from the start,his game is a lot more simple than many others picked around him and he really SHOULD be expected to have a pretty easy adjustment to the NHL if he's even remotely worth of a top 10 pick

to me with the way he plays him not doing well from the start is more of an indication of him not being good enough than not being ready enough

all we can do is wait and see though at this point I suppose,would be pretty stupid timing to trade him now

 

[Ezekial]

I agree to an extent in general

but with Rasmussen honesty I think not hitting the ground with a better performance than he has been is somewhat of a cause for concern

he's a big guy that plays a very pro ready type of game,there's a reason he looked good in preseasons from the start

to me with the way he plays him not doing well from the start is more of an indication of him not being good enough than not being ready enough

all we can do is wait and see though at this point I suppose,would be pretty stupid timing to trade him now

I'm going to disagree, historically a lot of forwards of size don't translate immediately like you would expect. Players like Wheeler and Huberdeau didn't really start kicking it into gear until they were in the league a couple seasons.

E: actually I just looked at Huberdeau more and his rookie season was really good, his sophomore season was not.

 

[Shaman464]

He drove a lot of the play for Tri-City. This misconception that he parked his ass in front of the net and Geekie made all the plays is a joke.


EDIT: For example, he was amazing with the puck on his stick because he was able to fend off defenders with his size and tuck a pass by them while doing it. His possession game was so strong it opened up the other options on his line.
Once his body catches up to the frame I'm excited to watch him do a lot of similar stuff in the NHL.

I watched him a bit, and I wasn’t getting at he was completely passive, but he didn’t drive the play either. And this was even more true when he was slotted in as a center. He looked a lot better as a wing and everything about him screams top 6 winger. I see him putting up franzen like figures in his peak around 30-35g and 20-25 assists.

 

[Run the Jewels]

Difference of opinion I suppose. I don't care if Hughes or Kakko play wing, they are better than any center or defenseman in the draft, so I won't be drafting anyone based solely on my confidence in them becoming a 1C, I just want to hoard high level talent. What my point was at the end of the day is not that they should draft something other than a center, it's more so that I'm not willing to bet on the current draft class either A) being a center (in Hughes' case) or B) will surpass what Larkin is already doing as a center at 22.

And it's hard for me to agree with your stance that you can't become a Stanley Cup contender with Larkin as a 1C when the Blackhawks won 3 cups with Toews as their 1C. Doesn't always have to be an elite offensive player to be considered a 1C. Not saying that it wouldn't be great to run into one, but we have to consider the likelihood that anyone outside of Hughes making the transition to NHL center at a higher level than Larkin's current progress is probably not great. Larkin is trending for just under 80 points this year, driving the team on a nightly basis, playing all ES, PP, and PK time, just outside of the top 10 in takeaways, and winning damn near 55% of faceoffs, and that is a 1C to me. All that being said, and it would still absolutely be a blessing if we drafted a player who could surpass him.

The problem with using Chicago as an example they had a Norris wining d-man in Keith and a 500 goal scorer in Hossa. We don't have any of those, so while Larkin may be a reasonable comparison we are missing the elite talent that turned Chicago into a Cup winner.

 

[waltdetroit]

Anders Lee, who many compare Raz to, was drafted in 2007, spent a year in USHL, 3 yrs in college, parts of 2 yrs in the AHL before making the NHL full time at the age of 24. It may take some time for Raz but I expect im to be a very good player in 3 years

edit "parts of"

 

[The Zetterberg Era]

What Rasmussen does this off-season is far more important than what is happening right now. Which for the record isn't exactly crazy to be happening to a 19 year old. This is going fine. Cholo has an abysmal +/- and Rasmussen is learning to play in the league too. This is what young guys look like, even really talented ones when they hit the league this early. We haven't seen a lot of it lately so I guess people had extreme expectations....

Ras will be fine. Hey we should be open for business on everyone but Larkin and 2019 first round pick in my opinion. But I doubt anybody would hit our current value on Rasmussen. But sure if the right name was there I would sell any of these guys...

 

[SCD]

My hope is Rasmussen can put on 25 lbs of muscle on that frame and become what Todd Bertuzzi was when he played for Vancouver.

 

[Henkka]

This is going fine. Cholo has an abysmal +/- and Rasmussen is learning to play in the league too. This is what young guys look like, even really talented ones when they hit the league this early. ..

Yeah, like Erik Karlsson was -35 on his first 2 seasons, and then +24 on the next 2 seasons. Same development curve can be expected from Cholowski.

Give these kids time. They are entering on the roster at earlier age than any other Wings-prospect on the last 20 years we used to.

 

[Mijatovic]

How much production are ya'll expecting from a 19 year old kid playing 12 minutes a night?

Yeah some people on here are surely tapped in the brain. How many other than Matthews level are ripping it up in first season pro as a 19 year old.

 

[Rzombo4 prez]

My hope is Rasmussen can put on 25 lbs of muscle on that frame and become what Todd Bertuzzi was when he played for Vancouver.

I agree and think people do not appreciate how underdeveloped he is physically. Yes he has a big frame but that is not the same as strength. He has a ton of capacity to get stronger and I think simply getting stronger will really change his game and confidence from skating, to puck battles to being more selfish with the puck (in a good way). Yes he is in the NHL at 19, but he is nowhere close to being a semi-finished project and is probably only there due to unique circumstances, not merit. We won't know what we have in him for at least three or four more seasons.

 

[Shaman464]

Yeah, like Erik Karlsson was -35 on his first 2 seasons, and then +24 on the next 2 seasons. Same development curve can be expected from Cholowski.

Give these kids time. They are entering on the roster at earlier age than any other Wings-prospect on the last 20 years we used to.

Using plus minus as a metric doesn't tell anyone anything. Cholo's got some pretty severe issues in positioning, gap coverage, and first moves in the D-zone. Its entirely possibly, and might be likely, that he's a PMD, not a defensive stalwart. And, honestly, that's fine, Detroit needs a real PMD to help catalyze the offense. Pair him with an all around D-man one of the two top pairings will be set.

 

[rhef3]

ram's first game in his conditioning stint
2 goals

 

[Reddwit]

People are forgetting that not only are the young kids young, but they aren’t breaking into the league playing alongside Lidstrom, Chelios, Hull, Datsyuk or even Stuart or Filppula types. Rasmussen is seeing a lot of Glen, Helm, and DLR as his centerman. Cholowski’s chaperone is who? Ericsson? Daley? Green if he’s lucky? It’s trial be fire for these guys and there’s nobody to hide behind.

 

[Oddbob]

People are forgetting that not only are the young kids young, but they aren’t breaking into the league playing alongside Lidstrom, Chelios, Hull, Datsyuk or even Stuart or Filppula types. Rasmussen is seeing a lot of Glen, Helm, and DLR as his centerman. Cholowski’s chaperone is who? Ericsson? Daley? Green if he’s lucky? It’s trial be fire for these guys and there’s nobody to hide behind.

Well said!

 

[obey86]

i'd like to see them move him up the lineup a bit and play with some more talented players to see how he does

 

[Dotter]

Exploring the Option of Trading Michael Rasmussen

What ?

Trade Larkin and Cholowski while we're at it, too? Hell, throw in Zadina for good measure??! WTF!

 

[Dotter]

Just read the thread... and WOW! are some people here way out of touch with reality. Some exaggerated comments about 19 year old rookie, Rasmussen. Face palm worthy! .eek

"I hated the pick at the time, then loved it when he was tearing up WHL, and now I hate it again!"

"He's following the career path I always predicted; a 4th line Center..."

"I wanted Vilardi. Now that Vilardi's always injured and has only played 4 AHL games and scored 1 point, and his prime development years are dwindling away, I would still rather Vilardi over Rasmussen!"

Turns out 19 year old [rookie] Rasmussen 9th overall pick isn't a prime Lindros. WTF!!!

Only at #HFboards.

 

[izlez]

The article says "If you were in favor of drafting him, you'll obviously have no interest in trading him"

You know who had was in favor of drafting him? The people that did draft him. So they have no interest in trading him. So why are you writing an article about it

 

[Henkka]

The right timing for possible Rsmussen trade doesn't come sooner than after a "too good" lucky season, where he whacks in easy rebounds and tap-in goals and contract is ending at same time. Then he could become overpaid and we could consider a trade. Especially if there's some next replacement guy coming in line.

First time to experiment that could be after his ELC last season. That's at 2021-22.

 

[jkutswings]

The right timing for possible Rsmussen trade doesn't come sooner than after a "too good" lucky season, where he whacks in easy rebounds and tap-in goals and contract is ending at same time. Then he could become overpaid and we could consider a trade. Especially if there's some next replacement guy coming in line.

First time to experiment that could be after his ELC last season. That's at 2021-22.

Yep. You don't trade a kid like that unless:

1) A crazy GM goes full Chia and offers an insane return, or

2) He's had a few years, become somewhat established, and you find a team who thinks he can still hit another level, but you think he's hit his ceiling.

I don't see either happening, but even a realistic chance won't occur for at least 2-3 more years.