Raptors Discussion: v70| It's off-season time (pre-season vs LAC from Hawaii: Sun Oct 1 @ 10pm ET/7pm PT | SN

[donghabs98]

The caution I have with Lowry is his injuries and the fact he's nearing the end of his prime. By signing him to a max long term deal that contract will be horrid by the end of it and hard to move out.

The problem is though what other alternatives is there for starting point guard?

 

[tp71]

The caution I have with Lowry is his injuries and the fact he's nearing the end of his prime. By signing him to a max long term deal that contract will be horrid by the end of it and hard to move out.

The problem is though what other alternatives is there for starting point guard?

Personally for me there's two options: You bring back Lowry and go all in and know that it's gonna suck at the end or you he signs elsewhere and you rebuild.

 

[Eyedea]

There's a few PGs that will be on the market that fall into that 2nd/3rd tier which could be perfectly fine for this team. Hill, Teague, Mills, Holiday, Collison, maybe even Milos Teodosic.

 

[The_Chosen_One]

There's a few PGs that will be on the market that fall into that 2nd/3rd tier which could be perfectly fine for this team. Hill, Teague, Mills, Holiday, Collison, maybe even Milos Teodosic.

I think Raptors need a top tier PG. There's no way around it especially considering that Demar doesn't have a three-point shot.

We'd be better off not resigning Lowry and taking a tax hit to get that top PG solution. Personally, I'd resign Lowry if such an acquisition can be made.

 

[Eyedea]

I think Raptors need a top tier PG. There's no way around it especially considering that Demar doesn't have a three-point shot.

We'd be better off not resigning Lowry and taking a tax hit to get that top PG solution. Personally, I'd resign Lowry if such an acquisition can be made.

They're all pretty effective shooters (though Holiday hasn't been as good recently), especially in the postseason. 3 point shooting and top tier PGs are not exactly mutually exclusive characteristics.

I'll postface this by saying that it's not even a foregone conclusion that the Raptors will bring in a new PG if Lowry leaves. They'll have CoJo, Wright, and VanVleet, and they will need to move salary out to even entertain offers to the rest of the pack in free agency.

 

[McDeepika]

3 point shooting isn't going to solve the problem. The Cavs can do it because Lebron is a ridiculously good passer. We don't have anybody that can fire cross court passes with such velocity.

To beat the Cavs you need to load up on players that can handle the ball. They have a lot of weak defenders who they are able to hide on guys like Patterson/Carroll/Tucker. Guys like Frye are liabilities against the Warriors because Green would expose him defensively.

I do think Wright/Poetel can replace JV/Joseph while saving money to bring back Lowry/Ibaka. The problem is the SF position. Need to replace Carroll with a guy who can create offensive mismatches.

 

[Patmac40]

Would Gallinari be a guy that would help create offensive mismatches? He opted out of his contract, though it looks like he wants to still stay in Denver.

 

[Diamond Joe Quimby]

They're all pretty effective shooters (though Holiday hasn't been as good recently), especially in the postseason. 3 point shooting and top tier PGs are not exactly mutually exclusive characteristics.

I'll postface this by saying that it's not even a foregone conclusion that the Raptors will bring in a new PG if Lowry leaves. They'll have CoJo, Wright, and VanVleet, and they will need to move salary out to even entertain offers to the rest of the pack in free agency.

Joseph could be your Beverley. Honestly, the only free agent worth the max, or at least who I'd invest in is Hayward.

The mid-tier PG's are going to get overpaid on some Crabbe ish.

 

[IronHalen]

I mean they're not really wrong...
http://www.sportsnet.ca/basketball/nba/kevin-garnett-time-break-toronto/

 

[LoveRealHockey]

This is no NBA championship for at least 3-4 years because of Lebron

So the Raptors have to decide
1. Are we content to keep the core we have, add some pieces so that we can shoot for 2nd in the conference and be happy making conference finals (maybe get lucky if Cav's suffer some injuries to their top players like Lebron or Irving? If yes, we look to re-sign Lowry (3 years + option if he'll accept it - which I doubt), try to find a consistent 3 point shooter that can start and defend, retain Ibaka and Tucker; let Patterson go, consider trading JV if they can get the 3 point shooter that can also defend.

2. Look to stay competitive but start to re-build the core to contend for NBA championship in 3-4 years. Don't re-sign Lowry, don't re-sign Patterson, don't re-sign Tucker (although he could be a good mentor for younger players), trade JV for some young assets (and draft picks), keep Joseph, Powell, Ibaka and young players currently on the roster to stay competitive. In 3-4 years target the star(s) you need by managing cap space until then.

As for Casey, I'm not sure if matters one way or the other in terms of the options. He's a good (but not great) coach that could be a good fit for younger player development. I'm easy either way, retain him or look for a new coach.

2 basic problems remains: 1) offense. They are predictable and not very creative. They can't consistently score 3's which is now pretty fundamental in today's NBA. JV is good at what he does but he's a dying bred. He can score of the screen and roll and short jumpers but he's a liability on defense.
2) can't defend the 3 pointer.

No easy decisions here. Really interested to see what our GM will do next

 

[hizzoner]

This team is a decent second tier team along with several other teams. They have no hope, as others have pointed out, of getting to NBA finals. Choice is to stay a good second tier team that is aging, or look to shake things up with the hope of being exciting while developing a new good young core. I prefer the latter. Time for JV, PP, KL to go. Tucker and Ibeka will be expensive and while you might bring one back no need for both. Use the money to find players who can win in this new NBA---speed on offence and defense, athleticism and 3 point shooting.

 

[Woodman19]

Masai is pissed in his press conference, he keeps taking subtle and not so subtle jabs at Casey. Sounds like we might fire him.

 

[Giuseppe Sallo]

I mean they're not really wrong...
http://www.sportsnet.ca/basketball/nba/kevin-garnett-time-break-toronto/

Oh the irony! KV was part of that "superteam" with PP/Allen.

Durant did the same thing, "if you can't beat then, join them!"

 

[Vexed]

Joseph could be your Beverley. Honestly, the only free agent worth the max, or at least who I'd invest in is Hayward.

The mid-tier PG's are going to get overpaid on some Crabbe ish.

Yea if Lowry moves on, I'm okay with CoJo at PG with Wright behind him. I'd rather spend that money somewhere else than on any of the PG's floating around. Its hard to say though. The NBA cap is hard to work with.

 

[Giuseppe Sallo]

This team is a decent second tier team along with several other teams. They have no hope, as others have pointed out, of getting to NBA finals.

Only one hope: build a superteam!

Raps are very good, they could beat Celtics/wiz/jazz, not the spurs tho. I just feel like their time is up with this core, you got four years to prove your worth...well? We can beat the cavs. They're unstoppable.

Go cheap, reconstruct the core, and build on youth IMO.

 

[Giuseppe Sallo]

We need a culture change. - ujiri

Wow! He's gonna blow it up, possibly.

 

[Woodman19]

We need a culture change. - ujiri

Wow! He's gonna blow it up, possibly.

"We're not going to pound, pound, pound on something that doesn't work."

Direct shot at Casey. He also said something along the lines of, you can only change the players so many times before you have to look elsewhere

 

[RayzorIsDull]

"We're not going to pound, pound, pound on something that doesn't work."

Direct shot at Casey. He also said something along the lines of, you can only change the players so many times before you have to look elsewhere

That was a foolish statement by Ujiri. I don't like Casey but with the roster he was given there was no other style they could play.

 

[stickty111]

"We're not going to pound, pound, pound on something that doesn't work."

Direct shot at Casey. He also said something along the lines of, you can only change the players so many times before you have to look elsewhere

Good quote said by Masai. Casey would do the same thing even if wasnt working.
Casey was just stuck in his own ways. Nice to have a great GM that recognized the fauls with the coach.

 

[RayzorIsDull]

Good quote said by Masai. Casey would do the same thing even if wasnt working.
Casey was just stuck in his own ways. Nice to have a great GM that recognized the fauls with the coach.

So what should have Casey done without Lowry the last 2 games and a guy in Carroll who was expected to play 30 mpg but was a shell of his former self? A lottery pick who got 10 mpg a game because he fouls too much. Other young guys who clearly aren't ready. Casey didn't have many options and that's because of Ujiri.

 

[Suntouchable13]

Good quote said by Masai. Casey would do the same thing even if wasnt working.
Casey was just stuck in his own ways. Nice to have a great GM that recognized the fauls with the coach.

I think he also admitted to his own fault too. Tucker and Ibaka did not make a difference. He tried it, but it did not work. Clearly.

 

[stickty111]

I think he also admitted to his own fault too. Tucker and Ibaka did not make a difference. He tried it, but it did not work. Clearly.

He did for sure. I think we were even surprised it ended as badly as it did. Masai deserves some blame there.
With that being said, without Casey who kept doing the same thing, and a better coach, we put up much more of a fight.
Casey needs to go and its good Masai recognized the coach's shortcomings

 

[McDeepika]

My biggest complaint with Casey is his treatment of Derozan. He lets Derozan get away with playing no defense and forcing up stupid shots. Derozan pick and roll doesn't work because teams just blitz him and he can't pass out of double teams. Should be trying to spread the floor and getting him post-ups or having him come off screens for mid-range jumpers.

 

[RayzorIsDull]

My biggest complaint with Casey is his treatment of Derozan. He lets Derozan get away with playing no defense and forcing up stupid shots. Derozan pick and roll doesn't work because teams just blitz him and he can't pass out of double teams. Should be trying to spread the floor and getting him post-ups or having him come off screens for mid-range jumpers.

They blitz DeRozan because the opposition doesn't respect the other options the Raptos have. Nobody is going to make the opposition pay.

 

[Diamond Joe Quimby]

My biggest complaint with Casey is his treatment of Derozan. He lets Derozan get away with playing no defense and forcing up stupid shots. Derozan pick and roll doesn't work because teams just blitz him and he can't pass out of double teams. Should be trying to spread the floor and getting him post-ups or having him come off screens for mid-range jumpers.

Bruh. You can double and collapse on any ball dominating driver if the people around him can't shoot.

Also, the best scorers on the majority of the teams in the NBA are not defensive stoppers (save for Kawhi, George). LeBron was terrible defensively in the regular reason, and is literally now just playing a free safety position, which is defensive set designed to a) save his legs by not forcing him to be an on ball defender b) use him as your primary rim protector because you don't have another one.