Utica Comets relocating to Abbotsford, Binghamton Devils to Utica

[Big Z Man 1990]

With both Eastern division having 8, the Central having 6 and the Pacific having 10, this could be the playoff format:

Top 6 teams in Pacific
Top 4 in Central
Top 5 in both Eastern Divisions

Playoffs remain strictly within divisions until playoff division champions are crowned.

 

[gstommylee]

With both Eastern division having 8, the Central having 6 and the Pacific having 10, this could be the playoff format:

Top 6 teams in Pacific
Top 4 in Central
Top 5 in both Eastern Divisions

Playoffs remain strictly within divisions until playoff division champions are crowned.

I doubt that will actually be the alignment. NO way the AHL only has 6 in central and 10 in pacific.

 

[GrGriffins]

Pacific: Abbotsford, Bakersfield, Henderson, Ontario, Palm Springs, San Diego, San Jose, Stockton
Central: Chicago, Colorado, Iowa, Manitoba, Milwaukee, Rockford, Texas, Tucson
North: Belleville, Cleveland, Grand Rapids, Laval, Rochester, Syracuse, Toronto, Utica
Atlantic: Bridgeport, Charlotte, Hartford, Hershey, Lehigh Valley, Providence, Springfield, Wilkes-Barre/Scranton

Fairly cut and dry if you ask me.

Or it could end up like this:

Eastern Conference:

Atlantic: Bridgeport, Charlotte, Hartford, Hershey, Lehigh Valley, Providence, Springfield, Wilkes-Barre/Scranton

North: Belleville, Cleveland, Grand Rapids, Laval, Rochester, Syracuse, Toronto, Utica

Western Conference:

Central: Chicago, Colorado, Henderson, Iowa, Manitoba, Milwaukee, Rockford, Texas

Pacific: Abbotsford, Bakersfield, Ontario, Palm Springs (2022), San Diego, San Jose, Stockton, Tucson

Bascially you take Henderson and Colorado out of the Pacific and move them to the Central. Take Grand Rapids out the Central and move them to the North and into the Eastern Conference to basically replace Binghamton. This set up put all the Eastern time zone teams in one conference with Grand Rapids finally moving to the North and out the Central (Western Conference). I guess it all comes down to where the AHL puts Henderson and Tucson.

 

[gstommylee]

Or it could end up like this:

Eastern Conference:

Atlantic: Bridgeport, Charlotte, Hartford, Hershey, Lehigh Valley, Providence, Springfield, Wilkes-Barre/Scranton

North: Belleville, Cleveland, Grand Rapids, Laval, Rochester, Syracuse, Toronto, Utica

Western Conference:

Central: Chicago, Colorado, Henderson, Iowa, Manitoba, Milwaukee, Rockford, Texas

Pacific: Abbotsford, Bakersfield, Ontario, Palm Springs (2022), San Diego, San Jose, Stockton, Tucson

Bascially you take Henderson and Colorado out of the Pacific and move them to the Central. Take Grand Rapids out the Central and move them to the North and into the Eastern Conference to basically replace Binghamton. This set up put all the Eastern time zone teams in one conference with Grand Rapids finally moving to the North and out the Central (Western Conference). I guess it all comes down to where the AHL puts Henderson and Tucson.

I think Henderson is more west than Tuscon. Checking google map shows it is. This is no different then how it was with the NHL. Having to put the Arizona team in central division due to another team in pacific.

You would be finanically harming Henderson by forcing it to fly to the other divisional games when its even closer to the other pacific teams than Tuscon is.

 

[PCSPounder]

I think Henderson is more west than Tuscon. Checking google map shows it is. This is no different then how it was with the NHL. Having to put the Arizona team in central division due to another team in pacific.

You would be finanically harming Henderson by forcing it to fly to the other divisional games when its even closer to the other pacific teams than Tuscon is.

I’m going back to the thing that held together the Tacoma-to-Nashville Pacific Coast League. Las Vegas would have lost their baseball team under normal circumstances, but the league waited out old Cashman Field for 10-15 years because flights to Vegas are cheap and plentiful. Vegas being a flight hub made that behemoth possible, so Henderson being in the Central while Tucson is in the Pacific isn’t THAT far fetched.

Henderson should still want to be Pacific; I’m just mulling possibilities. Aiming for the more logical 8-8-8-8 might harm Tucson-in-Central more than it would Henderson-in-Central.

 

[royals119]

I think Henderson is more west than Tuscon. Checking google map shows it is. This is no different then how it was with the NHL. Having to put the Arizona team in central division due to another team in pacific.

You would be financially harming Henderson by forcing it to fly to the other divisional games when its even closer to the other pacific teams than Tuscon is.

If they did it, they would have Henderson play mostly against the California teams, and have a weekend series against most of the central teams. It wouldn't be the first time a team was listed in one division and played a lot of their games against a different division because of geography. This isn't the NHL where there is a set schedule matrix where teams have to play certain teams a specific number of times each year.

 

[AdmiralsFan24]

They really don't. Travel costs are first and foremost. So what are they going to do? They're not going to put like Colorado and Tucson in a Central Division with Manitoba, Chicago, Iowa, Rockford, Milwaukee and Texas. They're going to put them in a division with with Henderson, Bakersfield, San Diego, Ontario, Stockton, San Jose, Palm Springs, Abbotsford. That might be a bit too extreme, even for the AHL which is why I suggested 8 4 teams divisions.

Holy shit you guys. It's like I actually knew what I was talking about. Some teams are playing 76 games, others are playing 72, others are playing 68 and they have two 7 team divisions and a 9 team division because they do not give a shit about anything close to even divisions.

 

[oknazevad]

Interesting that doesn't have Palm Springs on there.

 

[Agalloch]

Interesting that doesn't have Palm Springs on there.

Their arena will be ready for the 22-23 season.

 

[PCSPounder]

Their arena will be ready for the 22-23 season.

And with their timeline, not a moment before.

 

[GarbageGoal]

"Travel costs are first and foremost", yet you have placed Bridgeport, Hartford, Springfield and Providence all in different divisions?

Yeah, that's not gonna happen......

 

[royals119]

Holy shit you guys. It's like I actually knew what I was talking about. Some teams are playing 76 games, others are playing 72, others are playing 68 and they have two 7 team divisions and a 9 team division because they do not give a shit about anything close to even divisions.

The did also announce that this will be a transition year, and for 22-23 all teams will play 72 games, so at least that is finally solved.

They obviously didn't announce a division alignment for that season yet, but if the over/under on the Pacific division is 9, I'm taking the over.

 

[LadyStanley]

If PS comes into Pacific, that's 10 in the division (as configured today).

May have to lose Colorado to Central or something. Tucson maybe too. (Especially if they want four divisions of 8 teams each)

With all teams going to 72 games, next season, it may make for better equality to move teams around. (IOW, NHL teams may want their team in the Pacific to have more practice time, less travel, due to 68 games.)

 

[Barclay Donaldson]

If PS comes into Pacific, that's 10 in the division (as configured today).

May have to lose Colorado to Central or something. Tucson maybe too. (Especially if they want four divisions of 8 teams each)

With all teams going to 72 games, next season, it may make for better equality to move teams around. (IOW, NHL teams may want their team in the Pacific to have more practice time, less travel, due to 68 games.)

If this latest divisional setup showcases anything, it is that the AHL does not care about even divisions or uniformity. They care about travel and nothing else. Easier call-ups while keeping easy travel is the entire reason for the western shift.

 

[StreetHawk]

If this latest divisional setup showcases anything, it is that the AHL does not care about even divisions or uniformity. They care about travel and nothing else. Easier call-ups while keeping easy travel is the entire reason for the western shift.

It’s a developmental league so that makes sense. Plus I don’t think they need to match the NHL’s 82 game season. Anything over 60 games is fine. Gives them more practice time and off ice work to improve skills.

 

[Barclay Donaldson]

It’s a developmental league so that makes sense. Plus I don’t think they need to match the NHL’s 82 game season. Anything over 60 games is fine. Gives them more practice time and off ice work to improve skills.

That was one of the stated reasons for Vancouver keeping their team in Utica as long as they did. Nearly every in conference trip was a short bus ride away. Abbotsford nearest trip is Utica's furthest trip.

 

[CHRDANHUTCH]

It’s a developmental league so that makes sense. Plus I don’t think they need to match the NHL’s 82 game season. Anything over 60 games is fine. Gives them more practice time and off ice work to improve skills.

no it actually wasn't:

the major complaint that's now being rectified is why the Pacific plays 68; the explanations ad nauseum since as to why that division got 68;

I still remember 80 per season which then was revised to 78, now 76, and now 72 by 2022/23...

it will simply end the explanation of the Pacific being favorited over the East......

 

[Big Z Man 1990]

I'm guessing Colorado to Central and Grand Rapids to North in 2022

 

[royals119]

no it actually wasn't:

the major complaint that's now being rectified is why the Pacific plays 68; the explanations ad nauseum since as to why that division got 68;

I still remember 80 per season which then was revised to 78, now 76, and now 72 by 2022/23...

it will simply end the explanation of the Pacific being favorited over the East......

The Pacific division wasn't being shown favoritism. Many of the eastern teams are owned independently, and they want more games because that enables them to sell more tickets and make more money (or lose less). Plus they have a season ticket holder base that has been paying for 78 or 76 games. If they cut to 68 they would have to lower those package prices, or piss people off. The western teams were all new, so they didn't have that issue, and they are all owned by the NHL club and are more concerned with development than turning a profit. The two groups couldn't agree, so they compromised and played different schedules. "The league" isn't some organization of people who tell the teams what to do. It is run by the board of governors, who are either the owners, or their representatives. "The league" just does that the majority of teams decide they want. They finally came to an agreement on a common number of games - likely because teams have changed hands, and new people are in charge.

 

[CHRDANHUTCH]

The Pacific division wasn't being shown favoritism. Many of the eastern teams are owned independently, and they want more games because that enables them to sell more tickets and make more money (or lose less). Plus they have a season ticket holder base that has been paying for 78 or 76 games. If they cut to 68 they would have to lower those package prices, or piss people off. The western teams were all new, so they didn't have that issue, and they are all owned by the NHL club and are more concerned with development than turning a profit. The two groups couldn't agree, so they compromised and played different schedules. "The league" isn't some organization of people who tell the teams what to do. It is run by the board of governors, who are either the owners, or their representatives. "The league" just does that the majority of teams decide they want. They finally came to an agreement on a common number of games - likely because teams have changed hands, and new people are in charge.

again you forgot....

the Pacific forced its way in 2014/2015, Royals, and you've already admitted that you didn't follow the League then so not buying the false narrative you have laid out....

because as the story goes, why was Tucson created and what did Springfield do in 2015? they stole a franchise from another market just as they did when Worcester arrived a decade before that created the Falcons franchise, now whether you believe that was accurate or not, that's the reality

the entire LEAGUE fanbase, independent of team, got sick and tired of explaining why that decision was made beginning in 2014, and as I recall, San Antonio (now Henderson) AND Texas played 76 games that season while aligned in the Pacific Division

name the last time all AHL member clubs played each other via the master schedule, which has been concreted for 8 to 10 years prior to 2001, when the league went to 27

 

[Bear of Bad News]

the entire LEAGUE fanbase, independent of team, got sick and tired of explaining why that decision was made beginning in 2014

Well, it's a discussion forum. If you're personally tired of explaining something, feel free to abstain from explaining.

 

[CHRDANHUTCH]

Well, it's a discussion forum. If you're personally tired of explaining something, feel free to abstain from explaining.

it's not just a specific poster, all the posters, independent of team affiliation got tired of explaining it, nor was there any recourse for a fanbase to change that.

 

[Bear of Bad News]

That's fine - if you're tired of explaining something, feel free to sit it out.

 

[royals119]

again you forgot....

the Pacific forced its way in 2014/2015, Royals, and you've already admitted that you didn't follow the League then so not buying the false narrative you have laid out....

Forced their way in? The pacific teams had some kind of blackmail over the other owners? The board of governors called security to have them removed from a meeting, but they chained themselves to the chairs and refused to leave? Maybe YOU didn't want them, and one or two of the AHL owners didn't, but the majority of the AHL board saw the advantages of bringing in a pacific division. Especially when the alternative was to lose several teams to an upstart AAA western league supported by a group of NHL owners. I'm an original Royals STH, since 2001, so I started following the AHL at that time, since ECHL teams are greatly affected by the AHL. Lots of posters here, and on the old HF-AHL Monarchs board, were a part of how I learned about the league.

because as the story goes, why was Tucson created and what did Springfield do in 2015? they stole a franchise from another market just as they did when Worcester arrived a decade before that created the Falcons franchise, now whether you believe that was accurate or not, that's the reality

Springfield STOLE a franchise? Literally broke into the AHL offices and grabbed the title to the team like Watergate? Or did they go to the arena with moving trucks and kidnap the players and take the equipment too? Although I can't prove it, I think they actually paid for the franchise.

the entire LEAGUE fanbase, independent of team, got sick and tired of explaining why that decision was made beginning in 2014, and as I recall, San Antonio (now Henderson) AND Texas played 76 games that season while aligned in the Pacific Division

You really interviewed every fan of every AHL team to find out that they ALL were sick and tired of explaining the schedule? I would bet real money there were fans who never had to explain it once - and probably some fans who weren't even aware of the fact that some teams played a different number of games.

name the last time all AHL member clubs played each other via the master schedule, which has been concreted for 8 to 10 years prior to 2001, when the league went to 27

You want me to name the last time every AHL team played every other team, which you say was the case prior to 2001? I'll take a wild guess and say 2000.


As usual, you are changing the subject. None of this supports your contention that the AHL showed favoritism to the Pacific Division. As I said, the owners simply had different priorities and they compromised - as often happens when you have large groups trying to work together. Someone could look at it the other way and say the Eastern teams were shown favoritism by getting to play more games, and therefore sell more tickets and make more money. In reality both groups got what they wanted.

 

[CHRDANHUTCH]

Forced their way in? The pacific teams had some kind of blackmail over the other owners? The board of governors called security to have them removed from a meeting, but they chained themselves to the chairs and refused to leave? Maybe YOU didn't want them, and one or two of the AHL owners didn't, but the majority of the AHL board saw the advantages of bringing in a pacific division. Especially when the alternative was to lose several teams to an upstart AAA western league supported by a group of NHL owners. I'm an original Royals STH, since 2001, so I started following the AHL at that time, since ECHL teams are greatly affected by the AHL. Lots of posters here, and on the old HF-AHL Monarchs board, were a part of how I learned about the league.



Springfield STOLE a franchise? Literally broke into the AHL offices and grabbed the title to the team like Watergate? Or did they go to the arena with moving trucks and kidnap the players and take the equipment too? Although I can't prove it, I think they actually paid for the franchise.



You really interviewed every fan of every AHL team to find out that they ALL were sick and tired of explaining the schedule? I would bet real money there were fans who never had to explain it once - and probably some fans who weren't even aware of the fact that some teams played a different number of games.



You want me to name the last time every AHL team played every other team, which you say was the case prior to 2001? I'll take a wild guess and say 2000.


As usual, you are changing the subject. None of this supports your contention that the AHL showed favoritism to the Pacific Division. As I said, the owners simply had different priorities and they compromised - as often happens when you have large groups trying to work together. Someone could look at it the other way and say the Eastern teams were shown favoritism by getting to play more games, and therefore sell more tickets and make more money. In reality both groups got what they wanted.

and again, I ask the question, Royals, how attune were you to the inner workings of the AHL, from the late 70s until 2015.....

the Pacific Division had been in the background for at least 20 years before it was executed in 2014, which is why both Manchester and Worcester disappeared in 2014, because of the decision made by LA AND SJ (remember Worcester was in the initial discussions with SJ about extending their contract before breaking off those discussions.

it was also stated had it been not approved in 2014..... it would've been done by the end of the decade