University Of Toronto Study: Canada can support an addtional SIX franchises

Koss

Registered User
I doubt Hamilton could support a team; league expenses have skyrocketed since they were last seriously considered. A second Southern Ontario team should be located in downtown Toronto though. No owner in the US wants to see Hamilton come into their buildings; very few in the US have ever even heard of Hamilton. Copps is not an NHL caliber building by any means.

IMO, this is the problem with the NHL. They are marketing themselves to non-hockey fans. As hockey fan, I would love to see my team play any other team in the league.
 

edog37

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Jan 21, 2007
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Pittsburgh
the question isn't whether Canada could support more teams, the question should be can the league support more teams....I assume some of these teams come from relocation sources, but 6 expansion teams would dillute the overall product way too much...
 

edog37

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Jan 21, 2007
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IMO, this is the problem with the NHL. They are marketing themselves to non-hockey fans. As hockey fan, I would love to see my team play any other team in the league.

in order for the league to grow, you have to market to non-hockey fans. That's how you turn them into fans. It's also how you turn fans into players & find new talent sources. I agree Canada should have more teams, but I am not sure the league needs more teams.
 

BigFatCat999

First Fubu and now Pred303. !@#$! you cancer
Apr 23, 2007
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Heh, I'll avoid the smack back on the University of Nashville crack.

Fact is, a LOT of Preds fans want Canadian expansion. I personally would like three more teams in Canada; Winnipeg, QC, Hamilton. 6 would be stretching it. I could see a 4th with a 2nd (No kidding there's a team already in Toronto?) team in Toronto.

Other than Winnipeg, what's the largest city in western Canada without a team?
 

MAROONSRoad

f/k/a Ghost
Feb 24, 2007
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6 more? I call bs.

Really? The USA has less than 10 times the population of Canada but supports:

24 NHL teams
29 NBA teams
32 NFL teams
29 MLB teams
------------------
116 professional teams

(and that's not even including the large NCAA Football and Basketball programs of which there are no equivalent programs in Canada really)

Canada has 6 NHL teams, 1 NBA team and 1 MLB team. Total: 8 professional teams.

I would classify the CFL as (at best) equivalent to NCAA Football in terms of required support.

GHOST
 
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Fugu

Guest
The brain dead simple answer is that yes, GTA can support another team or two. ;)


After that, I always look at ways of protecting the smaller Cdn teams from the CAD:USD factor. Had the NHL had a real plan in place prior to the last lockout, you wouldn't have had the likes of Levitt using their plight to bolster the flawed plan that came out in the new CBA. One size rarely fits all.
 

dronald

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Mar 4, 2011
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Hamilton, ON

Has it ever been admitted by the NHL that Toronto or Buffalo can veto Hamilton? I think Buffalo is afraid people in St Catherines and Niagara Falls would rather drive 30 - 45 mins to Hamilton than cross the border.
 

MAROONSRoad

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Feb 24, 2007
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So what? The CFL is western based and has high ratings. We shouldn't be denied just because of some others needs.

I'm a nationalist not globalist. Hopelessly out of date, I know. ;)

BTW, has Toronto become a world class city yet? I know the locals have always been obsessed with that. :laugh:

GHOST
 

LeftCoast

Registered User
Aug 1, 2006
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Vancouver
I haven't read the whole report, just the summary, however nothing in the summary or opinion pieces really addresses TV and advertising revenue. The focus is entirely on gate revenues. While league revenues are primarily gate driven, broadcast revenues are still a significant piece of the picture.

Adding more teams in Canada wouldn't significantly increase national TV broadcast revenues in Canada, but would reduce the revenue per team. Relocating as many as 6 teams from the US to Canada would also likely reduce US national TV revenues as whomever ends up with the TV rights would reach fewer markets.

Two team markets would also mean splitting local TV, corporate and advertising revenues. GTA could easily support this, but Montreal is questionable and Vancouver would not.

This would also mean the NHL pretty much abandoning it's 20 year effort to expand the profile of the game in the US. While the struggles of some of the southern teams might indicate the strategy is failing, I don't think a mass pull out of the US is the right move.
 

The Apologist

Apologizing for Leaf garbage since 1979
Oct 16, 2007
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Melrose Munch

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Mar 18, 2007
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Has it ever been admitted by the NHL that Toronto or Buffalo can veto Hamilton? I think Buffalo is afraid people in St Catherines and Niagara Falls would rather drive 30 - 45 mins to Hamilton than cross the border.
Not publicly. As far as I know all they have to pay is a big fee.

I'm a nationalist not globalist. Hopelessly out of date, I know. ;)

BTW, has Toronto become a world class city yet? I know the locals have always been obsessed with that. :laugh:

GHOST
The NHL needs a wake up call and losing its biggest market in Canada is one.
 

Melrose Munch

Registered User
Mar 18, 2007
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I understand the three GTA teams thing, but could Ontario really support 6 teams?

Ottawa
Toronto
SW Ontario
Toronto North
Buffalo
Detroit

that's a lot of hockey for 9 million people
Personally no. But one in Mississauga or Hamilton or even Oshawa should be good.
 

Melrose Munch

Registered User
Mar 18, 2007
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I haven't read the whole report, just the summary, however nothing in the summary or opinion pieces really addresses TV and advertising revenue. The focus is entirely on gate revenues. While league revenues are primarily gate driven, broadcast revenues are still a significant piece of the picture.

Adding more teams in Canada wouldn't significantly increase national TV broadcast revenues in Canada, but would reduce the revenue per team. Relocating as many as 6 teams from the US to Canada would also likely reduce US national TV revenues as whomever ends up with the TV rights would reach fewer markets.

Two team markets would also mean splitting local TV, corporate and advertising revenues. GTA could easily support this, but Montreal is questionable and Vancouver would not.

This would also mean the NHL pretty much abandoning it's 20 year effort to expand the profile of the game in the US. While the struggles of some of the southern teams might indicate the strategy is failing, I don't think a mass pull out of the US is the right move.

Me Neither. Houston needs a team for example. But all this losing money, financial, etc is taking a toll on the leagues rep.
 

The Apologist

Apologizing for Leaf garbage since 1979
Oct 16, 2007
12,208
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Adding more teams in Canada wouldn't significantly increase national TV broadcast revenues in Canada, but would reduce the revenue per team. Relocating as many as 6 teams from the US to Canada would also likely reduce US national TV revenues as whomever ends up with the TV rights would reach fewer markets.

Are we still holding out hope for that payday? Really?
 

berklon

Registered User
Dec 24, 2008
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6 is pushing it... and really is too much.

Just 3 more in Canada (Winnipeg, Quebec City and Hamilton) and the NHL would be set for Canada.
 

Jesus Christ Horburn

Registered User
Aug 22, 2008
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I think there's only space for four more:

1) Winnipeg
2) Quebec City
3) Hamilton
*4) Toronto #2 (MLSE won't let this one happen)

I could maybe see another team in Montreal, but I have a strong feeling that they would become the Clippers of the NHL.

Montreal lives and breathes Habs hockey (more so than Toronto with the Leafs IMO)
 

Drake1588

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Frankly, were I looking at investment of more franchises in the heartland of hockey, I'd probably be more bullish on additional teams in the Golden Horseshoe, Vancouver and Montreal before Winnipeg and Quebec. Sure, the latter two are nicer from a geographic dispersal point of view, but it's all about the demographics, and the three big cities are still underserved.
 

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