GDT: UFC Fight Night: Cejudo vs. Dillashaw

[m9]

You go deeper into the prelims than I do, though. I don't feel like I've even seen that many flyweight fights over the last several years unless it has involved DJ, Cejudo, and Joey B. I definitely haven't seen any unranked flyweights.

So if they want to keep the entire division, it's really no skin off my nose. If they get rid of it, I probably wouldn't miss it. If they want to trim it, that's fine, too.

The only way I'd feel strongly about it is if it somehow came down to having a 125lb division or the 165lb division. In that case, yeah, get rid of it immediately.

They go 50 deep in terms of rostered flyweights, at least as of November. To compare, that's about the same as the woman's 115lb division and maybe 20% less than 265 or 205lbs. I think if they rolled with about half that they could still have ranked guys and a couple prospects.

But if they end up scrapping the division, whatever. I won't lose any sleep either way.

 

[pistolpete11]

They go 50 deep in terms of rostered flyweights, at least as of November. To compare, that's about the same as the woman's 115lb division and maybe 20% less than 265 or 205lbs. I think if they rolled with about half that they could still have ranked guys and a couple prospects.

But if they end up scrapping the division, whatever. I won't lose any sleep either way.

For you, that might make a difference. For me, I don't think I would notice it since I usually only watch the main card and the prelim main event. Occasionally I'll catch more of it if it's an especially stacked card. Flyweight fights are usually on the prelims unless it is one of the top guys in which case, I'm good watching it.

I don't really know the best way to build a division. I just know from the past, when a dominant champ loses, it can kind of opens up the division and creates some good fights. It happened when Ronda lost. It happened when Aldo lost. It's kind of happening now after Joanna lost. It will never turn into the 155-170-185 type of division, but if it adds some intriguing fights every now and then, I think it's worth keeping it around. If the UFC thinks the best way to do that is to keep 50+ guys, OK. I won't be watching the #49 vs. #50 just like I won't be watching #49 vs. #50 in the lightweight division either.

 

[Avs_19]

I've also been indifferent about the flyweights and don't really care either way but I think they're going to run into the same problems. It's not just an issue with the depth either, there's an issue at the top as well. I don't mind Benavidez but there's nothing about his performance against Ortiz or the first fight against Cejudo that makes me excited about a rematch. Then you have guys like Formiga, Borg, Moraga, etc in the top five of that division. They already let two of the best go (DJ and Horiguchi) and Pettis has moved up.

 

[pistolpete11]

I've also been indifferent about the flyweights and don't really care either way but I think they're going to run into the same problems. It's not just an issue with the depth either, there's an issue at the top as well. I don't mind Benavidez but there's nothing about his performance against Ortiz or the first fight against Cejudo that makes me excited about a rematch. Then you have guys like Formiga, Borg, Moraga, etc in the top five of that division. They already let two of the best go (DJ and Horiguchi) and Pettis has moved up.

I guess the question they have to answer is if that is a 'now problem' or if it's a problem with the population of humans that can make 125lb and are willing to be locked in a cage to fist fight? Outside of like 155-170-185, where the majority of athletic humans are, I think it's common for the divisions to go in cycles. Flyweight might be doomed to fail or it might go on an up cycle now that DJ isn't dominating everyone.

Edit: And even though losing DJ is obviously a major hit to the overall talent in the division, I think it might help create some competition and excitement in the division.

And did Pettis move up because he can't make 125? Or was he trying to get a head start at 135 because he thought the division was going to be closed? Because I don't think he has much of a future at 135. Especially the top guys.

 

[m9]

For you, that might make a difference. For me, I don't think I would notice it since I usually only watch the main card and the prelim main event. Occasionally I'll catch more of it if it's an especially stacked card. Flyweight fights are usually on the prelims unless it is one of the top guys in which case, I'm good watching it.

I don't really know the best way to build a division. I just know from the past, when a dominant champ loses, it can kind of opens up the division and creates some good fights. It happened when Ronda lost. It happened when Aldo lost. It's kind of happening now after Joanna lost. It will never turn into the 155-170-185 type of division, but if it adds some intriguing fights every now and then, I think it's worth keeping it around. If the UFC thinks the best way to do that is to keep 50+ guys, OK. I won't be watching the #49 vs. #50 just like I won't be watching #49 vs. #50 in the lightweight division either.

Here's the thing - you probably do watch the #49 and #50 155lb guys, you just don't really notice it because there's so much depth. You've probably seen Abel Trujillo, Joe Lauzon, Evan Dunham, etc who are all probably around that. Guys like John Makdessi, Bobby Green, and Lando Vannata aren't top 25 fighters in the UFC LW division, but you've probably seen them a couple times.

As for flyweight fights, yeah if you only watch the top 6 or 7 fights on each card you will miss most of them. I think the UFC has made an effort in the last year to phase them out a bit by placing them earlier on the cards. Whether that's due to public disinterest or they knew they were killing of the division soon, who knows.

 

[pistolpete11]

Here's the thing - you probably do watch the #49 and #50 155lb guys, you just don't really notice it because there's so much depth. You've probably seen Abel Trujillo, Joe Lauzon, Evan Dunham, etc who are all probably around that. Guys like John Makdessi, Bobby Green, and Lando Vannata aren't top 25 fighters in the UFC LW division, but you've probably seen them a couple times.

As for flyweight fights, yeah if you only watch the top 6 or 7 fights on each card you will miss most of them. I think the UFC has made an effort in the last year to phase them out a bit by placing them earlier on the cards. Whether that's due to public disinterest or they knew they were killing of the division soon, who knows.

Maybe so but I can't tell you the last time I said, "I can't wait for the Joe Lauzon fight!"

To me, they are as much filler as most of the flyweight fights.

 

[Rocko604]

TJ needs to shut the f*** up. He got knocked down 4 times, was NOT defending himself, and was trying to single leg the ref when it ended. Cejudo won, clearly and decisively.

 

[LSCII]

TJ needs to shut the **** up. He got knocked down 4 times, was NOT defending himself, and was trying to single leg the ref when it ended. Cejudo won, clearly and decisively.

Clearly the cut impacted him, but that's life. Accept the beating like a man and move on. You want a rematch, give the guy a shot at your belt in your weight class if you're so confident you would have bounced back from it...

 

[Rocko604]

I think there will be a rematch. Dana is hellbent about getting rid of that division, and likely Cejudo himself, at this point.

 

[m9]

I think there will be a rematch. Dana is hellbent about getting rid of that division, and likely Cejudo himself, at this point.

Yeah, Dana really has it out for Cejudo. Gave him a rematch for the 125lb belt despite only being 2-1 since his last chance and being brutally finished in the first fight. Then when he wins that fight, they book him to fight in the main event for their first show on the new platform. They'll probably give him a raise or another big fight next just to really dig into him some more.

 

[Avs_19]

I guess the question they have to answer is if that is a 'now problem' or if it's a problem with the population of humans that can make 125lb and are willing to be locked in a cage to fist fight? Outside of like 155-170-185, where the majority of athletic humans are, I think it's common for the divisions to go in cycles. Flyweight might be doomed to fail or it might go on an up cycle now that DJ isn't dominating everyone.

Edit: And even though losing DJ is obviously a major hit to the overall talent in the division, I think it might help create some competition and excitement in the division.

And did Pettis move up because he can't make 125? Or was he trying to get a head start at 135 because he thought the division was going to be closed? Because I don't think he has much of a future at 135. Especially the top guys.

I just wonder if it's too late now. I think Cejudo, DJ, and Horiguchi are the three best flyweights. When is the last time the UFC had a division where two of the three best fighters fought elsewhere? Again, I don't really care whether they keep it or get rid of it but none of those guys below Cejudo are worth getting excited about IMO. We'll probably get the same type of fights and the same level on interest in them moving forward. Just replace DJ with Cejudo as the guy beating lesser competition.

 

[m9]

I just wonder if it's too late now. I think Cejudo, DJ, and Horiguchi are the three best flyweights. When is the last time the UFC had a division where two of the three best fighters fought elsewhere? Again, I don't really care whether they keep it or get rid of it but none of those guys below Cejudo are worth getting excited about IMO. We'll probably get the same type of fights and the same level on interest in them moving forward. Just replace DJ with Cejudo as the guy beating lesser competition.

True, and Cejudo just proved he can hang at 135lbs anyway. He also has had weight-cutting issues in the past and probably should be fighting at 135lbs. Benavidez has shown he can hang at 135lbs in the past. Pettis already moved up. DJ and Horiguchi are already gone. So what are we holding onto? Ray Borg and Jussier Formiga?

I know people think Cejudo winning shows they should keep flyweight, but if anything it just shows that there isn't much difference between the top of the division at either class and you can probably just combine them.

 

[Rocko604]

Yeah, Dana really has it out for Cejudo. Gave him a rematch for the 125lb belt despite only being 2-1 since his last chance and being brutally finished in the first fight. Then when he wins that fight, they book him to fight in the main event for their first show on the new platform. They'll probably give him a raise or another big fight next just to really dig into him some more.

Cutting Cejudo is on the extreme/irrational side I admit, but let's not pretend that Cejudo didn't ruin all of Dana's plans on Saturday. Let's also not pretend Dana isn't irrational either. The sooner he can get rid of flyweight and everyone in that division, the better for him. You see him pouting next to TJ just before Buffer made the official announcement and his rants afterwards?

Also Cejudo didn't prove he could hang at 135. He proved he could beat a 135er at 125. Bit of a difference there. Though I am curious to see what his fight night weight at 135 would be and if he'd have a problem (re-gaining weight, not the result) like GSP did fighting at 185.

 

[m9]

Cutting Cejudo is on the extreme/irrational side I admit, but let's not pretend that Cejudo didn't ruin all of Dana's plans on Saturday. Let's also not pretend Dana isn't irrational either. The sooner he can get rid of flyweight and everyone in that division, the better for him. You see him pouting next to TJ just before Buffer made the official announcement and his rants afterwards?

Also Cejudo didn't prove he could hang at 135. He proved he could beat a 135er at 125. Bit of a difference there. Though I am curious to see what his fight night weight at 135 would be and if he'd have a problem (re-gaining weight, not the result) like GSP did fighting at 185.

Not really sure what you're talking about in regards to Dana & flyweight as nobody really knows what's going on with it right now. I'm going to need more evidence than Dana looking sad and being mad at a ref stoppage to prove he has some sort of hate on Cejudo, though.

As for Cejudo at 135lbs.. I mean, he just beat the 135lb champ. Do you really think he isn't going to stick around and be competitive with ranked guys in the UFC at 135lbs if/when flyweight is gone?

 

[Peter Griffin]

If Dana White and the UFC wanted the Flyweight division gone, they'd remove it. They don't need TJ Dillashaw to go beat up the Flyweight champ in order to justify scrapping the division. That's non-sense.

 

[m9]

If Dana White and the UFC wanted the Flyweight division gone, they'd remove it. They don't need TJ Dillashaw to go beat up the Flyweight champ in order to justify scrapping the division. That's non-sense.

For sure. All they had to do was have that Cejudo/Dillashaw fight at 135lbs, and then the division goes away. Instead they had it at 125lbs, had another 125lb fight on the main card, and also re-signed one of their other top guys in the division (Joseph Benevidez) to a contract extension that same week. Very confusing what their plan is.

 

[Peter Griffin]

For sure. All they had to do was have that Cejudo/Dillashaw fight at 135lbs, and then the division goes away. Instead they had it at 125lbs, had another 125lb fight on the main card, and also re-signed one of their other top guys in the division (Joseph Benevidez) to a contract extension that same week. Very confusing what their plan is.

I think you hit the nail on the head earlier in that for now they're just going to go with a trimmed down 125 roster. With Cejudo as champ, and especially now after beating TJ, there's some new life for that divsion. We'll see where things go in the near future.

 

[m9]

I think you hit the nail on the head earlier in that for now they're just going to go with a trimmed down 125 roster. With Cejudo as champ, and especially now after beating TJ, there's some new life for that divsion. We'll see where things go in the near future.

I think I've flip-flopped on what they should/will do at flyweight about 20 times, so by now I'm pretty confident the correct answer is in there somewhere. I just need to delete the other 19 posts.

 

[Rocko604]

Not really sure what you're talking about in regards to Dana & flyweight as nobody really knows what's going on with it right now. I'm going to need more evidence than Dana looking sad and being mad at a ref stoppage to prove he has some sort of hate on Cejudo, though.

As for Cejudo at 135lbs.. I mean, he just beat the 135lb champ. Do you really think he isn't going to stick around and be competitive with ranked guys in the UFC at 135lbs if/when flyweight is gone?

I guess we'll see how the rematch, if there is one, unfolds. If they promote it all about TJ getting revenge, then I'm going to lean towards Dana wanting the division gone but wants a non flyweight to have the belt before folding it. Personally, I'd rather see Cejudo/Benevides and TJ vs Moraes/Assuncao but the UFC wants champ champs.

As for 135, TJ cut 10 pounds of muscle, didn't have the same nutritional intake and hydration he would have for a 135 fight, and if that rematch were to take place at bantamweight I think it goes much differently. Could Henry hang at 135? Probably but I think he'd be in tough to crack the top 3. I'm intrigued to see how he would do though.

 

[tmurfin]

TJ needs to shut the **** up. He got knocked down 4 times, was NOT defending himself, and was trying to single leg the ref when it ended. Cejudo won, clearly and decisively.

The dudes delusional and egotistical, maybe that's what makes him a great fighter. In his mind he's undefeated. He believed the Dodson stoppage was early, he beat Assuncao and Cruz, and obviously this fight. He must have the worst luck ever.

 

[Mike Mike Caron]

Going for a single leg is the go-to move of every guys who got their brain knocked-out. TJ used his skull as if it was shield, he never even came close to defend against the vast amount of clean head shots.