GDT: UFC 259: Blachowicz vs. Adesanya

pistolpete11

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Wondering if they try to get all 3 WMMA champs on the same card in a couple months:

Nunes v GDR 2 - I know Nunes won the first two times, but their 2nd fight was somewhat competitive. GDR also said that she will retire if she losing to Nunes's again, so that adds some fun.

The rest of the card is already booked:
Shevchenko v Andrade
Zhang v Rose
Weidman v Uriah Hall
Anthony Smith v Jimmy Crute
I don't think Nunes-GDR 2 was all that competitive. I mean, she went the distance and took a round, but Nunes was never in any danger of losing that fight, took her down almost at will, controlled her, and had a 10-8 round or 2 thrown in there as well. It was close only if you're grading on a curve.

There's really no good options, though. Dana said Julianna Pena was blowing him up to get that fight. It would be someone new, but she's2-2 in her last 4. I guess maybe if she beats Holly...
 

m9

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I don't think Nunes-GDR 2 was all that competitive. I mean, she went the distance and took a round, but Nunes was never in any danger of losing that fight, took her down almost at will, controlled her, and had a 10-8 round or 2 thrown in there as well. It was close only if you're grading on a curve.

There's really no good options, though. Dana said Julianna Pena was blowing him up to get that fight. It would be someone new, but she's2-2 in her last 4. I guess maybe if she beats Holly...

I just don't know who else to fight Nunes. Kunitskaya maybe? I don't know.
 

Avs_19

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I don't think Nunes-GDR 2 was all that competitive. I mean, she went the distance and took a round, but Nunes was never in any danger of losing that fight, took her down almost at will, controlled her, and had a 10-8 round or 2 thrown in there as well. It was close only if you're grading on a curve.

There's really no good options, though. Dana said Julianna Pena was blowing him up to get that fight. It would be someone new, but she's2-2 in her last 4. I guess maybe if she beats Holly...

Holm is out of that fight so I think that's why they might just go ahead with Nunes vs. Pena.
 
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pistolpete11

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Holm is out of that fight so I think that's why they might just go ahead with Nunes vs. Pena.
Oh, OK. That makes sense. I was wondering why she was trying to get the Nunes fight with a fight already booked and even more confused that Dana seemed open to it.
 
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Chaels Arms

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So two interesting observations from John McCarthy regarding the reffing:

1. There's no need for Mark Smith to discuss intentional vs. unintentional fouls and possible DQs with the doctor, especially in an empty arena within earshot of the commentators and Aljo's coaches. He should have just told the doctor the fighter took a knee to the head and to check him to see if he can continue.

2. Herb Dean messed up in the Bontorin v. Kara-France fight. The decision to stop the fight was correct but Dean never properly signaled the fight was over. Since Dean never properly signaled the stoppage the fight clock continued to run. When Kara-France began his lap around the octagon his coaches noticed this and wisely told him to get back in and finish the fight. Remember Dean had a similar situation in Ribas' last fight where a fighter wasn't sure if he had called it off or not and he told the fighter to keep fighting.
 

jcs0218

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Yan has been watching too much Bloodsport.

He thinks UFC is the Kumite and he is Chong Li, giving knees like that.
 

16Skippy

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Something about the Jan's performance that really impressed me was his patience in the last two rounds. Specifically when he had Izzy down in half guard he didn't rush to advance position or go for a sub, he grinded him out while keeping control. DC brought it up at least once that Jan would be better off to keep working from half guard and it worked.

Earlier in either round 2 or 3 I think there was an exchange where Jan briefly had Izzy's back when they were basically standing and tried to rush a choke, and then quickly lost the positional advantage and got tagged up.
 
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1specter

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Fascinating how badly that main card went after so much hype, and no fans was very noticeable. I remember being bored multiple times.
This might be the worst stretch for Dana and UFC trying to milk 'hype', as almost every situation has backfired over the past year or so, with various setbacks.

  • Holloway loses belt to a point fighter who is not a household name or draw, then loses rematch in a questionable decision
  • Masvidal gets dominated in a boring 5 round decision in his first and only title shot
  • Conor gets KOd by Dustin
  • Khabib retires right in his peak/prime in both skill level and popularity
  • Yan gets DQd with the belt going to Sterling
  • Cejudo retires in his peak, though I don't think Dana cared too much about this one :laugh:
  • Yair and Zabit fights keep falling through, stalling their hype trains
  • Chimaev fights repeatedly fall through while his hype train is at full steam, and then he gets COVID with serious after effects putting his future in question
  • WW is a shit show with its contenders situation. Edwards hasn't fought in forever, Colby seems like he's going to hold out until he gets a rematch with Usman, Wonderboy stuck in purgatory, etc. Also, between the #1-6 ranked WW contenders, only two fights have taken place amongst those fighters. Masvidal vs Wonderboy in 2017 and Masvidal vs Chiesa back in 2013
  • Women's 145 is a bust, and Nunes and Shevchenko are the two most dominant women's fighters and champs yet neither have any drawing power
  • Other potential hype trains like O'Malley, Edmen, Maycee Barber, Joaquin Buckley, Amanda Ribas etc getting derailed with disappointing losses
  • Darren Till still trying to find his place years later
  • Adesanya fails to take LHW belt at a time when LHW is lacking star power/name recognition
  • Gane vs Rozenstruik very boring and 'disappointing' considering their contender statuses and respective skill levels. Plus this was supposed to be Gane's coming out party
A whole lotta misses, feel like I'm probably still forgetting some too.
 

pistolpete11

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But didn't Pena just get smoked by GDR in her last fight? I hope there's a better option.
She beat McMann by sub in her last fight.

Her previous fight, she got submitted by GDR which is....not a good look considering GDR isn't exactly known for her BJJ.

Unfortunately, there really aren't any good options, just equally shitty options. Any time there is a new face, they seem to get beat by Holm or GDR who Nunes KO'ed in the first round and has already beat twice, respectively.
 

chicagoskycam

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This might be the worst stretch for Dana and UFC trying to milk 'hype', as almost every situation has backfired over the past year or so, with various setbacks.

  • Holloway loses belt to a point fighter who is not a household name or draw, then loses rematch in a questionable decision
  • Masvidal gets dominated in a boring 5 round decision in his first and only title shot
  • Conor gets KOd by Dustin
  • Khabib retires right in his peak/prime in both skill level and popularity
  • Yan gets DQd with the belt going to Sterling
  • Cejudo retires in his peak, though I don't think Dana cared too much about this one :laugh:
  • Yair and Zabit fights keep falling through, stalling their hype trains
  • Chimaev fights repeatedly fall through while his hype train is at full steam, and then he gets COVID with serious after effects putting his future in question
  • WW is a shit show with its contenders situation. Edwards hasn't fought in forever, Colby seems like he's going to hold out until he gets a rematch with Usman, Wonderboy stuck in purgatory, etc. Also, between the #1-6 ranked WW contenders, only two fights have taken place amongst those fighters. Masvidal vs Wonderboy in 2017 and Masvidal vs Chiesa back in 2013
  • Women's 145 is a bust, and Nunes and Shevchenko are the two most dominant women's fighters and champs yet neither have any drawing power
  • Other potential hype trains like O'Malley, Edmen, Maycee Barber, Joaquin Buckley, Amanda Ribas etc getting derailed with disappointing losses
  • Darren Till still trying to find his place years later
  • Adesanya fails to take LHW belt at a time when LHW is lacking star power/name recognition
  • Gane vs Rozenstruik very boring and 'disappointing' considering their contender statuses and respective skill levels. Plus this was supposed to be Gane's coming out party
A whole lotta misses, feel like I'm probably still forgetting some too.

Those are the results but the fact still remains Dana put on a ton of good cards - in theory, that should have been hyped! That's his job, he's a promoter, and all of this dealing with the pandemic. He can't control what happens in the Octagon, injuries or retirements. You also got Jon Jones, Masvidal, and so on retiring in 20'. The last two weeks have been fairly disappointing in the results for sure.
 

chicagoskycam

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So two interesting observations from John McCarthy regarding the reffing:

1. There's no need for Mark Smith to discuss intentional vs. unintentional fouls and possible DQs with the doctor, especially in an empty arena within earshot of the commentators and Aljo's coaches. He should have just told the doctor the fighter took a knee to the head and to check him to see if he can continue.

2. Herb Dean messed up in the Bontorin v. Kara-France fight. The decision to stop the fight was correct but Dean never properly signaled the fight was over. Since Dean never properly signaled the stoppage the fight clock continued to run. When Kara-France began his lap around the octagon his coaches noticed this and wisely told him to get back in and finish the fight. Remember Dean had a similar situation in Ribas' last fight where a fighter wasn't sure if he had called it off or not and he told the fighter to keep fighting.

Yeah, it was like Herb was giving him the opportunity to come around.
 

1specter

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Those are the results but the fact still remains Dana put on a ton of good cards - in theory, that should have been hyped! That's his job, he's a promoter, and all of this dealing with the pandemic. He can't control what happens in the Octagon, injuries or retirements. You also got Jon Jones, Masvidal, and so on retiring in 20'. The last two weeks have been fairly disappointing in the results for sure.
Not saying otherwise at all, if anything it's kinda funny when things don't go to plan for Dana for me personally cause of how salty and desperate he gets lol. I don't feel bad for him because at the end of the day the UFC is still doing great all things considered. Was more just looking at how this is one of the worst stretches in terms of fighters delivering on hype, compared to let's say peak McGregor+Rousey era
 
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pistolpete11

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Those are the results but the fact still remains Dana put on a ton of good cards - in theory, that should have been hyped! That's his job, he's a promoter, and all of this dealing with the pandemic. He can't control what happens in the Octagon, injuries or retirements. You also got Jon Jones, Masvidal, and so on retiring in 20'. The last two weeks have been fairly disappointing in the results for sure.
There's still a lot more to look forward to in 2021 if you're the UFC as well.

- Probably Poirier-Conor 3 in the summer. Depending on the results, they may even be able to squeeze another Conor fight in before the end of the year. Conor hasn't fought twice in the same calendar year since 2016.
- Probably Usman-Masvidal 2, maybe coaching TUF.
- I'm not sure how big Stipe-Francis 2 will be, I'm f***ing stoked for it, but then you get the winner vs. Jones which will be massive.
- Fig-Moreno rematch.
- Hopefully Izzy-Whittaker rematch, maybe in Australia/New Zealand with full crowd.
- Nate seems to be wanting to get in a fight.
- Max may get another shot at Volk and will definitely get a shot at Ortega if he beats Volk.
- Weili is back, which the UFC probably loves given her home country.
- There are still a million fights you could make in LW that would be worth the price of a PPV alone.
- Possibly fans returning at some point.


And there are always storylines that develop throughout the year. They will have no shortage of fights to hype this year even if recent results didn't go exactly as hoped.
 

m9

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Yeah, it was like Herb was giving him the opportunity to come around.

It looked to me like at first he was checking to give him the opportunity but then just forgot to actually wave off the fight.

Dean has been frustrating these last couple of years, though I will say I think there have just been so many more fights than in the past so of course we're going to see more mistakes. He just seems a bit hesitant and out of position at times.
 

m9

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This might be the worst stretch for Dana and UFC trying to milk 'hype', as almost every situation has backfired over the past year or so, with various setbacks.

  • Holloway loses belt to a point fighter who is not a household name or draw, then loses rematch in a questionable decision
  • Masvidal gets dominated in a boring 5 round decision in his first and only title shot
  • Conor gets KOd by Dustin
  • Khabib retires right in his peak/prime in both skill level and popularity
  • Yan gets DQd with the belt going to Sterling
  • Cejudo retires in his peak, though I don't think Dana cared too much about this one :laugh:
  • Yair and Zabit fights keep falling through, stalling their hype trains
  • Chimaev fights repeatedly fall through while his hype train is at full steam, and then he gets COVID with serious after effects putting his future in question
  • WW is a shit show with its contenders situation. Edwards hasn't fought in forever, Colby seems like he's going to hold out until he gets a rematch with Usman, Wonderboy stuck in purgatory, etc. Also, between the #1-6 ranked WW contenders, only two fights have taken place amongst those fighters. Masvidal vs Wonderboy in 2017 and Masvidal vs Chiesa back in 2013
  • Women's 145 is a bust, and Nunes and Shevchenko are the two most dominant women's fighters and champs yet neither have any drawing power
  • Other potential hype trains like O'Malley, Edmen, Maycee Barber, Joaquin Buckley, Amanda Ribas etc getting derailed with disappointing losses
  • Darren Till still trying to find his place years later
  • Adesanya fails to take LHW belt at a time when LHW is lacking star power/name recognition
  • Gane vs Rozenstruik very boring and 'disappointing' considering their contender statuses and respective skill levels. Plus this was supposed to be Gane's coming out party
A whole lotta misses, feel like I'm probably still forgetting some too.

Eh.. I bet if you look at many 50-card/15 month block then you're going to have a long list of this kind of stuff. And lots of it ends up turning out just fine.

The worst still is probably 2015-2016:

-Rousey losing to Holm
-Conor losing to Nate
-Holm losing to Tate
-Jones testing positive for drugs, pulled from UFC 200 main
-Lesnar testing positive
-Rousey losing to Nunes

.. and this is just UFC 193, 196, 200, 207 within like 13 months. I didn't even look at the other 40+ cards it would take for a true comparison.
 

pistolpete11

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Eh.. I bet if you look at many 50-card/15 month block then you're going to have a long list of this kind of stuff. And lots of it ends up turning out just fine.

The worst still is probably 2015-2016:

-Rousey losing to Holm
-Conor losing to Nate
-Holm losing to Tate
-Jones testing positive for drugs, pulled from UFC 200 main
-Lesnar testing positive
-Rousey losing to Nunes

.. and this is just UFC 193, 196, 200, 207 within like 13 months. I didn't even look at the other 40+ cards it would take for a true comparison.
Stars losing isn't really that big of a deal in MMA.

Rousey-Holm did 1.1M PPV buys. Nunes-Rousey also did 1.1M PPV buys and I'd argue that Rousey-Holm 2 would have done more.

Conor-Nate did 1.3M PPV buys. Conor-Nate 2 did 1.6M.

I'm not sure if it is the art of promoting or just the machine that is the UFC, but a loss just creates a different storyline.
 

m9

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Stars losing isn't really that big of a deal in MMA.

Rousey-Holm did 1.1M PPV buys. Nunes-Rousey also did 1.1M PPV buys and I'd argue that Rousey-Holm 2 would have done more.

Conor-Nate did 1.3M PPV buys. Conor-Nate 2 did 1.6M.

I'm not sure if it is the art of promoting or just the machine that is the UFC, but a loss just creates a different storyline.

For sure. The losses at least create different storylines. When guys are out injured, get suspended, or retire it's hard to gain much out of those situations.
 
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Avs_19

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It looked to me like at first he was checking to give him the opportunity but then just forgot to actually wave off the fight.

Dean has been frustrating these last couple of years, though I will say I think there have just been so many more fights than in the past so of course we're going to see more mistakes. He just seems a bit hesitant and out of position at times.

That's what I said on fight night about Herb and still feel that way. He stopped the fight as soon as he grabbed KKF but didn't officially end it because he saw Bontorin about to do a face plant and went over to him. I guess he just forgot after that.

Agreed about his recent history. He keeps being involved in some weird stuff and that can't all just be a coincidence or on some other circumstances. He seems to be second guessing himself a lot.
 
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chicagoskycam

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Stars losing isn't really that big of a deal in MMA.

Rousey-Holm did 1.1M PPV buys. Nunes-Rousey also did 1.1M PPV buys and I'd argue that Rousey-Holm 2 would have done more.

Conor-Nate did 1.3M PPV buys. Conor-Nate 2 did 1.6M.

I'm not sure if it is the art of promoting or just the machine that is the UFC, but a loss just creates a different storyline.

Rousey was so overhyped as the 1st women's champ. She was very marketable, but when it came to fighting as soon as she faced anyone that could strike - it was over.
 

pistolpete11

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Rousey was so overhyped as the 1st women's champ. She was very marketable, but when it came to fighting as soon as she faced anyone that could strike - it was over.
There's no argument she wasn't overhyped. People like Joe Rogan were talking about her fighting Floyd Mayweather for cryin' out load.

BUT, she was good. She was 12-0 with a 100% finish rate with only one of those coming after the first round. She lost to Nunes which in hindsight, of course she would, and Holm who's record looks worse than it is when you consider she was 1.5min away from beating Tate, arguably did beat GDR, had no business fighting Cyborg in the first place, and only other losses were to Nunes and Valentina. If Rousey stuck around, she'd still have beat most of the division IMO. She'd lose to Nunes, Holm, Valentina, and probably GDR. Other than that, I think she she has a good chance of beating everyone else.

Edmond didn't do her any favors either. You play to your fighters strengths and he did the exact opposite of that.
 
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