News Article: UFA and RFA next year...what do you want?

[rockjngo]

Vanek hasn't been the same shoulder injury. He hasn't played a full season since entering the league.

Gionta, -let go (change leadership. Gorges/Markov for captain)
Eller, - 4 years $3.5 million per year (slowly developing into a defensive center)
Parros, - 1 year $1 mil per year (we need a fighter)
Subban, - 6 years $6.5 million per year (a must for the club)
Markov, - 2 years $5 million per year (still has a couple years left to play)
White, - trade at deadline for 5th round pick (doesn't bring much to the team)
Bouillon, -let go (to old, too slow, thinks he can still carry the puck)
Murray, -let go (after that Steen goal, I think Murray is finished in the NHL)
Diaz, - trade at deadline for 4th round pick (playing scared, we need to get bigger)
Pateryn, -2 years $950k per year (almost NHL ready)
Leblanc, -trade for 5th round pick (time to move on, he's a bust)
Quailer, -let go (bust)
Nattinen, -let go (bust)
Delmas, -let go (bust)
St. Pierre, -let go (unfortunately we need size)
Tokarski, -1 year $500k (good for AHL club)
Blunden, -let go (let another team give him a chance)
Tarnasky, -let go (career AHL)

 

[slovakia18]

Vanek hasn't been the same shoulder injury. He hasn't played a full season since entering the league.

06/07 and 07/08 2 full Seasons. 2009 a Broken Jaw. 2011 2 Games out. I think not Vanek is a running Injury player.

 

[Fozz]

Not that i think it will happen but IF the team is out of the playoffs at the deadline, you have to consider moving Markov to a contender. He can always be re-signed in the summer but you have to get something for him and take your chances.

If the team doesn't want to take that chance, then they should extend him right now and remove the possibility of him doing an Alfredsson next summer.

 

[BaseballCoach]

Markov - Keep
1 year at a time for market rate.

Gionta - Let go/Trade
Keep to year end (only) if in contention, otherwise trade.

Subban - Keep
Sign him for as long as you possibly can.

Bouillon - Let go
Let him retire.

Murray - Let go
Tinordi will replace him.

Eller - Keep
Look for four-year contract.

Diaz - Trade
Should have more value to a team that needs a PP quarterback than he does to the Habs.

Parros - Let go
Too expensive for what he brings.

White - Keep
Re-sign as minimum wage 4th-5th line player a year at a time.

Leblanc- Keep
Make him a qualifying offer, sign one year, then if he does well, give him two years in 2015.

Pateryn- Keep
Make him a qualifying offer, sign one year, then if he does well, give him two years in 2015.

Tokarski- Keep
1 year $500k (good for AHL club, 1st callup)

Blunden- Keep
1 year $500k (good for AHL club, emergency callup)

Nattinen- Evaluate after this year
If he progresses, 1 year $500k (good for AHL club, emergency callup)

Qualier, Delmas, St. Pierre, Tarnasky- let go

 

[Blind Gardien]

Markov - Keep
I'd go $18M/3yrs to keep him. Of course, it would be nice to get any discounts or a shorter term or whatnot, but I don't see balking at 3 years or $6M per, the way he's playing now. As long as he sustains that over the season.

Gionta - Let go/Trade
He's decent, but we need to get bigger, and he plays increasingly on the perimeter compared to when he was younger and more Gallagher-esque. I also find that he gets matchup icetime that I'm not sure he's so good at... I don't know that the stats show it, but I feel like maybe he's riding his reputation and veteran status a bit much on his defensive play too. I'd let him walk. If we're out of the playoffs at the deadline, trade him.

Subban - Keep
Maximum term, whatever it takes. $64M/8yrs, say. If he will give us a little discount on that, sweet. If not, no worries.

Bouillon - Let go
I wish we would let him go. I guess we just need to make sure Therrien gets fired beforehand. Otherwise I expect Bouillon back on the same deal he has now.

Murray - Undecided
I don't feel like I have finished evaluating Murray yet. He has made some blunders, but I like "the idea of" Murray with the size and physicality he can bring. If he can level out over the remainder of the season, I'd much rather keep him than Bouillon as the veteran depth guy. If he can't level out his play a bit, there are always going to be options on the UFA market, no biggie either way.

Eller - Keep
Obviously he's a keeper. I can see something like $4M per. He still needs to be more consistent and I find that Habs fans overrate him defensively, but we need him, and with a bigger contract let's just hope he grows into it.

Diaz - Keep at the right $
He is playing well, and like I keep saying in the other threads, I don't know how you really justify to him/his agent offering him less than you just gave Emelin. But I don't like that price for him. If I could get him at the right price (say $10M/3yrs), a price that leans more to the good/bargain side than most of our signings seem to, I'd be for it. As he has already proved this year, it's great to have another D who can play 20+ mins and contribute like he has. 5D isn't too many. If he really wants to seek a better payday, I don't blame him, but I think we can get away with letting him walk.

Parros - Let go
The idea that the team needed a goon was perhaps worth checking out after some of the shenanigan-games we had the last couple years. But let's face it, Parros is pretty much proving that we didn't really need one. He's a liability overall on the ice. In the future, our fighters have to be able to play too.

White - Keep
You need cheap depth players too. White is pretty generic atm, I wish he'd become a little more abrasive again. But as long as he's a sub-$1M 4th liner/spare, there's no point in just jettisoning him. He's ok for that.

Desharnais - ???
Well, at the rate he's going, you have to consider buying him out and making him a UFA, even with the $1M+ buyout cap hit for 6 years.

Leblanc - keep
He gets whatever his minimum QO is, I'd say. If he has a good season, consider cutting that down to a 1-year 1-way $550k minimum. Work him in on the bottom lines next season, assuming he does ok in the minors this year.

 

[penalty shot*]

I said this last summer and I repeat: What I like about Marky is that he could be a Lidstrom Lite, and play effectively until he is 40. I really believe this is possible. He has played a lot of games since coming back, and is effective, if slower. He is our second best D for god's sake, after missing 18 months of play. That should tell us a lot.

As far as I know, he has excellent habits also, and takes care of himself.

Fantastic that he is playing well, as a contender will give us something very good for him at deadline, but my instinct says sign him for 4-5 years at 5 Mill. He will want term more than cash. And he likes Montreal. As we move into our window, he will be a great no 3-4.

Habs also paid him big cash and took care of him while he rehabbed. He will not forget this.

and come playoff time , he will look like crap and get exposed again

trade him , we aren`t winning anything in the next 2-3 years

why tie up 5+ in cap space on him

he needs top go to Anaheim or San Jose for a cup run , not stay with this middle of the pack team , so we can get smoked again in round 1

IF WE MAKE THE PLAYOFFS

 

[Lafleurs Guy]

I'd like to deal Markov. He's got maybe two good years left during which time we're not winning anything. Problem is we'd need a guy who can eat minutes on the back end now.

It always obviously comes down to what we'd be looking at in terms of a return, but I'd definitely be looking around to see what I could get. And if we are going to sign him, no more than 2 years at 5 mil per.

 

[RealityBytes]

The cap hit is pro-rated. The 5 mil is based on the entire season. If a team picks him up at the deadline they don't add the entire 5 mil to their cap, just what is left. I believe the NHL season is based on 187 days and the cap is calculated by each day the player is with each team. I could be wrong though.

I can see the player's actual money payments to the bank being pro-rated but it doesn't add up right if the player's salary contract amount is also only pro-rated to the acquiring team's cap.

The trade deadline is March 4th and the season ends April 13th, that is 40 days. That would mean only a small portion of salary contract 40/187 = 21% would be added to the cap from a player at the trade deadline. That doesn't seem right because what would stop a team from keeping $5M under the cap and then super loading with non returning UFAs at 21% of their actual cost. At 21% rate, a team could acquire the equivalent of around $25M in several star players value. At $10M, a team could get around $50M in top FA players for a one time shot at the cup.

Also, in my previous post, I showed what I thought what was the correct method of how it was handled, but I could also be wrong. I am going to search/double check into the CBA agreement to see if what I showed was correct. (as per below)

However, perhaps someone fully knowledgeable about this could clarify and show the correct reference in the CBA agreement. Thanks.

----------------------------------
Trades

Under the terms of the 2005 collective bargaining agreement, when a team traded for another player, it assumed the full cap hit and remaining salary obligations of the acquired player. That was changed for the 2013 collective bargaining agreement. Teams may retain part of a traded player's salary to ease the cap burden on the acquiring team. Provisions on such retention are as follows:

1.The acquiring team must assume at least 50 percent of the remaining salary and cap charge of the SPC.
2.Such a contract can only be traded twice using provision 1 during the lifetime of the SPC.
3.Retained salary by the trading team cannot be more than 15 percent of the upper salary cap limit.
4.A maximum of 3 such contracts with salary retained in a trade can on a team's books at any one time.

This provision is included in Article 11 of Summary of Terms the 2013 CBA MOU

 

[Markowicz]

Markov trade at deadline for 1st round pick. Gionta trade for 3rd rounder. We're still maybe 2 years away from seriously competing. Stock up on picks, get some real talent, and find a replacement for Markov on D in free agency. Obviously bring back Eller and Subban.

 

[Runner77]

http://www.usatoday.com/story/sport...013/11/09/nhl-free-agent-predictions/3484915/

 

[25get]

So many are ready to let Diaz go.

He is top-2 in PK in our team (26th in the league for SH TOI/G). With Gorges (21st in the league), they managed to put us in fourth position in the league.

How much are you going to pay to get someone with same PK minutes?
We are talking about Michalek, Grossman, McDonagh, Weaver, Guenin, Hamonic, MacDonald, Gryba and Bouwmeester.

Seems to me that PK players are usually experienced players.

Diaz is playing 3:09 of PK per game this season, did 2:16 last season and 1:20 min of PK per game back in 2011-12.

 

[BaseballCoach]

Markov - Keep

Subban - Keep

Bouillon - Let go

Murray - Undecided

Diaz - Keep at the right $

So with Gorges and Emelin signed, and this call to re-sign 3 or 4 more existing defencemen, how does the club get better? This is why I have trouble with this plan.

Diaz is not the kind of guy we need, in my opinion, and Murray is only filler until Tinordi is ready, which should be later this season.

Markov is too old and slow to commit three years to, especially with the over-35 huge penalty that comes with a multi-year deal, but I could be convinced to give him one year at a time at market rate or a touch more for his intangibles, until the day he needs to really retire. But it has to be one year at a time officially. Markov becomes expendable once Beaulieu is really ready, say one year after Beaulieu gets here full-time. The year would show he is sticking and can take over an offensive D role.

 

[habsfanatics*]

Markov - Keep
I'd go $18M/3yrs to keep him. Of course, it would be nice to get any discounts or a shorter term or whatnot, but I don't see balking at 3 years or $6M per, the way he's playing now. As long as he sustains that over the season.

Me neither, I'd use the injury history a bit during negotiations to try and create wiggle room, if all else fails, pay the man his monies.

Gionta - Let go/Trade
He's decent, but we need to get bigger, and he plays increasingly on the perimeter compared to when he was younger and more Gallagher-esque. I also find that he gets matchup icetime that I'm not sure he's so good at... I don't know that the stats show it, but I feel like maybe he's riding his reputation and veteran status a bit much on his defensive play too. I'd let him walk. If we're out of the playoffs at the deadline, trade him.

I agree, unless we can move DD instead Then I'd consider keeping him.

Subban - Keep
Maximum term, whatever it takes. $64M/8yrs, say. If he will give us a little discount on that, sweet. If not, no worries.

Agreed

Bouillon - Let go
I wish we would let him go. I guess we just need to make sure Therrien gets fired beforehand. Otherwise I expect Bouillon back on the same deal he has now.

I don't mind Boullion actually, he's just misused, I think he can be effective at 16-18 minutes of easy ice time. Having said that, if the only way to keep him off the PK is to let him walk then I won't lose any sleep.

Murray - Undecided
I don't feel like I have finished evaluating Murray yet. He has made some blunders, but I like "the idea of" Murray with the size and physicality he can bring. If he can level out over the remainder of the season, I'd much rather keep him than Bouillon as the veteran depth guy. If he can't level out his play a bit, there are always going to be options on the UFA market, no biggie either way.

This type of player is way more of liability than anything he can bring to the table. Wouldn't even consider keeping him.

Eller - Keep
Obviously he's a keeper. I can see something like $4M per. He still needs to be more consistent and I find that Habs fans overrate him defensively, but we need him, and with a bigger contract let's just hope he grows into it.

Diaz - Keep at the right $
He is playing well, and like I keep saying in the other threads, I don't know how you really justify to him/his agent offering him less than you just gave Emelin. But I don't like that price for him. If I could get him at the right price (say $10M/3yrs), a price that leans more to the good/bargain side than most of our signings seem to, I'd be for it. As he has already proved this year, it's great to have another D who can play 20+ mins and contribute like he has. 5D isn't too many. If he really wants to seek a better payday, I don't blame him, but I think we can get away with letting him walk.

I would let him go and replace with a more defensive minded player with some size/strength. If the price is dirt cheap, I'd keep him, but I think he deserves at least emelin time if we base it off of usage. I don't see him signing for the 2.5 I'd be willing to give him.

Parros - Let go
The idea that the team needed a goon was perhaps worth checking out after some of the shenanigan-games we had the last couple years. But let's face it, Parros is pretty much proving that we didn't really need one. He's a liability overall on the ice. In the future, our fighters have to be able to play too.

I like the idea of an enforcer, George will do his thing, but the coach needs to use when we need him and not in the 3rd period protecting a lead. Don't really care either way, I like an enforcer, but think George is the wrong guy.

White - Keep
You need cheap depth players too. White is pretty generic atm, I wish he'd become a little more abrasive again. But as long as he's a sub-$1M 4th liner/spare, there's no point in just jettisoning him. He's ok for that.

I think White is a career AHLer, not skilled enough to play real minutes and not tough enough to enforce. Losing him hurts basically nothing, don't care either way.

Desharnais - ???
Well, at the rate he's going, you have to consider buying him out and making him a UFA, even with the $1M+ buyout cap hit for 6 years.

Hard to maneuver with contracts like this and Briere taking up cap space for nothing. I just hope we don't move him for another albatross contract that ends up worse. Buyout is probably the only option, I don't see a market for this guy.

Leblanc - keep
He gets whatever his minimum QO is, I'd say. If he has a good season, consider cutting that down to a 1-year 1-way $550k minimum. Work him in on the bottom lines next season, assuming he does ok in the minors this year.

Too soon to give up on him. I would resign him.

 

[ClasslessGuy]

IMO Sean Whyte should leave...

 

[habsfanatics*]

So with Gorges and Emelin signed, and this call to re-sign 3 or 4 more existing defencemen, how does the club get better? This is why I have trouble with this plan.

Diaz is not the kind of guy we need, in my opinion, and Murray is only filler until Tinordi is ready, which should be later this season.

Markov is too old and slow to commit three years to, especially with the over-35 huge penalty that comes with a multi-year deal, but I could be convinced to give him one year at a time at market rate or a touch more for his intangibles, until the day he needs to really retire. But it has to be one year at a time officially. Markov becomes expendable once Beaulieu is really ready, say one year after Beaulieu gets here full-time. The year would show he is sticking and can take over an offensive D role.

Chances are that Beaulieu at his best won't be as good as Markov at his worst. The general is a must sign imo. Diaz, meh, I'd keep him if he signs for basically nothing, otherwise, I'd let him go.

 

[habsfanatics*]

I'd like to deal Markov. He's got maybe two good years left during which time we're not winning anything. Problem is we'd need a guy who can eat minutes on the back end now.

It always obviously comes down to what we'd be looking at in terms of a return, but I'd definitely be looking around to see what I could get. And if we are going to sign him, no more than 2 years at 5 mil per.

So, you'd let him go without a suitable replacement if he asks for 1million more per? I don't think we can do that. How are going to improve on marky for that price?

 

[Hoople]

The false narrative continues.

We are not losing games because of Murray.

In 6 games so far, Murray has ZERO giveaways. He is responsible with the puck and is effective at getting the puck out of the zone.

Compare that with Markov. He has TWENTY-ONE giveaways in 17 games.

Murray and Markov have different responsibilities (before the cries that I am comparing Murray to Markov begin) at D. However, Markov has been brutal lately with his puck handling in our zone.

Trade Markov, trade Diaz, let Boullion retire.

Regarding Parros. We havent even played the Bruins yet. And only one game against the Leafs. He is a fighter. This team has bigger issues than Parros being on the Habs.

 

[poetryinmotion]

Not that i think it will happen but IF the team is out of the playoffs at the deadline, you have to consider moving Markov to a contender. He can always be re-signed in the summer but you have to get something for him and take your chances.

If the team doesn't want to take that chance, then they should extend him right now and remove the possibility of him doing an Alfredsson next summer.

Then they have no balls and should not be running an NHL team.

I predict this is the last 'serviceable' year for Markov, and I don't believe he has any empathy towards this organisation having witnessed first hand what happened to Koivu et cie.

 

[dkd]

Vanek hasn't been the same shoulder injury. He hasn't played a full season since entering the league.

Gionta, -let go (change leadership. Gorges/Markov for captain)
Eller, - 4 years $3.5 million per year (slowly developing into a defensive center)
Parros, - 1 year $1 mil per year (we need a fighter)
Subban, - 6 years $6.5 million per year (a must for the club)
Markov, - 2 years $5 million per year (still has a couple years left to play)
White, - trade at deadline for 5th round pick (doesn't bring much to the team)
Bouillon, -let go (to old, too slow, thinks he can still carry the puck)
Murray, -let go (after that Steen goal, I think Murray is finished in the NHL)
Diaz, - trade at deadline for 4th round pick (playing scared, we need to get bigger)
Pateryn, -2 years $950k per year (almost NHL ready)
Leblanc, -trade for 5th round pick (time to move on, he's a bust)
Quailer, -let go (bust)
Nattinen, -let go (bust)
Delmas, -let go (bust)
St. Pierre, -let go (unfortunately we need size)
Tokarski, -1 year $500k (good for AHL club)
Blunden, -let go (let another team give him a chance)
Tarnasky, -let go (career AHL)

You are letting 3 defense men walk away for almost free. Who's gonna play on our D ? In your situation we will only have Markov, Subban, Emelin and Gorges left.

 

[ECWHSWI]

The false narrative continues.

We are not losing games because of Murray.

In 6 games so far, Murray has ZERO giveaways. He is responsible with the puck and is effective at getting the puck out of the zone.

Compare that with Markov. He has TWENTY-ONE giveaways in 17 games.

Murray and Markov have different responsibilities (before the cries that I am comparing Murray to Markov begin) at D. However, Markov has been brutal lately with his puck handling in our zone.

Trade Markov, trade Diaz, let Boullion retire.

Regarding Parros. We havent even played the Bruins yet. And only one game against the Leafs. He is a fighter. This team has bigger issues than Parros being on the Habs.

Usually, the D with the worst giveaway numbers in this league are the best ones...

I'll let you figure out why

 

[vokiel]

Vanek - 7 years @ whatever he wants..

Move out: (the method matters not)
Bouillon, Murray, Gionta, Parros, Blunden

To Sign:
Subban, Eller, Markov, Diaz (unless we can get something of value for him), Tokarski (Fucale won't be pro yet)

Options: (depends who's available and/or who's coming up from junior)
White, Pateryn, Leblanc, Delmas, Nattinen, Quailer, Tarnasky, St. Pierre

 

[JoelWarlord]

Markov - Keep. Ideally we can save a bit on what he's making right now but he's a needed piece and still valuable. No issues with his play this year, and over time him minutes can be scaled back.
Gionta - Likely would let go. Depends on if there's any trades involving Desharnais, in that case would be willing to keep him at a discount for the 3rd line but I think there's a compelling argument that it's time to move on from his captaincy and go in a new direction.
Subban - Keep.
Bouillon - Let go.
Murray- Let go.
Eller - Keep, he's an RFA so there's no reason not to.
Diaz - Resign depending on dollars (under 3M), he's a good option to have around as a fringe top 4 guy for insurance. If he doesn't seem likely to resign, try to trade him and get something.
Parros - Let him go, I know we need toughness but it can't come from a guy who can't be trusted to play 5 minutes a game.
White - Keep, no reason to let guys like him go, he's become a fine 4th line center over the last couple years. Wouldn't be overly upset if he walks because he's replacable but if you can keep a homegrown guy it's worth doing.

Resign Leblanc and Pateryn, no reason not to and they're still good prospects.

The false narrative continues.
We are not losing games because of Murray. In 6 games so far, Murray has ZERO giveaways. He is responsible with the puck and is effective at getting the puck out of the zone. Compare that with Markov. He has TWENTY-ONE giveaways in 17 games. Murray and Markov have different responsibilities (before the cries that I am comparing Murray to Markov begin) at D. However, Markov has been brutal lately with his puck handling in our zone. Trade Markov, trade Diaz, let Boullion retire.

Regarding Parros. We havent even played the Bruins yet. And only one game against the Leafs. He is a fighter. This team has bigger issues than Parros being on the Habs.

Losing games because of him or not the guy is awful and is most definitely not effective at getting the puck out of the zone. Small sample size but so far he's a -24 Corsi per 60 minutes, and starts 52% of his shifts in the O-zone while only finishing 40% of them there. I know that people bringing out the spreadsheets about Murray is annoying when he adds intangible elements but the problem is that stuff should show up on the stats (if people are really afraid of his physicality and if he was really good at moving the puck out of the zone) we wouldn't be outshot by 24 shots per 60 minutes with him out there. All this while facing by far the easiest competition on the team; he's playing against other team's 4th lines and getting roasted.

Not going to harp on Parros much because it's clear that we will never ever see eye to eye on this. Agreed that we have bigger problems than him being on the team, but him being on the ice is a pretty massive problem and him being dressed and not playing is a pretty big problem too. I'm fine if we dress him to beat up Orr and play against the Bruins, but he's not someone who should be a regular.

You are letting 3 defense men walk away for almost free. Who's gonna play on our D ? In your situation we will only have Markov, Subban, Emelin and Gorges left.

I disagree with letting Diaz walk but I can see why people would want him gone. Guess the idea would be that one of Tinordi/Beaulieu/Pateryn plays their way into our top 6 and we add a free agent or two.

 

[rockjngo]

Gionta/Desharnais/Diaz/Boullion/Murray

I few things that worries me...

Gionta
He's the captain of the team yet he isn't even the 5th best player on the team. I remember Koivu giving everything every shift and never get caught out of position. Even with his small statue he out muscle most of his opponents. Brenden Gallagher reminds me of Koivu. At 34 years old, Koivu was still the best player on the team and never gave up. Gionta on the other hand at 34 is being out muscled and often looks lost. During a penalty kill, Gionta and Diaz forgot they were killing and all move toward Gorges to help him which left Okposo wide open and he had a walk in shot on Price. This is unacceptable for a captain and a defenceman. Gionta didn't generate any offense nor did he do anything to help in the defensive zone. He looks lost. For $5 million, I expected more.

Desharnais
There's many threads on him so I'll keep it brief, he has lost all his confidence. The Bourque to Bournival to Desharnais pass was textbook yet Desharnais mistimed the puck and didn't get a shot. Another play was Mcdonald threw the puck in the middle and Desharnais carried it into Price which looked dangerous. Wrong team Desharnais. He's got Gomezed.

Diaz
He hasn't been the same since that concussion. Still made some good plays but most of the time when he has the puck he doesn't know what to do with it.

Boullion
Can Frankie please stop leading the rush, everytime he touches the puck I feel we lose momentum because he hangs on to it for way too long.

Murray
The last player as slow as Murray was uncle Peter Popovic.

 

[Clumsyhab]

Gio is playing good, nothing against him. He's very underrated. However, no room for him next season.

 

[Smokey Thompson]

Do you watch the games? Gio is not half as bad as you make him out to be. Despite his size and tears in both his biceps, he's still good for 20 goals and his defensive awareness is very useful on this team. Him and Plek shut down top lines. Whether he comes back next season depends on the progression of the youngins imho.

Agree with mostly everything else. If Diaz were just a bit bigger / stronger he'd be a good top 4 defense man. At this point I see him as a 5th or 6th on a good team.