Great Britain: U20 WJC (D1B) discussion

[3 Minute Minor]

I think a U20 league will help but I don't think it'll solve anything development wise, if anything it could hurt. Adding a U20 league right now, with ice time being difficult to obtain as is, it's only going to make ice time even more scarce. Things need to be fixed starting at the bottom IMO. Not to mention, when you're 18 years old you're not going to develop a players fundamentals or hockey IQ the way you can at younger ages. By the time you're 18 years old, you know what your ceiling is and few in GB at the U20 age have a high ceiling. So a U20 league would consist of 1.5 teams if you want it to be really competitive lol

I just think time is better served at the youngest level so that by the time they're 18, there's an actual need for a U20 level (competition wise)

 

[Siamese Dream]

Well along with my proposed changes to the structure of the U12 to U18 leagues the U20 league would definitely be needed. The structural change would produce more good players, and there is only a limited number of spaces for them on EPL/NIHL teams once they reach 18. The U20 league will provide a reasonable level of hockey for them to develop more before stepping up to the adult leagues, and keeps more kids playing the sport for longer. U18 players could also "play up" to the U20 league, which allows them to play more games in a season. Ultimately no the U20 league will have marginal impact on the national team's ranking, but the aim of it is to suit the needs of everybody else by keeping people playing the sport for longer and increasing the "hockey culture" - guys who stay in the sport will likely get their kids on the ice when they have them, and those kids might go on to be GB players (I'm going to have to apologise to Howeaboutthat for this one if he sees this, after I shat on rec hockey, I was wrong then). And in the long term it probably would help the top prospects, even now the EPL and NIHL keep getting better and the U20 league would be a good place for the top players to get good ice time and special teams experience against other good players, instead of warming the bench.

If people actually try and take the initiative ice time is not an issue. Guildford have more than enough available ice time, they've only got 1 senior team and 1 junior team at every age group. Coventry managed to find enough ice time to be able to fit all the MK Lightning games in there this season while their rink is being refurbished, similarly Oxford are letting Bristol play there now they haven't got a rink, and Lee Valley is hosting Romford. It can be done. Some could probably get rid of their NIHL2 team to make space for the U20 team, Cardiff only actually started their NIHL2 team so the U18's would have somewhere to go when they got too old, and the Chelmsford Warriors have only 6 players this season who aren't U20.

Anyway the tournament is over, we should take this discussion to the "hockey in Britain" thread

 

[3 Minute Minor]

A late U20 thought. I looked at all the teams that have played U20 Div 1 and looked at the leading scorers from those tournament and Jordan Cownie tied the GB high for D1 U20 hockey:

04-05 - Shaun Thompson 5gp 2g 2a 4pts +1
06-07 - Shaun Thompson 5gp 4g 2a 6pts +2
07-08 - Robert Dowd 5gp 1g 3a 4pts -7
10-11 - Jack Prince 5gp 5g 0a 5pts +3
Robert Farmer 5gp 1g 4a 5pts +1
11-12 - Joseph Lewis 5gp 1g 3a 4pts -10
12-13 - Adam Harding 5gp 0g 4a 4pts -2
13-14 - Jordan Cownie 5gp 2g 4a 6pts +1

Worth noting that everyone before 11-12 was the old Div 1 format & Lewis did it in Div 1A but still, GB had a solid tournament offensively given their average age.

 

[3 Minute Minor]

Interesting twists...

Great Britain Under-20s have been relegated from World Championship Division 1B after mistakenly registering an ineligible player.
Defenceman Adam Jones was mistakenly registered for the tournament in Dumfries in December.
An IIHF statement said: "Bylaw 406(2) establishes the disciplinary consequences for a national association member registering an ineligible player for an IIHF championship.
"By way of email on 4th March 2014, Ice Hockey UK confirmed that Adam Jones was not eligible to participate for Team GB due to not meeting eligibility requirements in bylaw 406 (1.7) for dual nationals.
"Therefore, because Team GB participated in the tournament with an ineligible player, according to bylaw 406(2), Team GB is disqualified from Division 1B.
"As a result of GB's relegation, they will be relegated to IIHF World Championship Division 2A for the 2015 season."
IHUK interim chairman, Jim Anderson, said: "This was an unfortunate but genuine and honest mistake which was realised when the player was selected to play for GB U18s.
"In future IHUK will double its due diligence on players who are chosen for GB squads."

A) How do you "mistakenly" register a player for a tournament
B) How does the IIHF not say anything before the tournament
C) How do you "mistakenly" register a player for a tournament

 

[Uncle Rotter]

Interesting twists...



A) How do you "mistakenly" register a player for a tournament
B) How does the IIHF not say anything before the tournament
C) How do you "mistakenly" register a player for a tournament

I read on another forum that the IIHF just checks passports, it's up to the countries to self report if dual citizens satisfy the requirements.

 

[3 Minute Minor]

I read on another forum that the IIHF just checks passports, it's up to the countires to self report if dual citizens satisfy the requirements.

So I wonder how many countries don't report dual citizens and let them play in whatever tournament they want. If IIHF isn't going to ask questions or do any checking of their own, it seems like it'd be pretty easy to lie about it.

 

[Shrimper]

Is II A the lowest they've been before?

 

[Uncle Rotter]

So I wonder how many countries don't report dual citizens and let them play in whatever tournament they want. If IIHF isn't going to ask questions or do any checking of their own, it seems like it'd be pretty easy to lie about it.

If they don't, others will (Miroslav Sikora, Armenia). It would be next to impossible to get away with.

 

[Siamese Dream]

Is II A the lowest they've been before?

Under the current system, yes.

Before they changed it GB were often in Division 2.

Under the old system division 2 was split into 2 equal groups and the winner of each group was promoted to division 1 which also had 2 equal groups.

 

[3 Minute Minor]

Under the current system, yes.

Before they changed it GB were often in Division 2.

Under the old system division 2 was split into 2 equal groups and the winner of each group was promoted to division 1 which also had 2 equal groups.

Equal groups in that there were 2 competitive teams in each group and 3 absolute jokes in each group

GB U20 only managed promotion to D1 three times ever. This 4 year stretch of 4 years in D1 is the longest ever... and they were only relegated for being stupid off the ice

With the new format, promotion shouldn't be perceived as "easy" by any stretch. The countries that GB are playing will be competitive with maybe 1 or 2 exceptions.

 

[Uncle Rotter]

Is II A the lowest they've been before?

Their lowest finish was 26th in 2009