U.S. National Team Thread VI #fireJurgen

[Ugmo]

His bosses are committed to him and he's not going anywhere until at least 2018. The only person's opinion that matters is the head of USA soccer and he has thrown support behind him again and again. Despite this firestorm he's still sticking around

Oh, I know he's not going anywhere, as I said in the second post of this thread:

I've been advocating his firing for a long time, but I don't see it. I think he doesn't get fired unless we get off to a horrible start to World Cup qualifying.

He should be fired though. Sunil Gulati is a clueless fanboy. I predict we will stumble through World Cup qualifying and look as disjointed and disorganized as we have pretty much since the World Cup, then play poorly in Russia. Hopefully by that point everyone will be utterly sick of him and Sunil won't be able to extend his contract again like an idiot.

Man, the thought of watching Klinsmann bumble around with our national team for the next three years is really disheartening. At least I live in Austria and can live vicariously through the currently outstanding Austrian team, which legitimately has a great coach and not a snake oil salesman. Hopefully they can tide me over until Klinsmann is gone in 2018.


Edit: Just read an outstanding post on Big Soccer:

Thought experiment: Pretend for a minute that klinsmann isn't a famous player from Europe. He's an mls coach born in the US. Who would be defending him now?

So what's the justification for keeping him on at this point?

That pretty much sums it up.

 

[John Price]

THose American Outlaws

Best US supporters group I've seen they were all chanting last night and singing and I will definitely try to make it out for more AO bar games when they play, much better than sitting at home doing nothing

Come on US score a goal its really ****ing simple, Put the ball into the net and we'll go ****ing mental NA NA NA NA NA NA NA NA NA NA NA NA NA NA NA NA NA NA NA NA

 

[njdevsfn95]

And what competent coach with international experience will replace JK?

Also I do not think 4 years is enough time to see if JK has had any impact on youth development. U23 players shouldve been on the radar of USSoccer early in, if not before, JKs tenure began. We may not know his impact until after he is gone. The kids that were 9-10-11yrs old are just now old for the likes of u16 so weve probably never heard of them.

Id also like to sort-of agree with the Confeds Cup. It didnt help us in 2010 but did it hurt? Probably not. Exposure of the USMNT is now lost, but theyll have WCQs that year anyway, so it probably wont be too dramatic.

 

[John Price]

JK

- always tinkers
- never takes blame for losses
- puts up mediocre results

I was initially a huge fan of JK but these losses just add fuel to the fire, you can't talk about him getting this team out of the Group of Death anymore when this team can't even beat a Mexico club that was on interim management. Jurgen was 3-0-3 against Mexico prior to last night. He lost for the first time against Mexico. That's not good.

Of course he's not going anywhere and he still has time to turn things around but the fire is starting to heat up around him and he better start looking in the mirror and seeing what he's doing wrong and correct it instead of acting like he is too entitled and that "his way works best". It's not working right now boss

 

[Ugmo]

And what competent coach with international experience will replace JK?

Both of Klinsmann's predecessors were competent, had no international experience and got the exact same results as Klinsmann. Arena actually got better results. Hell, Steve Sampson arguably got better results (Copa America semis in 1995). The argument that Klinsmann is some kind of world-beater who can't be replaced is a complete fallacy. He's doing no better than his predecessors did at a fraction of the cost.

He can be replaced by any number of MLS coaches and the team would probably play better.

Also I do not think 4 years is enough time to see if JK has had any impact on youth development. U23 players shouldve been on the radar of USSoccer early in, if not before, JKs tenure began. We may not know his impact until after he is gone. The kids that were 9-10-11yrs old are just now old for the likes of u16 so weve probably never heard of them.

If we're convinced that he's the guy for that job (and I'm not convinced he is, given his blunders so far), can't we just let him have that job and give the USMNT job to someone who is better at it?

 

[John Price]

http://www.si.com/planet-futbol/2015/10/11/jurgen-klinsmann-usa-mexico-concacaf-cup

But, in light of the U.S.’s men’s national team’s on-field direction in the 15 months since the 2014 World Cup, culminating in a fourth-place Gold Cup finish and in Saturday’s 3-2 loss to Mexico in the CONCACAF Cup, it’s fair to wonder if Klinsmann should also be the senior national team coach. Should he just be the U.S. technical director and stick with that?

Klinsmann isn’t in any danger of losing his U.S. coaching job right now—at least according to his boss, U.S. Soccer president Sunil Gulati—and as long as Klinsmann qualifies the U.S. for World Cup ’18 he’ll almost assuredly keep the coaching job through then. But the way the U.S. played against Mexico was emblematic of how it has played against most decent-to-good teams in recent history: Dropping deep, absorbing pressure, conceding possession and hoping to score on set-pieces or on the counter.

 

[Basement Cat]

What a frustrating game to watch last night. I know one player wouldn't make a huge difference but it was screaming for a Nguyen/Feilhaber to bring some composure and creativity in the midfield. Please stop playing Bradley behind the strikers. He should be playing as an #8 or in Beckerman's role last night with more attacking freedom.

I'm just at a pretty depressed state right now in regards to this team. I know JK isn't going anywhere and we're in a big rut right now in regards to top end talent level and our manager seems completely lost while refusing to hold himself accountable for anything. I'm still not over him chasing away our best player ever and essentially facilitiating his retirement. Donovan would have helped us a **** ton last night, he would still easily be our best attacking player.

 

[chasespace]

The "who with international experience can replace him" argument is infuriating. If they have experience that's great, but it's not required. I'd prefer a manager who has shown he can turn a mess into a respectable side, who can adjust his tactics to his players, and who knows how to pick a strong side instead of his favorites.

You don't need international experience to do that, you need club experience.

 

[John Price]

It's never his damn fault. It's always the officials fault or the players fault. Take responsibility for the **** that you've put us in instead of acting the arrogant know it all fool.

 

[Basement Cat]

The worst part is hearing it from foreigners or even usmnt supporters that he is the best that we can do. They speak as if we should be honored to have klinsmann managing this team

 

[njdevsfn95]

How is it "infuriating" to suggest an international coach should have international experience?

Arena managed 2 non-group games in the WC, an average of 1. Bradley played 1, JK played 1, and Sampson none.

We dont have a great WC history (really non Gold Cup isnt anythig special) so lets not overhype the past because we dont like the present.

 

[East Coast Bias]

My biggest issue is the MLS hate. Look, the league isn't the Bundesliga - we know that. But it's where the majority of Americans end up in their young careers. It's to the benefit of our NT that the MLS grows. It doesn't have to be Europe.

He has no interest in giving a lot of MLS guys a run. I understand the likes of Kljestan, McCarty, Feilhaber, etc aren't long term fixtures in the starting 11. But that they'll never get a sniff of an invite while the Alvarados, Morales, Orozco, of the world keep getting invites is crazy.

There were plenty of good moves to grab dual nationals, but this obsession with anyone who is "part American" is ridiculous. This isn't Guiseppe Rossi in his prime - it's people like Timmy Chandler. Enough.

 

[njdevsfn95]

Well the MLS and nonMLS players disappointed equally in important matches so far this year.

The NT should have a lot of turnover when it underperforms. I guess we will see in November.

 

[Ugmo]

How is it "infuriating" to suggest an international coach should have international experience?

"International experience" hasn't helped Klinsmann to do any better than his predecessors. At this point I would sacrifice international experience for a guy who understands tactics and man management, and that doesn't appear to be Klinsmann.

Arena managed 2 non-group games in the WC, an average of 1. Bradley played 1, JK played 1, and Sampson none.

We dont have a great WC history (really non Gold Cup isnt anythig special) so lets not overhype the past because we dont like the present.

All that's cool, but let's also not overhype Klinsmann because he used to be a good player. As a coach he's done very little outside of a string of about 5 good games in 2006 with one of the world's best player pools. Did okay with Bayern Munich before getting fired because okay wasn't good enough, did okay with the U.S. for the first couple of years, and is now doing poorly.

To me it what it all comes down to is: are we moving in the right direction or are we moving in the wrong direction? I don't understand how anyone can look at yesterday's two results and conclude we are making progress. If the argument is that Klinsmann has overhauled everything and we will have to wait several more years to determine whether that has been successful, my response is what if it hasn't? What if we wait several more years only to find out that he's as bad at overhauling a developmental system as he is at coaching a senior national team? That seems awfully risky. At worst we will be looking at eight years of stagnation as a result of that expensive experiment. Can't we cut our losses now and go with someone who has shown he knows how to get results week in and week out?

 

[njdevscup30]

It amazes me how creative players like Feilhaber and Agudelo continually do not get called up and we play game after game of this awful bunker down soccer.

 

[Ugmo]

It amazes me how creative players like Feilhaber and Agudelo continually do not get called up and we play game after game of this awful bunker down soccer.

I seem to remember that the problem with Feilhaber is that he criticized Klinsmann once over something, so he is now in purgatory. Which is another hallmark of the Klinsmann era.

 

[chasespace]

How is it "infuriating" to suggest an international coach should have international experience?

Arena managed 2 non-group games in the WC, an average of 1. Bradley played 1, JK played 1, and Sampson none.

We dont have a great WC history (really non Gold Cup isnt anythig special) so lets not overhype the past because we dont like the present.

It's infuriating because one, it means they weren't good enough to be an international manager somewhere else(if they left the post to join a club and then went back to coaching international that'd be a different story), and two it invalidates a ton of promising managers because they haven't been trusted with a national team in the past.

 

[Basement Cat]

Im hoping that JK starts working towards a lineup like this and we see it sometime by the summer:

Morris
Johnson-Nguyen-Nagbe
Feilhaber-Bradley
Shea-Besler-Cameron-Yedlin

*If needing more defenseive shape/cover, then replace Nguyen with Williams and swap with Benny (Feilhaber at CAM and Williams at CDM).

This lineup makes us very dynamic. It's a totally different look than what we put out on Saturday and can at least put any opponent on their heels simply due to the speed of it. Nagbe, Nguyen, Feilhaber are all additions that help us in the technical aspect of the game as well.

 

[Brock Anton]

Brian Sciaretta ‏@BrianSciaretta
Jurgen Klinsmann: "I had a very severe word with Fabian Johnson, and I sent him home today."

Brian Sciaretta ‏@BrianSciaretta
Fabian Johnson was sent home today from the #usmnt. Klinsmann felt he was not injured. Wanted to use last sub for Rimando for PKs vs Mexico

Brian Sciaretta ‏@BrianSciaretta
Klinsmann on sending Fabian Johnson home: "He can rethink his approach about his team."

Didn't Johnson just come off a fairly significant injury? (also, LOL at Klinsmann wanting to save a sub for Rimando. I know Rimando is a god at saving PK's but come on, Jurgen)

 

[bluesfan94]

1) playing for PKs is stupid.
2) not having Johnson only hurts our fullback depth more.
3) can we fire Jurgen yet?

 

[Big McLargehuge]

Sounds like he found his scapegoat of the week.

 

[Pavel Buchnevich]

At what point does he lose the locker room?

 

[Brock Anton]

At what point does he lose the locker room?

It's quite possible that he has already.

After the Mexico loss in the Rose Bowl, I asked a few U.S. players if they felt comfortable answering the question: Do you think Klinsmann is the right coach to lead the U.S. team moving forward?

Several said they didn’t feel comfortable answering, and you know what? That makes total sense. But Jermaine Jones and Clint Dempsey said they were willing to answer.

http://www.si.com/planet-futbol/2015/10/11/jurgen-klinsmann-usa-mexico-concacaf-cup

 

[Virtanen18]

So he'd rather have a guy who's gassed (injured?) and potentially detrimental to the team continue to play so he can play for penalties? Smart.

 

[Ugmo]

Sounds like he found his scapegoat of the week.

Yep.

Classic Klinsmann. Bad performance by the team and someone other than Klinsmann is to blame, as always.