Tyson Jost

[The Abusement Park]

I know he's at the WJC lol I'm talking about when he gets back. A 9 game trial is standard for prospects. We're going to see it at some point this season, might aswell send Jost down at the same time.

Unless of course Jost improves between now and when Kaut gets back from Vancouver, but he won't.

Horrible idea imo. Let Kaut marinate, he just started getting acclimated to the AHL and really beginning to be successful there.

 

[henchman21]

I know he's at the WJC lol I'm talking about when he gets back. A 9 game trial is standard for prospects. We're going to see it at some point this season, might aswell send Jost down at the same time.

Unless of course Jost improves between now and when Kaut gets back from Vancouver, but he won't.

It doesn't make any sense whatsoever to rush Kaut. It isn't like his is playing SO well in Loveland that he deserves the call up either. Don't compound the mistake with another.

 

[AvsFan29]

It doesn't make any sense whatsoever to rush Kaut. It isn't like his is playing SO well in Loveland that he deserves the call up either. Don't compound the mistake with another.

I'm not saying we should rush him. Calling up prospects is routine.

 

[henchman21]

I'm not saying we should rush him. Calling up prospects is routine.

Not a +1 player that is outside the top 3/5... Let him have a full year in the AHL with minimal interruption.

 

[AvsFan29]

Not a +1 player that is outside the top 3/5... Let him have a full year in the AHL with minimal interruption.

I'm more interested in sending Jost down. Something needs to happen. Bednar can't keep losing while saying " Oh yah I loved the effort tonight, but some of our secondary scoring guys haven't been great" blah blah

 

[Pokecheque]

More and more questions keep getting asked about him. We're past the "He's 20, nothing to worry about" stage.

 

[Pokecheque]

It doesn't make any sense whatsoever to rush Kaut. It isn't like his is playing SO well in Loveland that he deserves the call up either. Don't compound the mistake with another.

Doesn't it also affect his expansion draft eligibility if he plays so many games this season in the NHL as well?

 

[henchman21]

Doesn't it also affect his expansion draft eligibility if he plays so many games this season in the NHL as well?

Yup... certainly does.

 

[Pokecheque]

Yup... certainly does.

Well, then that's a factor whether people like it or not.

 

[LieutenantDangle]

Since you genuinely think Jost is currently playing like "a decent 3rd liner" then yeah, we're not watching the same player.

We certainly are. Unfortunately a lot of times when people watch certain skaters they have a skewed perception due to expectations of said skater (usually related to draft status).

 

[The Kingslayer]

More and more questions keep getting asked about him. We're past the "He's 20, nothing to worry about" stage.

but but hes....yah not a valid excuse. Something needs to be done with him. Whether its a benching or going to Loveland whatever. He showed some signs of life last night but still not good enough to be relied on to put up any points yet. Way to inconsistent.

 

[BoxOfChocolates]

Only redeeming thing is that the rest of draft sucked (besides Charlie boy). I give Jost another season floundering on the bottom 6 before he's Lazar'd out of here.

 

[Foppa2118]

More and more questions keep getting asked about him. We're past the "He's 20, nothing to worry about" stage.

He's still 20 and only three forwards in the entire 2016 draft have more points than him this year. DeBrincat, Howden (3 more points) and Jesper Bratt (2 more points).

Jost also had a better draft +1 year in college, and a better draft + 2 rookie year in the NHL (pts/gm) than Casey Mittelstadt so far.

Out of the 21 forwards taken in the 1st round in 2015, only 12 have more points than Jost this year. Only 7 of those were taken outside the top 10.

 

[Foppa2118]

The Avs have a pretty smart coaching staff but I keep wondering what they’re telling Jost that he needs to do differently. He doesn’t appear to be conscious of what he’s doing wrong or trying to change his approach. There’s a bunch of things I wish they’d tell him.

He needs to get his feet moving more, and get his legs pumping harder so he’s carrying more speed through the neutral and O zone and creating more space for himself to make plays. This alone can make up for some of his skating issues. Wilson is a good example of this. He looked so slow last year, he could barely stay in the lineup. Now he gets his legs pumping like crazy and his skating isn’t hurting him at all.

He needs to start moving the puck quicker. He’s holding onto it too long, and he’s being too indecisive with it because of his lack of confidence right now. He needs to just start making the simple plays, and taking what he’s given out there. Stop overthinking it and just play hockey.

He needs to start getting his nose dirty. Take his lumps and use his quick hands to grab rebounds and put them in the net. He’s spending too much time around the perimeter. They should tell him to look at the way his buddy Compher plays, and how he just mucks it up around the crease. If Jost played the way Compher does he’d have even more goals than JT, because his hands are quicker at gathering loose pucks and getting shots off before the goaltender can react.

Even if he doesn’t score, getting into those dirty areas will get him into the game mentally. This will help with the overthinking he’s doing. The Chicago game is a good example but in a different way. He was playing hesitant and slow just like he’d been doing a lot lately. Then he took that high stick that cut him open pretty good, and from the next shift until the end of the game he had way more jump, and was making all his passes and shots much quicker and more decisive. Even finished his check on Seabrook on the forecheck and knocked him to the ice.

Finding that separation gear is the most important thing for Jost to work on, but that’s gonna come in the off season. Those other three things are things he can work on during the season and I think he can finish the year with some confidence if he does so. That will help him a lot going into next season.

 

[Pokecheque]

Bednar said that about Jost at today's presser when Dater asked him about it--specifically simplifying his game and getting his head back to where it was when he first came back from the concussion, where he didn't feel (or play) like he was so burdened.

And Bednar harps about pace, skating, and attention to detail almost all the time so I'm positive they're trying to convince him to move his feet. Sadly, his feet just don't get him moving that fast.

Debrincat is an interesting one since he's also a not-big-not-fast guy who unlike Jost has solidified himself as a star in the league very quickly.

 

[Foppa2118]

Bednar said that about Jost at today's presser when Dater asked him about it--specifically simplifying his game and getting his head back to where it was when he first came back from the concussion, where he didn't feel (or play) like he was so burdened.

And Bednar harps about pace, skating, and attention to detail almost all the time so I'm positive they're trying to convince him to move his feet. Sadly, his feet just don't get him moving that fast.

Debrincat is an interesting one since he's also a not-big-not-fast guy who unlike Jost has solidified himself as a star in the league very quickly.

That's good they at least want him to simplify out there. I've heard Bednar bring up once that he needed to move his feet more, so that's a good sign too.

I wonder how much they emphasize these things though. I haven't really seen Jost move his feet that much. He still coasts a little too much, and takes small strides while he's surveying the ice without the puck. Some players can get away with this but I don't think Jost is one. It's a habit that he's used to getting away with at lower levels, but he probably needs to break to be successful in the NHL.

I'd like to see him increase the rpm's in his motor so to speak. Become really tenacious out there on the forecheck and around the net ala Parise. If he can do that I really think he'll start having more success, and people will see a different player out there.

 

[CobraAcesS]

That's good they at least want him to simplify out there. I've heard Bednar bring up once that he needed to move his feet more, so that's a good sign too.

I wonder how much they emphasize these things though. I haven't really seen Jost move his feet that much. He still coasts a little too much, and takes small strides while he's surveying the ice without the puck. It's a habit that he's used to getting away with at lower levels, but he probably needs to break to be successful in the NHL.

I'd like to see him increase the rpm's in his motor so to speak. Become really tenacious out there on the forecheck and around the net ala Parise. If he can do that I really think he'll start having more success, and people will see a different player out there.

Parise is or was also very elusive. That guy has the ability to just disappear and reappear usually with a cuss word to follow for the opposing team. Yeah he crashes the net sometimes, but his read of the game is on another level than Jost's. Parise also had the benefit of being at his best during a completely different era.

The league is all off the rush, or shooting through traffic now. Very little middle ground now days.

 

[Foppa2118]

Parise is or was also very elusive. That guy has the ability to just disappear and reappear usually with a cuss word to follow for the opposing team. Yeah he crashes the net sometimes, but his read of the game is on another level than Jost's. Parise also had the benefit of being at his best during a completely different era.

The league is all off the rush, or shooting through traffic now. Very little middle ground now days.

Yeah I'm not saying he's going to be as good as Parise, but he's good at a lot of things that Parise is good at too. Jost is elusive too, he just doesn't have that separation gear right now in his first couple steps that Parise has.

Plus his confidence is in the dumpster, so he keeps being too hesitant on the forecheck and puts himself in bad body positions with defenders.

If he can get away from overthinking the game, and just be tenacious out there like Parise, it will do him wonders. His skill and vision will start finding it's way into plays more often too, which is how Parise does it. If Parise starts coasting around out there, or not moving his feet as much, he's much less effective.

 

[CobraAcesS]

Yeah I'm not saying he's going to be as good as Parise, but he's good at a lot of things that Parise is good at too. Jost is elusive too, he just doesn't have that separation gear right now in his first couple steps that Parise has.

Plus his confidence is in the dumpster, so he keeps being too hesitant on the forecheck and puts himself in bad body positions with defenders.

If he can get away from overthinking the game, and just be tenacious out there like Parise, it will do him wonders. His skill and vision will start finding it's way into plays more often too, which is how Parise does it. If Parise starts coasting around out there, or not moving his feet as much, he's much less effective.

Actually I think if Jost was in and out of traffic, and half way good at get finding soft ice behind the play open for scoring chances he'd do quite well. One of my biggest complaints about him is his ability to find open ice, and it isn't exclusively linked to his skating either. Plenty of slower players find soft spots and ways to get open for feeds. If he had a snipers mentality he'd probably score more, but he wouldn't be any kind of two-way player at this stage. Which I actually think is asking quite a lot of someone in his position. I think him being given the responsibility of #2C and the expectations it comes with against the puck has f***ed him up mentally.

This is in addition too as well. I definitely see the physical flaws in his game, but they are also being exacerbated by a lack of scorers mentality right now, and much more of a grinders mindset in the way he approaches the game.

It's either confidence driven, or a lack of IQ, or both that adds to the problems. Mentioning Parise just sets off red lights for me in comparing their IQ for the game.

 

[Balthazar]

Only redeeming thing is that the rest of draft sucked (besides Charlie boy).

Yeah I didn't want Jost but I wanted Brown so I'm mostly quiet for that reason.

 

[CobraAcesS]

Yeah I didn't want Jost but I wanted Brown so I'm mostly quiet for that reason.

I conveniently leave that name out when I talk about wanting McAvoy or Chychrun, but he was pretty much even with the other two lol.

 

[Foppa2118]

Actually I think if Jost was in and out of traffic, and half way good at get finding soft ice behind the play open for scoring chances he'd do quite well. One of my biggest complaints about him is his ability to find open ice, and it isn't exclusively linked to his skating either. Plenty of slower players find soft spots and ways to get open for feeds. If he had a snipers mentality he'd probably score more, but he wouldn't be any kind of two-way player at this stage. Which I actually think is asking quite a lot of someone in his position. I think him being given the responsibility of #2C and the expectations it comes with against the puck has ****ed him up mentally.

This is in addition too as well. I definitely see the physical flaws in his game, but they are also being exacerbated by a lack of scorers mentality right now, and much more of a grinders mindset in the way he approaches the game.

It's either confidence driven, or a lack of IQ, or both that adds to the problems. Mentioning Parise just sets off red lights for me in comparing their IQ for the game.

Personally, I don't have any concerns over his IQ. He's already demonstrated to me he has a high IQ on a lot of plays, even in the NHL. Some of the passes he's made through sticks and feet, and to guys that nobody else saw, don't happen by fluke. They're just not happening often enough.

I would agree with a lot of what you said here, but I think a lot of it stems from a lack of confidence not IQ. I think he'd find those soft spots better, he'd win more physical battles down low, he'd shoot the puck more and with more accuracy (not missing the net by ten feet like he did the other day) if he made some changes and started having more success as a result.

I think you're dead on with the too much responsibility aspect though. That was his own doing though. I think he focused way too much on defense early on, wanting to mold his game after Toews. It was made worse by not surrounding him with good defensive players, which made him think he had to take on that role himself.

 

[CobraAcesS]

Personally, I don't have any concerns over his IQ. He's already demonstrated to me he has a high IQ on a lot of plays, even in the NHL. Some of the passes he's made through sticks and feet, and to guys that nobody else saw, don't happen by fluke. They're just not happening often enough.

I would agree with a lot of what you said here, but I think a lot of it stems from a lack of confidence not IQ. I think he'd find those soft spots better, he'd win more physical battles down low, he'd shoot the puck more and with more accuracy (not missing the net by ten feet like he did the other day) if he made some changes and started having more success as a result.

I think you're dead on with the too much responsibility aspect though. That was his own doing though. I think he focused way too much on defense early on, wanting to mold his game after Toews. It was made worse by not surrounding him with good defensive players, which made him think he had to take on that role himself.

That first part references his passing ability more than his IQ as a scorer and how he reads the offensive zone. I don't think Jost should be looking to play with the puck a lot though. Which does line up with your comment earlier about making the simple play. Jost should be getting the puck off his stick as quick as possible and looking for soft spots for his team mates to find him. Which shouldn't be impossible considering Comphers work ethic and Kerfoot's ability to find guys through traffic. So I can't say he hasn't played with the right players either. There has always been someone on his line that is willing to do the dirty work.

Like I said I think using Parise just set me off because his IQ for the game at both ends is at a level Jost won't ever come close to.

 

[Foppa2118]

That first part references his passing ability more than his IQ as a scorer and how he reads the offensive zone. I don't think Jost should be looking to play with the puck a lot though. Which does line up with your comment earlier about making the simple play. Jost should be getting the puck off his stick as quick as possible and looking for soft spots for his team mates to find him. Which shouldn't be impossible considering Comphers work ethic and Kerfoot's ability to find guys through traffic. So I can't say he hasn't played with the right players either. There has always been someone on his line that is willing to do the dirty work.

Like I said I think using Parise just set me off because his IQ for the game at both ends is at a level Jost won't ever come close to.

I definitely agree Parise's IQ and skill is higher. For sure. I think the plays I was referring to show off both his passing skill and vision though. I've been around hockey a long time. I can usually see the plays develop live while I'm watching, so when there's a pass somewhere I didn't expect, it usually means that player has pretty good vision to see it at ice level. He's not Forsberg out there, but he's shown that to me a few times.

It's a timing thing also. They not only see it before others, they make the play right away, before others see it develop. This is something confidence (or lack thereof) can drastically effect because your timing can get all kinds of out of whack, and you're not only not making those plays at the right time, you're making them after everyone else has seen them develop. That's when you start seeing guys get their passes easily picked off, or their shots easily deflected out of the rink.

I'm not sure those young guys have the right playing style or chemistry to click with each other. Jost hasn't really adjusted well to the wing, and Kerfoot doesn't look comfortable when he plays there either. So one of them is usually struggling or hurting confidence wise when they've played together so far. Maybe one of them starts to get more comfortable on the wing and that changes though.

 

[Bender]

More and more questions keep getting asked about him. We're past the "He's 20, nothing to worry about" stage.

What he's not 20 anymore?

Bednar said that about Jost at today's presser when Dater asked him about it--specifically simplifying his game and getting his head back to where it was when he first came back from the concussion, where he didn't feel (or play) like he was so burdened.

And Bednar harps about pace, skating, and attention to detail almost all the time so I'm positive they're trying to convince him to move his feet. Sadly, his feet just don't get him moving that fast.

Debrincat is an interesting one since he's also a not-big-not-fast guy who unlike Jost has solidified himself as a star in the league very quickly.

Unfortunately, Bednar hasn't been great so far this year. He's made numerous poor decisions and his unwillingness to make actual REAL change is certainly not helping this team at all. When he actually decides to make a change and break-up the Top Line he comes up with replacing Landeskog with Nieto??? To quote George Bluth "what are you taking stupid pills again?" He actually decides to split up the Top Line and he only does it for 1 period and goes back to 9296 for the 2nd and 3rd periods?? It's really strange because a while back he put Compher with Lando and Mack in the 3rd period and it paid off right away. Compher has the ability to play with Landeskog and MacKinnon...Nieto just doesn't so I can't for the life of me understand WTF he was thinking. By moving Rantanen on the 2nd line, you're practically making that line a threat no matter which combination of Soderberg, Jost, Kerfoot or Andrighetto you're coming up with. The fact that he can't see this and his refusal to give Soderberg some actual wingers concerns the hell out of me.

Sadly, with Bednar I think it's going to play out the way I anticipated right before Sakic gave him the 1 year extension (for 2019). He's a good coach for a young team but he will not be the guy that's going to be able to take us over the hump. We are going to need a Quenneville-type coach for us to take the next step. For right now, it's fine because we've still got some significant holes in our lineup but my expectations are that he would use what he's got on the roster in the best possible way to limit those holes. He's not doing that right now keeping Soderberg as #3C and giving him those defensive wingers.

Which brings me to Jost. Two games ago, after an average at best 1st period Jost had one hell of a shift where he was forechecking like crazy and caused a turnover which led to a scoring chance. His next shift came about 8 minutes later in that period. Whether that's due to the PP, PK or whatever...the next time his line was out there, Andrighetto was in his spot. That's just no way to bring along a young 20 year old kid.

The way I see it, with our current lineup you can bring him along as a winger on a 1st or 2nd line with a veteran like Soderberg OR you can bring him along as a 3rd line center with lower offensive expectations. If you're going to give him limited minutes on the 4th line, you might as well send him down to the AHL and give him Top Line minutes so he can regain his confidence and actually develop.

**I started writing this message earlier this afternoon before seeing expected lineup - I see he's been given a chance on the top line - [better than Nieto] - I'm gonna watch this game later**