Two so called fourth lines
- Thread starter GoBs
- Start date
You put it much better than I did thanks
The Wagner line looks more like a third line now anyway
ODAAT
Registered User
asking not declaring as I don`t have the luxury of watching the PB`s but from what I have read, is it unreasonable to say Hughes has earned a look? I like some things I`m seeing from Frederic but needs some more time IMO
Healthy Wrap
Registered User
I still have no idea what Acciari’s role in this lineup is. He brings absolutely nothing to the table outside of the occasional hit. He might be one of the worst skaters in the league and looks completely lost out there. The other night, he just blindly skated into Kuraly at the opposing team’s blueline, knocking him off the puck. So frustrating to watch him get significant minutes.
ODAAT
Registered User
and yet, Butch just loves the guy. It`s beyond me, I understand every coach has their go to guy`s and I totally understand why Kuraly and Wags would be on that list for Butch but Acciari brings nothing to that line.
Healthy Wrap
Registered User
Exactly. You can’t argue “well the fourth line has been playing well.” No, that line has been playing well in spite of him. Imagine if you swapped Acciari for someone else, even a guy like Nordstrom? They might actually generate some offense.
Over the volcano
Registered User
The fourth line (with acciari) get force fed defensive zone face offs more than any players on the team - and the club has to be top 5 in goals against this year. To point to any of them for the lack of offense completely misses how they are being deployed and what is expected of them as responsibility #1.
Blocks shots fearlessly also. I not the biggest Noel fan, but he does bring a couple of things to the table which are helpful for the team. Kuraly and Wagner seem to like playing with him- there is some chemistry there.
BruinDust
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- Aug 2, 2005
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Hands up how many people think the Bruins can win a Stanley Cup with essentially TWO 4th lines?
Exactly.
Exactly.
Actually, I think the Kuraly line is doing really well, and plays its best when Acciari's on it. He's not as fast as Wagner or Kuraly, but he's a smart player and is very hard to get the puck away from. Plus he's got to be intimidating to play against. I doubt there's many better 4th lines in the league right now. The problem is the "3rd" line. Frederic doesn't seem quite ready, JFK wasn't that impressive, and Nordstrom is no offensive force. DeBrusk might improve things, but he's not doing all that well right now. Is he hurt again? Maybe Donato can slot in again, or is it time for Senyshen if no trade happens?
Over the volcano
Registered User
Wins face offs too. He’s also getting the least even strength icetime on the club aside from a couple of the part-time kids.
The problems with this team isn’t the 4th line it’s the 2nd and 3rd line that they outplay on an all to regular basis.
Can't argue what he does or doesn't bring to the table but he is not even the worst skater on this team. I watch every B's game and see at least 4 other players continuously fall down with not a soul from either team around them! One thing I will give Acciari credit for is blocking shots not pretending to block shots only to avoid the puck while blocking the goalies view of the shot.
smithformeragent
Moderator
They either have to fill two forward spots in the top 9 or punt on the trade deadline completely IMO. Does little good to fill the hole at 2nd line wing if you don’t also add to the 3rd line. Because they have so much talent in the top 6, they are able to win games despite how badly slotted some guys are in the bottom 6.
1. We dont win a cup with two 4th lines so agree with @BruinDust .
2. Kuralys line doesnt get anointed the 3rd line because they're playing more minutes. No one on that line provides a lick of offense even on a semi regular basis.
3. The best case scenario is we add two pieces and turn the 4th line into a competition between Kuraly,Backes,Wagner,Nordstrom, Acciari. Send Frederic down and dont dare call up JFK or Donato until next season.
2. Kuralys line doesnt get anointed the 3rd line because they're playing more minutes. No one on that line provides a lick of offense even on a semi regular basis.
3. The best case scenario is we add two pieces and turn the 4th line into a competition between Kuraly,Backes,Wagner,Nordstrom, Acciari. Send Frederic down and dont dare call up JFK or Donato until next season.
BruinDust
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- Aug 2, 2005
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I agree they are more than one forward away. They need 2 guys minimum. I think as a complimentary winger Cehlarik is OK with Krejci, but you need another guy not named Jake Debrusk. So either Pasta goes with Krejci and Debrusk up with 63/37 as Cassidy has hinted at trying, or you leave Pasta with the big line, find a RW for Krejci/Cehlarik, and make Debrusk the focal point of line 3 with say one of Nordstrom/Heinen/Backes, and whatever other guy, likely a C, you bring in. (just as well Debrusk tries to do it all by himself half the time anyways).
missingchicklet
Registered User
- Jan 24, 2010
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EverittMike posted this two games ago, and bears reposting for this thread:
And those numbers should be down a tick since last game. That's the ENTIRE 4th line in that group, and two players frequently on the third line, and one of those players is making $6 million a year! It's hard for me to wrap my head around having 5 starting forwards in the bottom 30 in the entire NHL, with one of them being at the bottom and having played 45 games. This team's defense will be more than fine without the worst offensive player in the NHL on it. The PK is ranked 17th last I checked, so it's not like Acciari is some kind of world beater. At some point you have to have some kind of scoring from your bottom 6. I said going into the season one of my main worries was the lack of scoring from the 4th line and it needed to be addressed. You simply cannot make a deep Cup run with virtually no contributions from an entire line, much less two entire lines. It's wonderful to have a great defensive line, but there has to be some offense generated.
And here's the kicker, a decent number of the few goals scored by the guys on the fourth line were scored when they weren't playing as a line together. They were on the ice with other players. Part of this is Bruce's fault in that he has some odd fascination with Acciari and he has been complete ADHD with the third line and broke up the only group that was doing anything for whatever reason after several games. So much for chemistry building. A big part of the fault lies with Sweeney. He built a roster with too much redundancy, not to mention he saddled the team with an expensive player who is utter trash offensively given his salary. And obviously some of the youngsters haven't stepped up this season to make up for the scoring lost with players moved out over the summer. Not sure whose fault the last one is. Strange how more than a couple players have regressed this season. Seems like the right buttons haven't been pushed with a lot of these guys. That's neither here nor there at this point, though, as the situation is what it is and Sweeney needs to step up and do his job and address the problems he has created.
And those numbers should be down a tick since last game. That's the ENTIRE 4th line in that group, and two players frequently on the third line, and one of those players is making $6 million a year! It's hard for me to wrap my head around having 5 starting forwards in the bottom 30 in the entire NHL, with one of them being at the bottom and having played 45 games. This team's defense will be more than fine without the worst offensive player in the NHL on it. The PK is ranked 17th last I checked, so it's not like Acciari is some kind of world beater. At some point you have to have some kind of scoring from your bottom 6. I said going into the season one of my main worries was the lack of scoring from the 4th line and it needed to be addressed. You simply cannot make a deep Cup run with virtually no contributions from an entire line, much less two entire lines. It's wonderful to have a great defensive line, but there has to be some offense generated.
And here's the kicker, a decent number of the few goals scored by the guys on the fourth line were scored when they weren't playing as a line together. They were on the ice with other players. Part of this is Bruce's fault in that he has some odd fascination with Acciari and he has been complete ADHD with the third line and broke up the only group that was doing anything for whatever reason after several games. So much for chemistry building. A big part of the fault lies with Sweeney. He built a roster with too much redundancy, not to mention he saddled the team with an expensive player who is utter trash offensively given his salary. And obviously some of the youngsters haven't stepped up this season to make up for the scoring lost with players moved out over the summer. Not sure whose fault the last one is. Strange how more than a couple players have regressed this season. Seems like the right buttons haven't been pushed with a lot of these guys. That's neither here nor there at this point, though, as the situation is what it is and Sweeney needs to step up and do his job and address the problems he has created.
Now can we find the stat that says how often this 4th line is on the ice against the other teams 1st line and how they don't allow goals against to the other teams 1st line. Also how many D zone face-offs this 4th line gets against the other teams 1st line. I believe Kuraly is a plus 4 or 5, Wagner a -1 and Acciari and Nordstrom a -5 or -6.
This line allows the Bergeron line to match up against lesser lines. Could they have a 10 to 12 more goals, yes, but sacrificing that for the D end is not what this 4th line is.
I do agree the problem is that all none of the guys are 3rd line material, but the 4th line is doing it's job.
This line allows the Bergeron line to match up against lesser lines. Could they have a 10 to 12 more goals, yes, but sacrificing that for the D end is not what this 4th line is.
I do agree the problem is that all none of the guys are 3rd line material, but the 4th line is doing it's job.
Dr Quincy
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- Jun 19, 2005
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Can they? I mean, I get that we think certain types of players who don't score MUST be good at defense.... but is that true?
In fact, who are the bottom 3 Fs in "Expected +/-" (based on the number of shots for and against and WHERE these shots are coming from):
Smith
Backes
and worst of all
Nordstrom
EDIT: Additionally...
High Danger Chances For % looks at the pct of high danger chances a line creates and allows. Bottom 4- Bjork, Cave, Nordstrom and Backes (Smith hasn't played enough minutes to qualify). Surprisingly, the 3 best are Wagner, Kuraly and Acciari.
I don't think the solution is in playing those 6 guys, but in replacing the 3 bad ones (or at least 2 of them) with someone better.
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Exactly. Like the "Bruins Stats" clown who spins out the numbers to meet his agenda. Each line and player has a job to do. The 4th line does the job they're given as well as any 4th line in the NHL. They shut down the other teams top scorers.
Dr Quincy
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- Jun 19, 2005
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Well, I didn't quite say that... because they don't. They really don't play against the other teams' top scorers, and you wouldn't want them to. They play against easier competition than the 1st 2 lines, and about the same in general as the 3rd.
They do get a bunch of D zone starts and do well with it. They play against 3rd and 4th lines for the most part and outchance those lines. I don't want them playing more, or playing above their weight, but for what they are asked to do they are very effective.
They actually don't play against the bottom lines, especially at home where Cassidy has last change.
Against the Isles the other night they had Nelson, Eberle and Lee all night. They had the Ovechkin line at home vs Washington. Where Cassidy can match them up, he does.
Here's your B's 5 on 5 goals stats:
Pasta 16
Bergy 12
Marchand 12
Debrusk 9
Krecji 8
Heinen 6
Wagner 6
Kuraly 6
Nordstrom 5
Krug 4
A 5 vs 5 scoring 3rd line is a must have, there isn't one.
Against the Isles the other night they had Nelson, Eberle and Lee all night. They had the Ovechkin line at home vs Washington. Where Cassidy can match them up, he does.
Here's your B's 5 on 5 goals stats:
Pasta 16
Bergy 12
Marchand 12
Debrusk 9
Krecji 8
Heinen 6
Wagner 6
Kuraly 6
Nordstrom 5
Krug 4
A 5 vs 5 scoring 3rd line is a must have, there isn't one.
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No. The problem with the 3rd line is that is has two 4th liners on it. Make a move to make it have 1 4th liner on it.
mjhfb
Easier from up here
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