[TSN]: Goals should be worth two points

[HanSolo]

Does Canada have laws against drinking in the workplace?

 

[djpatm]

As someone whose favourite teams offence is orchestrated by a magical play maker, absolutely not.

 

[Fataldogg]

I've always viewed goals as more prominent than assists and will never understand those who put assists on or above the level of a goal.

A goal can happen without an assist, not the other way around.

That said, making goals two points is ridiculous. It doesn't make any sense.

We already have the ability to break down an athlete's primary points [goals + primary assists]. I think that is all we need.

Yeah, I think some secondary assists are meaningless and inflate players totals in Art Ross races, but making goals two points is not the answer.

 

[Icebreakers]

Its too late to eliminate secondary assists. If you do that then you have to take away every single secondary assist from players in the past. Otherwise you have meaningless record books and meaningless accomplishments and history.

That and scoring records/hall of fame requirements/contract numbers would all be vastly different and or meaningless.

 

[Tage2Tuch]

For the people who say “who cares this is just an article calm down”,..... well people likely kids are actually using a goals mean more argument now on these boards ....Already ....words carry impact and consequences. Not that it’s startling to see an opinion on a message board but imagine if this started to become a trend. My god.

I mean I can’t tell you how many goals are scored after someone flies up the wing dangles past a couple guys either shoots or passed and it’s an easy tap in for a guy right in front of the net. But yeah that’s two points for the easy tap in because it’s the goal ....and one point or half for all the work. Got it.

Everyone would become puck hogs and team play would be taken out of the game as well as creativity and structure.

 

[valet]

eliminate points

 

[Inkling]

Eliminate the bumping of threads that are almost a year old. It was a dumb idea in 2017 and it's still a dumb idea today so why are we still talking about it?

 

[grieves]

Eliminate the bumping of threads that are almost a year old. It was a dumb idea in 2017 and it's still a dumb idea today so why are we still talking about it?

Because I made the mistake of bumping a thread without realizing that my post would just get swallowed up in the multiple pages of posts. In hindsight I should have started a new one. Anyway, here is what I bumped it with:

Found a thread for this so best bump it up.

I think that goals being worth two points would overvalue goals slightly, but the current system overvalues assists HUGELY, second assists most of all.

Even just the fact that you can get 2 assists per one goal should already tell you that on average goals are more valuable.


It wasn't long ago that these were broken down. I especially urge you to read user Se829ne's reasoning and mathematical break-down in the thread below.

http://hfboards.mandatory.com/threads/be-it-resolved-that-point-totals-goal-totals.2453077/page-5

On average goals are definitely worth more than assists, no question. Of course there are exceptions, but even the most awesome assist needs someone to execute the goal whereas 5% of all goals are unassisted.


Some NHL Stars Get More Assists At Home Than They Deserve
Goals, Assists, And Equality
https://www.tsn.ca/goals-should-be-worth-two-points-1.887265
What is the objective value of an assist?


From the last link:
"So to answer the question, what is the value of an assist we arrive at 54% for first assists and 19% for second assists [in relation to goals]"

So roughly speaking, 1 goal = 2 primary assists = 5 secondary assists, in value.

Do you disagree with that and why?

 

[Dr Jan Itor]

What about the guy that screens the goalie? Never touches the puck but the goal would never have happened without him. Shouldn't that be like a 1/2 goal + 1/2 assist or something?

 

[Barrie22]

Just give all 5 players on the ice a point just like plus/minus.

All players are just important to the goal as the next player so every one should get rewarded for it.

 

[Craig Button]

What happens when the play maker makes the pass then skates off the ice and someone else is on when they score?

They should give the players on the bench points too.

Say you’re feeling down and your buddy a few seats from you says “Dun waahReeh bout ta ting boy. Ya gyet da nex one.”
you start feel a whole lot better and on your next shift you score a goal.
Surely he must get a point

 

[Frank Drebin]

What happens when the play maker makes the pass then skates off the ice and someone else is on when they score?

They should give the players on the bench points too.

Say you’re feeling down and your buddy a few seats from you says “Dun waahReeh bout ta ting boy. Ya gyet da nex one.”
you start feel a whole lot better and on your next shift you score a goal.
Surely he must get a point

I would love to have a buddy like that

 

[stampedingviking]

oh the humanity!

what's next 3 points for a win? a trapezoid behind the net? shootouts to determine wins because many people were saying that the "fans" hate ties and the "fans" will love the shootout

all cockamamie ideas

Except the 3 points for a win, that should be implemented immediately.

 

[arrbez]

I'm surprised how many people are so angrily against this idea. It has it's flaws, but it's not any worse than the system we have now. For every great breakout pass where the second assist is vital, there's at least one second assist of some guy just sliding the puck along to someone else on the PP.

If we had all grown up watching a one-assist sport, anyone suggesting that we add a second assist and make it worth as much as the goal would be laughed at.

 

[EON]

I disagree with this, but I would like to see them separate primary and secondary assists in some fashion.

 

[Name Nameless]

I disagree with this, but I would like to see them separate primary and secondary assists in some fashion.

Don't they do this already, by simply not giving credit for the secondary assist unless it was "fun"?

(Edit, as so many people like to misunderstand. Unless it was of value. I guess they have increased the amount of secondary assists, but still.)

 

[McFlash97]

I've always viewed goals as more prominent than assists and will never understand those who put assists on or above the level of a goal.

A goal can happen without an assist, not the other way around.

That said, making goals two points is ridiculous. It doesn't make any sense.

We already have the ability to break down an athlete's primary points [goals + primary assists]. I think that is all we need.

Yeah, I think some secondary assists are meaningless and inflate players totals in Art Ross races, but making goals two points is not the answer.

Yes Let's give Maroon 2 points on this play and McDavid 1.

 

[LakeLivin]

Yes Let's give Maroon 2 points on this play and McDavid 1.

Ok, you've convinced me. I'm going to start making general rules according to exceptions rather than what typically happens.

 

[kingsholygrail]

Goals scored from the blue line should be worth 3 goals.

 

[Fig]

I don't think I saw anyone discuss short handed goals. Those must be worth more, right?

Or game winning goals... real vs fake ones.
Or own goals... bad deflections vs stupid plays.


Seriously though, hockey is a team game with significant fluidity that is not found in many other sports. That alone puts emphasis on the assists. Because of this, not all goals are created equal, just like how all assists are created equal. IMO, many of the tracking issues will disappear the moment they put a tracker in the puck and the players and can definitively track individual stats. You'd be able to award assists with certainty and you'd probably even be able to track players away from the play.

As for changing the value of the goals/assists. That's dumb. I could imagine doing so would create an insane influx of puck hog type players. That'd be very boring IMO as you'd have players peppering the goalie with crappy shots rather than pass to a teammate for a surefire goal.

 

[maacoshark]

Leave it alone. If anything they could add a separate stat for primary and secondary assists.
It still wouldn't tell the entire story. Sometimes it is the secondary assist that was the play that created the goal.

 

[Silky mitts]

In my mind goals are worth 1.6 points so when I compare 2 guys I add .6 the difference in goals to the guy with more goals.

 

[JeremyTB]

For the people saying Goals are more important than assists. So are you saying Laine is better than McDavid. Marleau better than Thornton? About 25 players better than Crosby apparently. This idea is rediculous.

 

[MattySnipes]

It's fine the way it is. A lot of times it's the primary (sometimes secondary) assist that creates easy goals.

 

[Sundance]

What about the guy that screens the goalie? Never touches the puck but the goal would never have happened without him. Shouldn't that be like a 1/2 goal + 1/2 assist or something?

He gets a sense of accomplishment and pride.