TV: True Detective (Part IV)

[les Habs]

Being on vacation and my older iPad somehow not being supported by HBO (just like my parents' Samsung smart TV - seriously?) So now we essentially know that Hoyt blackmailed Hays off the case and that's why he left it back in 90.

Looking forward to next week, but I suspect I'll be disappointed as I know I won't see Hays go lurp in the Arkansas countryside. At least by the final episode's title we know one thing.

Here's an article that discusses it:

True Detective: This Tiny Detail May Reveal Julie Purcell’s Fate

I thought the guy was something to pay attention to, but didn't notice the name on the truck and wouldn't have tied it back. It gives me the idea that he helped Julie run away. Maybe from the Hoyts, and maybe from the nun's home. Thing is we don't know when she got out of the Hoyt home.

 

[Em etah Eh]

Man that exchange between Hays and West after they take care of the body was something else. Wow. I also liked that you got to see Hays senior remorseful and finally apologizing to Roland for how he used Tom against him, before you actually see how it initially went down.

And Hoyt didn't waste any time did he? What was it, like the very next morning he shows up? I wonder if he had surveillance footage from the complex showing Hays and West camping outside the complex, prior to James leaving.

 

[chicagoskycam]

Man that exchange between Hays and West after they take care of the body was something else. Wow. I also liked that you got to see Hays senior remorseful and finally apologizing to Roland for how he used Tom against him, before you actually see how it initially went down.

And Hoyt didn't waste any time did he? What was it, like the very next morning he shows up? I wonder if he had surveillance footage from the complex showing Hays and West camping outside the complex, prior to James leaving.

Yeah I thought about that. There was only one other person there that knew exactly what happened, right? How would he have known all that or maybe just going off of assumption? Hoyt has moles in the police department obviously.

We finally found out what they did and covered up. Hays is not a reliable focal point later in life due to his condition. What was up with him looking back over his shoulder when his future self was watching him. Is this what started a bit of psychotic break? Are many of the scenes we are witnessing with Hays even real?

The scene between Hays and Amelia discussing her writing about the case was good. Up until now they portrayed her as more opportunistic without Hays blessing.

 

[Em etah Eh]

Yeah I thought about that. There was only one other person there that knew exactly what happened, right? How would he have known all that or maybe just going off of assumption? Hoyt has moles in the police department obviously.

We finally found out what they did and covered up. Hays is not a reliable focal point later in life due to his condition. What was up with him looking back over his shoulder when his future self was watching him. Is this what started a bit of psychotic break? Are many of the scenes we are witnessing with Hays even real?

The scene between Hays and Amelia discussing her writing about the case was good. Up until now they portrayed her as more opportunistic without Hays blessing.

Yeah, this was another exchange I really liked and we got closure on how the book came about. Hays was basically like **** 'em.

 

[Jovavic]

I read an interview with the creator and everything Hayes is in is as it happened, we aren't watching his memory of the scene.

 

[chicagoskycam]

I read an interview with the creator and everything Hayes is in is as it happened, we aren't watching his memory of the scene.

So he's eh... time warping?

 

[Blender]

So he's eh... time warping?

No it means we're seeing the scenes from that time period, not Hayes memory of it. I'm sure he was trying to dispel some of the unreliable narrator stuff, at least from the 1980 and 1990 scenes.

 

[darko]

Interesting theory I heard was that the interview chick (Eliza) is Julie's daughter. Julie was 12 in 1980 so she'd be 47 at the time of the interview (2015). Julie got knocked up young and died young enough for Eliza to not know much about her mother. Not sure I buy it.

 

[les Habs]

Hoyt has moles in the police department obviously.

Does he? Only two moles I can think of, but one would fit into a potential theory I alluded a while back.

Interesting theory I heard was that the interview chick (Eliza) is Julie's daughter. Julie was 12 in 1980 so she'd be 47 at the time of the interview (2015). Julie got knocked up young and died young enough for Eliza to not know much about her mother. Not sure I buy it.

I'm tired and I could have just missed it, but Julie is dead? They've confirmed that?

 

[darko]

Does he? Only two moles I can think of, but one would fit into a potential theory I alluded a while back.



I'm tired and I could have just missed it, but Julie is dead? They've confirmed that?

No but in 1990 she was alive (Walgreens cctv + phone call) but nothing since.

 

[DJ Spinoza]

I don't really have a worked out theory, but I think something with both Wayne's daughter Becca and with Amelia will be important for unlocking the final pieces. We sort of have a sense for everything at this point IMO, but not really the details or fully specific picture. There's something to the fact that Amelia isn't with them when he's dropping Becca off at college, and in general, unless I have forgotten, we do not know when or how Amelia died.

The college drop off scene seems like it takes place about 10-15 years before the 2015 timeline? If Becca is 4-5 during the 1990 scenes, then she'd be 18 around 2003-2005?

Part of me was thinking that Amelia would take off after Hoyt and Wayne, bringing the kids, and there'd be some kind of accident where Becca was killed, but that doesn't work given the college drop off scene. You could go full paranoid and say that maybe Becca is abducted or killed after she's dropped off (Wayne looks anxious, but he always looks anxious), but I don't quite think that's it either.

Anyways, I'm rambling, but I have the impression that even though we have all the overall broad strokes sense of what happened, there's another detail or two that needs to click, and it's somehow connected to Amelia and Becca.

 

[Jovavic]

In 2015 it seems Becca is estranged from Wayne, but at the college dropoff in 2003ish, they seem to have a good relationship...so something major goes down but I can't figure out what and how it fits with the case, if it does.

 

[DJ Spinoza]

Yeah it's really hazy to me. Part of me wants to think that whatever it is might be one of the sources of Wayne's memory troubles, but it might also just be something that's related strongly to his character development and not really the case per se.

I was thinking one direction they might go is that there are also young black girls who have been abducted as part of this conspiracy, and maybe that could be what happened to Becca, but I'm not sure that fits now. It seemed like the one-eyed black man from Amelia's reading wasn't a threat to the kids, but was just as angry about their disappearance. But maybe that's a screen, and he is the procurer for the Hoyt's or something.

Another thing that might be going on is that Eliza is a depiction of TD fans who want to connect every dot. I'm also suspicious that there will be a possible unresolved conspiracy, like in season one, but the Purcell case won't be clearly linked to this conspiracy, and moreover this conspiracy won't be linked to the conspiracy from season one. As much as these plot points drive interest from a lot of fans (including me), I don't think they are really the primary thing that the stories are about.

 

[les Habs]

No but in 1990 she was alive (Walgreens cctv + phone call) but nothing since.

So we don't know if she's dead or alive then.

I don't really have a worked out theory, but I think something with both Wayne's daughter Becca and with Amelia will be important for unlocking the final pieces. We sort of have a sense for everything at this point IMO, but not really the details or fully specific picture. There's something to the fact that Amelia isn't with them when he's dropping Becca off at college, and in general, unless I have forgotten, we do not know when or how Amelia died.

The college drop off scene seems like it takes place about 10-15 years before the 2015 timeline? If Becca is 4-5 during the 1990 scenes, then she'd be 18 around 2003-2005?

Part of me was thinking that Amelia would take off after Hoyt and Wayne, bringing the kids, and there'd be some kind of accident where Becca was killed, but that doesn't work given the college drop off scene. You could go full paranoid and say that maybe Becca is abducted or killed after she's dropped off (Wayne looks anxious, but he always looks anxious), but I don't quite think that's it either.

Anyways, I'm rambling, but I have the impression that even though we have all the overall broad strokes sense of what happened, there's another detail or two that needs to click, and it's somehow connected to Amelia and Becca.

Yeah it's really hazy to me. Part of me wants to think that whatever it is might be one of the sources of Wayne's memory troubles, but it might also just be something that's related strongly to his character development and not really the case per se.

I was thinking one direction they might go is that there are also young black girls who have been abducted as part of this conspiracy, and maybe that could be what happened to Becca, but I'm not sure that fits now. It seemed like the one-eyed black man from Amelia's reading wasn't a threat to the kids, but was just as angry about their disappearance. But maybe that's a screen, and he is the procurer for the Hoyt's or something.

Another thing that might be going on is that Eliza is a depiction of TD fans who want to connect every dot. I'm also suspicious that there will be a possible unresolved conspiracy, like in season one, but the Purcell case won't be clearly linked to this conspiracy, and moreover this conspiracy won't be linked to the conspiracy from season one. As much as these plot points drive interest from a lot of fans (including me), I don't think they are really the primary thing that the stories are about.

Unless I'm mistaken, Becca is alive in 2015. I think they referenced here in one of the middle episodes.

 

[chicagoskycam]

There is definitely something to Amelia being dead that ties into this case.

 

[les Habs]

There is definitely something to Amelia being dead that ties into this case.

I'm not so sure.

 

[DJ Spinoza]

Unless I'm mistaken, Becca is alive in 2015. I think they referenced here in one of the middle episodes.

That's right – the son tells him that she's in LA in one of the middle episodes, and I guess I've been leaping to the conclusion that it's not really all there is to the story. The straightforward option seems like they become estranged somehow, and the more "sinister" option is that something bad happened and that's just what they tell Wayne when he brings her up. But My recollection from when they are having dinner is that it's implied they had some kind of falling out.

I think it's both Amelia being dead and also something that's in the book that will be crucial, i.e., she's the best detective/hunter of them all. I'm just not really sure how much more there is to the details of the case, or if the finale is mostly going to be about Wayne as a character. There was some kind of story about Ali saying it was the best episode of TV he's ever read, and also some question about whether HBO would let Pizzolato show a longer-than-60 minute cut, so I guess we'll see.

 

[JetsWillFly4Ever]

On the talk of Becca being alive:

I'm not so sure just because Purple's son said she was in LA, that it necessarily means she is alive. A big part of this season has to do with Hays' dementia. One of the hardest things to deal with in regards to dementia is the person forgetting that other people have died. It may be that they have tried to explain to Hays' multiple times that she is dead but he then gets very upset before forgetting shortly after. It may just be easier to say she is in LA and avoid upsetting Hays.

 

[Jovavic]

Or Becca is in jail for killing Amelia, dun dun dun!

 

[Fantomas]

So is this season a) great, b) good, c) so-so, d) bad???

 

[Trap Jesus]

So is this season a) great, b) good, c) so-so, d) bad???

First 2 episodes were great. I'd say it's kind of been in between good and so-so since, although more so towards the good side.

 

[Ozz]

So is this season a) great, b) good, c) so-so, d) bad???

I think it's great, but if one doesn't like the "slow burn" I could see them knocking it down a peg or two.

 

[SouthGeorge]

First 2 episodes were great. I'd say it's kind of been in between good and so-so since, although more so towards the good side.

This. I'd wait to binge the whole thing. The slow pace and waiting a week does it no favors.

 

[JetsWillFly4Ever]

I'd have it between great and good. The two leads are fantastic, and the story is good, but it is a slow burn for sure.

Looking forward to see how everything is wrapped up.

 

[Blender]

On the talk of Becca being alive:

I'm not so sure just because Purple's son said she was in LA, that it necessarily means she is alive. A big part of this season has to do with Hays' dementia. One of the hardest things to deal with in regards to dementia is the person forgetting that other people have died. It may be that they have tried to explain to Hays' multiple times that she is dead but he then gets very upset before forgetting shortly after. It may just be easier to say she is in LA and avoid upsetting Hays.

In an earlier episode when Hayes first went to see Roland, he asked Roland about Tom Purcell, and all Roland said was "he died a few years back". Last episode we obviously saw that he died in 1990 as part of the case.