Confirmed with Link: Travis Konecny Signs Extension - 6 Years/$33M ($5.5M AAV)

[Rebels57]

I’d argue that putting giroux couturier and voracek together is counterintuitive. Not that the line itself wouldn’t be successful, but it makes us an easier team lines 1-4 to play against.

Currently, and this is open to discussion, we have four guys that I would characterize as play drivers: couturier, giroux, voracek and Hayes. If we stack three of them on one line, we have a line that is counting on Nolan Patrick to carry. I think it’s a much more balanced lineup keeping voracek away from giroux and couturier (whom I expect will stick together). Konecny has shown the ability to be an above average finisher for that line and as he further develops, some consistency in that role could end up with him being a 30-35 goal guy.

Agreed. Jake should be carrying his own line.

 

[Starat327]

Agreed. Jake should be carrying his own line.

Yeah, but Jake's a bum too, so we can't do that.

 

[prototypical4thliner]

Agreed. Jake should be carrying his own line.

I sincerely hope Patrick ends up being able to do so because it’ll give me hope that the flyers can have nice things that are not broken.

But right now:

Giroux—couturier—konecny
Jvr—Hayes—lindblom
Farabee—Patrick—voracek

Looks great for a top nine.

 

[Ruck Over]

Yeah, but Jake's a bum too, so we can't do that.

Well, they're all bums, what have they won lately?

Pre-season? Losing record.

 

[prototypical4thliner]

Yeah, but Jake's a bum too, so we can't do that.

Listen, little man.

 

[Starat327]

Listen, little man.

Please dont hurt me.

 

[Starat327]

Well, there all bums, what have they won lately?

Pre-season? Losing record.

Yeah, but you see the way Braun shut down all those rookies and ECHLers?

 

[deadhead]

Yeah, but you see the way Braun shut down all those rookies and ECHLers?

Yes, and that's the way you play defense, be in position consistently instead of wandering off in search of hits or scoring opportunities.
Works against rookies, AHL players and NHL stars.

 

[Ghosts Beer]

a)That pair was extremely good at the defensive side of things as well. Ghost actually had the better defensive metrics that year as well, if im not mistaken. But hey, why let a little bias ruin the conversation?
b) This makes no sense, because when Provorov and Ghost were together, they were handling the hardest matchups, and consistently outproducing the other team.
c) G-Couturier-Voracek was hot garbage at times as well, yet you seem awfully interested in reuniting that and giving it another shot. G-Couturier- TK was an incredible line at one point as well.

As usual, this reeks of complete bias.

As usual you are making a huge deal out of a simple difference of personal opinion, unable to tolerate an opinion that differs from your own. Might have a few biases of yourself there.

 

[Starat327]

Yes, and that's the way you play defense, be in position consistently instead of wandering off in search of hits or scoring opportunities.
Works against rookies, AHL players and NHL stars.

Correct, but its considerably easier against players that arent used to that level of competition. You literally just made the same argument in the other thread:

Frost was overmatched because in the CHL there are few physically mature players and he has to learn techniques to handle them (Giroux is the same size and has no problem - of course, Giroux spent half a year in the AHL when he was 21).

 

[Starat327]

As usual you are making a huge deal out of a simple difference of personal opinion, unable to tolerate an opinion that differs from your own. Might have a few biases of yourself there.

I can tolerate a difference of opinion. I can't tolerate one that has a terrible bias towards a player. You're using one argument to hold up your point of view on a pedestal, while simultaneously pretending as though the same set of standards shouldnt be applied to another player with the EXACT same logic.

 

[bennysflyers16]

Yeah, but Jake's a bum too, so we can't do that.

Agreed

 

[deadhead]

Correct, but its considerably easier against players that arent used to that level of competition. You literally just made the same argument in the other thread:

Huh. Trying to pick fights tough guy?

The point with Braun was that the level of competition is irrelevant, he's a proven NHL player - what we saw was why he's successful, he's extremely fundamentally sound defensively. As far as whether he "still has it," didn't see any problem with his skating, he's faster than most of the defensemen we've fielded since 2011. He's certainly not a slow "dinosaur" that just gets in the way on defense.

With Frost, he's going to need time to learn to deal with NHL physicality, how many CHL players are 200 lbs with average or better skating skills?
The difference with Farabee, while both may weigh a similar amount, Farabee has wiry natural strength that Frost lacks and showed he can hold his own physically (now whether that holds for 90+ games?).

 

[dragonoffrost]

I'd love this to be the year that TK gets solidly on G and Coots line and starts to break out to score like Jake. Then we can have Jake with Hayes and Lindblom or JvR. The other one can join Patrick and Farabee. Imagine rolling those three lines. Ice time will be spread well and players will be fresh as the season goes on.

 

[Starat327]

Huh. Trying to pick fights tough guy?

The point with Braun was that the level of competition is irrelevant, he's a proven NHL player - what we saw was why he's successful, he's extremely fundamentally sound defensively. As far as whether he "still has it," didn't see any problem with his skating, he's faster than most of the defensemen we've fielded since 2011. He's certainly not a slow "dinosaur" that just gets in the way on defense.

With Frost, he's going to need time to learn to deal with NHL physicality, how many CHL players are 200 lbs with average or better skating skills?
The difference with Farabee, while both may weigh a similar amount, Farabee has wiry natural strength that Frost lacks and showed he can hold his own physically (now whether that holds for 90+ games?).

Correct. Braun is a capable NHL defenders - but the assertion earlier was that he looked great, and that he proved the haters wrong, etc etc. Isn't it easier to look better when youre playing against compeition below your own level? I would fully expect an NFL team to roll out a high school football team, for instance. Unless its the dolphins. Then i probably take the high school team.

 

[Ghosts Beer]

I can tolerate a difference of opinion. I can't tolerate one that has a terrible bias towards a player. You're using one argument to hold up your point of view on a pedestal, while simultaneously pretending as though the same set of standards shouldnt be applied to another player with the EXACT same logic.

Lmao. You’re being ridiculous. Mr. Oh So Tolerant, triggered simply because I said I prefer Voracek on line 1. Which according to you has “no justification.” But I’m the one putting my opinion on a pedestal. Sometimes you just have to laugh.

 

[deadhead]

I don't care how veterans look against the competition pre-season. Their jobs are guaranteed, they're just getting ready for the season.
What I was looking for with both Braun and Hayes was their skating and their general "game."

With Braun, the question was whether he was physically declining, I saw a guy who skated just fine. And watching his positioning, well, it's obvious why Fletcher/AV wanted him - he's what Provorov wants to be when he grows up. Yes, he's going to be a great mentor teaching young players how to play defense - but it was also obvious you want him with someone like Ghost or Sanheim - because he's not going to be challenging for the scoring lead among defensemen.

With Hayes, it was why did they spend $7M? I think he answered that, not by beating up on a scrub, but by showing the portfolio of tools he brings in every aspect of the game. He's not great at any one aspect of the game, but he's good at practically everything.

 

[Starat327]

Lmao. You’re being ridiculous. Mr. Oh So Tolerant, triggered simply because I said I prefer Voracek on line 1. Which according to you has “no justification.” But I’m the one putting my opinion on a pedestal. Sometimes you just have to laugh.

Resorting to strawmen and personal attacks, nice. I'm not triggered at all. It's actually been humorous to watch you look like a cartoon character trying backpedal out of your comment because your own logic would have forced you to recognize that a player you are clearly biased against should be rewarded for his good play.

A+ for effort, though.

 

[Starat327]

I don't care how veterans look against the competition pre-season. Their jobs are guaranteed, they're just getting ready for the season.
What I was looking for with both Braun and Hayes was their skating and their general "game."

With Braun, the question was whether he was physically declining, I saw a guy who skated just fine. And watching his positioning, well, it's obvious why Fletcher/AV wanted him - he's what Provorov wants to be when he grows up. Yes, he's going to be a great mentor teaching young players how to play defense - but it was also obvious you want him with someone like Ghost or Sanheim - because he's not going to be challenging for the scoring lead among defensemen.

With Hayes, it was why did they spend $7M? I think he answered that, not by beating up on a scrub, but by showing the portfolio of tools he brings in every aspect of the game. He's not great at any one aspect of the game, but he's good at practically everything.

Im not sure either played proved anything one way or the other. I'm more than happy to say that both looked good last night. But again, its easier to look good against lesser competition. It certainly bodes well for future play that they didnt look lost, but just like Morgan being unable to get around Gabriel, I wouldnt expect Braunor Hayes to struggle much with the islanders prospects who arent even on the level of Morgan Frost.

 

[deadhead]

You're missing the point, this was our first chance to see them as a Flyer, it's not what they did against the competition, it's how they looked.

The same way what mattered with Zamula was his good positioning, smooth skating and solid puck handling, not whether he skated past three scrubs and shot a puck into the upper left hand corner.

In exhibition games you're just getting a feel for a player's skill set, as Vorobyev showed last year, what you do in these games is pretty meaningless, but what you show provides a clue to your talent level and style of play.

 

[Starat327]

What you show is correlated to the level of competition youre playing against, with the exception of level of compete. Its easy to show something when you have the time and space to show it.

 

[Rich Nixon]

I sincerely hope Patrick ends up being able to do so because it’ll give me hope that the flyers can have nice things that are not broken.

But right now:

Giroux—couturier—konecny
Jvr—Hayes—lindblom
Farabee—Patrick—voracek

Looks great for a top nine.

I’m torn, because I love the balance that presents, but at the same time...

That JVR-Hayes-Voracek line really does it for me. It’s just so mammoth and skilled and hard to take the puck away from, and it’s a total change of pace from the Giroux-Couturier-Konecny set. Being able to roll out two deadly but very different units like that is just so enticing to me, I feel like it’s harder to gameplan against.

 

[prototypical4thliner]

I’m torn, because I love the balance that presents, but at the same time...

That JVR-Hayes-Voracek line really does it for me. It’s just so mammoth and skilled and hard to take the puck away from, and it’s a total change of pace from the Giroux-Couturier-Konecny set. Being able to roll out two deadly but very different units like that is just so enticing to me, I feel like it’s harder to gameplan against.

See, I see a lot of lindblom in voracek, the way they protect the puck. I’m of the same mindset that having a really heavy line to wear down opposing defenders is going to be beneficial. I think that lindblom can grow into that sort of role, whilst voracek can ride shotgun with Patrick.

 

[TCTC]

Agreed. Jake should be carrying his own line.

He should, but so far he hasn't shown that he can. He couldn't carry a line with Patrick or any other center not named Giroux or Couturier.

 

[Rebels57]

I’m torn, because I love the balance that presents, but at the same time...

That JVR-Hayes-Voracek line really does it for me. It’s just so mammoth and skilled and hard to take the puck away from, and it’s a total change of pace from the Giroux-Couturier-Konecny set. Being able to roll out two deadly but very different units like that is just so enticing to me, I feel like it’s harder to gameplan against.

The most likely scenario is that many of the top 9 wingers will move around on different lines throughout the season.

Giroux - Couturier is a lock

They seem to like the JVR - Hayes tandem so let's call that Lock #2 for now. I don't see any other C-W tandem as a lock.

While i'd prefer TK play all season with G and C, due to slumps and what not, he probably won't. Voracek will see time there. Who knows maybe Farabee does too.

Lindblom will probably spend time with both Hayes and Patrick. Same with Jake.

Voracek, Konecny, Lindblom will all likely play with multiple Centers this year.