GDT: Training Camp 2018-19, Part II

[Chino Oscar]

"Open competition" my ass. Same training camp nonsense every year. I do agree with Borgstrom being demoted, but it's clear that they wanted to simply continue with the same roster that finished on an 8 (?) game winning streak. I get the logic, just don't bother with the pageantry of training camp. Have rookie camp and call it a day.

MacKenzie/Haley/Brouwer rotating in will be hilarious.

Completely incorrect, they gave him every chance to earn his spot... he didn’t. He was never a consideration for the 4th line, not that type of player and better served playing big minutes in the AHL.

 

[Asheville]

Completely incorrect, they gave him every chance to earn his spot... he didn’t. He was never a consideration for the 4th line, not that type of player and better served playing big minutes in the AHL.

I conceded Borgstrom being demoted, but no amount of bottom-6 shuffling could have been done to fit one of Lamm, Greco or Hunt in there over Mac, especially with Haley out and Brouwer showing nothing? And don't give me this "4th line" shit; what an antiquated mentality. You can roll four scoring lines. As a matter of fact, if your "4th line" isn't a threat to score to any degree, your nightly chances are f***ed.

 

[GermanPanther]

I conceded Borgstrom being demoted, but no amount of bottom-6 shuffling could have been done to fit one of Lamm, Greco or Hunt in there over Mac, especially with Haley out and Brouwer showing nothing? And don't give me this "4th line" ****; what an antiquated mentality. You can roll four scoring lines. As a matter of fact, if your "4th line" isn't a threat to score to any degree, your nightly chances are ****ed.

He has a Point there, i heard a tons of time also from our Coach/es and GM we must role all 4th Line, that will allowe to rest also a bit of our Top Players.
And that 4th Line who wasn´t the best or not even 80% last Season is more or less back on the Ice, this Point is questable. For my stand point that was more or less Lamminkos big chance, after his longer developing. Special the working horse Ang, who loves short Stints will make his try also into the Roster earlier or later.

My Point on Vatrano he showed 0% motivation on the Ice, the only thing he did he placed some Checks into the Board and Skate on the Ice. Sorry if this makes you a 2nd or 3rd Line Player, you also could give Hunt a try, that is the same Game Hunt was showing last Year.

One thing i never sayed after all Preseason Games, was Borgstrom defensive play. He was the only Player, who looked around while he stand around the slot and had a Player behind him. The, Sorry @Pumaconcolorcoryi, 2nd Line Player Vatrano, not even did it once during Preseason, only to mention, no Lamminko, Malgin, McCann or Hunt did it. And we get also two Goals against us, about this misplay. Why i mention it, this Problem is an former Season Problem, that Defensman or Winger from the Bench sneaking in behind the Back, cause not a single Player watching around where are my Players, they all still Puck focused, even the Puck is not around them.

 

[vendetta]

Those of you whining about who made the team clearly have no u derstanding how it works. It’s up to one of the younger guys to come on and take a spot from a veteran. You have to play well enough that u give management no choice. Nobody did that. Pure and simple. So u send the young guys down so they aren’t sitting in press box and keep them
Playing. There will be plenty of time
For call ups. If they couldn’t force their way into roster playing preseason games against other ahlers and vets who are going through the motions then that’s their
Own fault.

 

[Howboutthempanthers]

A long, rich history of excellence, I see.

Well Tom Rowe was their coach back then. I was a little puzzled at that time, by their lack of success. I'm not puzzled anymore.

 

[GermanPanther]

Those of you whining about who made the team clearly have no u derstanding how it works. It’s up to one of the younger guys to come on and take a spot from a veteran. You have to play well enough that u give management no choice. Nobody did that. Pure and simple. So u send the young guys down so they aren’t sitting in press box and keep them
Playing. There will be plenty of time
For call ups. If they couldn’t force their way into roster playing preseason games against other ahlers and vets who are going through the motions then that’s their
Own fault.

For me is this nothing then old fashion, old mentality thinking. The old one has nothing to prove, they are veteran with expierence, so they should play aslong as they want and someone comes to take over.
That means nothing like a Player who is how old ever and play the same Level as a young one, the older one must play cause he has the bigger expierence.
Cause the younger one need to show that they are better then the older one before they can replace them. You know, that thought is so old fashion and so wrong in the same Way. cause there is a speech you only getting better, when you play against better opponents who challenge you.

So when you are not able to play against those who are better then you and you never will able to see what you have to do better, you will never reach the level to be better then the Player before you.
In other Words, when you play always AHL Player you never understand and get the expierence what it needs to be an NHL Player. Will those who always play NHL, reach new heights of the expierence cause some of those Veteran with expierence gettign better and challenging you.


That is the conclusion, when you always believe younger once have to bet old once.
Now i give you an different example. Trocheck was never on the 2nd Linem he was called up to play on the 3rd Line and was it not Bjugstad Injurie, he never would be able to show that he is a 2nd-1st Line Center. But he did it and since then anyone wanted to see him on the 2nd Line. But he never fighted for the Spot the gave it to him and he get better from the expierence.

But from your conclusion, Trocheck should never get the 2nd Line Center Postion, cause he doesn´t prove that he is better then the Guy infront of him or an older Player who also could fit into the Role.
But enough from this Point.

And only for you @vendetta i couln´t answer you or read your answer before Thursday evening/night GMT +1 TimeZone. Since im 3 Days out for the Oilers Game i cant answer or read something.

 

[Drugs Delaney]

Those of you whining about who made the team clearly have no u derstanding how it works. It’s up to one of the younger guys to come on and take a spot from a veteran. You have to play well enough that u give management no choice. Nobody did that. Pure and simple. So u send the young guys down so they aren’t sitting in press box and keep them
Playing. There will be plenty of time
For call ups. If they couldn’t force their way into roster playing preseason games against other ahlers and vets who are going through the motions then that’s their
Own fault.

To be fair, the young guys were great at not scoring or being difference makers on the ice just like the plugs they are trying to replace. In my opinion they did a much better job of being unnoticeable on the ice and with that reasoning I’m not sure why they didn’t win jobs.

 

[vendetta]

For me is this nothing then old fashion, old mentality thinking. The old one has nothing to prove, they are veteran with expierence, so they should play aslong as they want and someone comes to take over.
That means nothing like a Player who is how old ever and play the same Level as a young one, the older one must play cause he has the bigger expierence.
Cause the younger one need to show that they are better then the older one before they can replace them. You know, that thought is so old fashion and so wrong in the same Way. cause there is a speech you only getting better, when you play against better opponents who challenge you.

So when you are not able to play against those who are better then you and you never will able to see what you have to do better, you will never reach the level to be better then the Player before you.
In other Words, when you play always AHL Player you never understand and get the expierence what it needs to be an NHL Player. Will those who always play NHL, reach new heights of the expierence cause some of those Veteran with expierence gettign better and challenging you.


That is the conclusion, when you always believe younger once have to bet old once.
Now i give you an different example. Trocheck was never on the 2nd Linem he was called up to play on the 3rd Line and was it not Bjugstad Injurie, he never would be able to show that he is a 2nd-1st Line Center. But he did it and since then anyone wanted to see him on the 2nd Line. But he never fighted for the Spot the gave it to him and he get better from the expierence.

But from your conclusion, Trocheck should never get the 2nd Line Center Postion, cause he doesn´t prove that he is better then the Guy infront of him or an older Player who also could fit into the Role.
But enough from this Point.

And only for you @vendetta i couln´t answer you or read your answer before Thursday evening/night GMT +1 TimeZone. Since im 3 Days out for the Oilers Game i cant answer or read something.

It’s not old thinking. It’s the way it is. With basically every team in the nhl that is expecting to compete. This isn’t a rebuild. They aren’t trying to get the young guys experience. It’s a luxury to be able to send quality prospects down to ahl. The is
The first time in our history we’ve been able to do it. The young guys will get quality experience and develops properly in the ahl.
They will also get called up this year and get plenty of experience in the nhl. Nobody came in and blew the doors off. That’s just the reality. So yes go with the experienced vets cause u know what u will get every night from them. Don’t worry . Mac and Brouwer and Haley wont be playing every night and lammikko and others will certainly get called up. When they do it is up to them to take advantage of the situation and play their way on to a full time
Spot.

 

[letsgrowcactus]

Guys, what are we even arguing about here?
First two lines were set; the third line is filled with young guys. Mamin is still up, presumably on the fourth line. It's his job now to outplay Brouwer and make sure that Brouwer stays in the pressbox. Sceviour has been one of this teams unsung heroes for his PK play and his ability to fill in anywhere in the lineup in a pinch; he was never losing his spot unless he broke a leg or something. So essentially it's just Lammikko over MacKenzie.

We can't have a bad start to the season again. We have a pretty tough schedule playing eight B2B gaems in the first fifteen games including against some pretty good teams like Tampa or the Jets; Hoffman is still learning the system and it looks like the D isn't quite in synch yet. Do you really toss a very inexperienced line of Mamim-Lammikko-Sceviour out there and expect Lammikko to center it when never even had an NHL call-up before? (Funny, just a couple weeks ago we voted him our 25th best prospect and now it's the highest injustice that he's not in the lineup...)

Let him play a bit more and earn the call-up. Besides, it's quite possible that some of our players get hurt during his tough schedule ahead and you'll see the kids sooner than later...

 

[Asheville]

Guys, what are we even arguing about here?
First two lines were set; the third line is filled with young guys. Mamin is still up, presumably on the fourth line. It's his job now to outplay Brouwer and make sure that Brouwer stays in the pressbox. Sceviour has been one of this teams unsung heroes for his PK play and his ability to fill in anywhere in the lineup in a pinch; he was never losing his spot unless he broke a leg or something. So essentially it's just Lammikko over MacKenzie.

We can't have a bad start to the season again. We have a pretty tough schedule playing eight B2Bs in fifteen games including against some pretty good teams like Tampa or the Jets; Hoffman is still learning the system and it looks like the D isn't quite in synch yet. Do you really toss a very inexperienced line of Mamim-Lammikko-Sceviour out there and expect Lammikko to center it when never even had an NHL call-up before? (Funny, just a couple weeks ago we voted him our 25th best prospect and now it's the highest injustice that he's not in the lineup...)

Let him play a bit more and earn the call-up. Besides, it's quite possible that some of our players get hurt during his tough schedule ahead and you'll see the kids sooner than later...

Arguing to keep MacKenzie in the lineup, a player with zero offensive impact who drags down his linemates. I've now heard it all.

So we're punishing the likes of Juho, Greco and Hunt for not going ape in a hand full of preseason games with sparse icetime and rewarding a 37-year-old who has shown over a 309-game sample size that he is very bad at his job simply because a he's the incumbent?

f***ing wow. No wonder this fan base is A-OK with sucking ass.

 

[letsgrowcactus]

Arguing to keep MacKenzie in the lineup, a player with zero offensive impact who drags down his linemates. I've now heard it all.

So we're punishing the likes of Juho, Greco and Hunt for not going ape in a hand full of preseason games with sparse icetime and rewarding a 37-year-old who has shown over a 309-game sample size that he is very bad at his job simply because a he's the incumbent?

****ing wow. No wonder this fan base is A-OK with sucking ass.

Again - they are wingers.
Nobody's being punished. And funny you talk offensive impact when Lammikko had 28 points last year in 59 games in the AHL. That's about 16 expected points in the NHL over the course of a full season using the 0.44 "conversion factor" - which is far from a guarantee. Look at Hunt's point "success" last year. Hell, look at Mamin with his four points in 26 games.
So we can start with Mamin-Lammikko-Sceviour and toss them into the b2b hell. They'll finish a few games with -2 and -3 ratings until Lammikko and Mamin get sent down because we need to shake things up a bit and they're the most expendable. We won't see Lammiko for the rest of the year and we might not see Mamin until about February when he claws his way back up - and if we're especially "lucky", Mamin's replacement will be Haley. Enjoy the Haley-MacKenzie combo for the rest of the season!
Or you can start Mamin-MacKenzie-Sceviour. Let's say they suck just as much while Lammikko is looking great in the AHL - so we call him up! If he's even marginally better than MacKenzie, he gets to stay; if not it doesn't really matter who plays. I know which scenario I prefer.
But hey, it's obvious you didn't read my post past the first paragraph so why do I even bother.

 

[pb1300]

Season is over guys. We dont have a good team. We have an OK offense, and trash on D and in goal. Wrap it up. Close shop and move us to Quebec.

Stanley Cup predictions for 2018-19

What do these idiots know. How dare 15 out of the 18 polled have the Panthers making the playoffs. They should be listening to the real experts here on HFBoards. But then again, a majority even here have the Panthers making the playoffs, some even, dare I say it, think we have one of the best top two lines in the league. OMG, I know, how shocking.

 

[Acadmus]

Season is over guys. We dont have a good team. We have an OK offense, and trash on D and in goal. Wrap it up. Close shop and move us to Quebec.

Stanley Cup predictions for 2018-19

What do these idiots know. How dare 15 out of the 18 polled have the Panthers making the playoffs. They should be listening to the real experts here on HFBoards. But then again, a majority even here have the Panthers making the playoffs, some even, dare I say it, think we have one of the best top two lines in the league. OMG, I know, how shocking.

I'm not even sure how to read your post - at first I thought you were being ironic...maybe you are, but I can't tell.

I love the fact, speaking of "move the Panthers to Quebec", that the director of LNH.com (french version of official NHL page) has the Panthers finishing 3rd in the division and making the playoffs in the 5-6 position. EVERY other prediction I'm seeing puts them in the first wildcard position. But the 5-6 position matches my prediction - they either make the playoffs that high, or they miss them altogether. Last spring was either a fluke and they won't make the big dance, or it wasn't and they'll finish much higher than most predict. There's no real room for in between.

It's also funny how the only three who didn't pick the Panthers for a playoff spot were staff writers...so basically, the people running the media think they'll make it, but the guys actually WRITING articles don't, which is why we're always seeing negative crap about the team

 

[pb1300]

I'm not even sure how to read your post - at first I thought you were being ironic...maybe you are, but I can't tell.

I love the fact, speaking of "move the Panthers to Quebec", that the director of LNH.com (french version of official NHL page) has the Panthers finishing 3rd in the division and making the playoffs in the 5-6 position.

Would you like me to add a somewhere in there???

 

[Acadmus]

Would you like me to add a somewhere in there???

Yes, please - some of us a message board-challenged

On another note...when the roster is finalized, could someone send it to me in a pm? There's bound to be enough commentary on it that I'll miss it completely.

Also, did I imagine it or are the Panthers going to be playing a couple games in Europe AFTER the season has started already? Late October/early November or something? I'm hoping I was delusional and it's not happening, as it's insane to jetlag players in the midst of a season that's already started.

 

[Gordonx11]

Borg, Hunt, Greco, Juho, etc.. have shown absolutely nothing at an NHL, hell even NHL preseason level, to show that they are better options than guys like Vatrano, Mack, and Scevior. That's the bottom line, and if you disagree please point me to some evidence to prove me wrong otherwise. Don't send me a college highlight video, that's not the NHL level. Borg? Did he show anything in his stint last season that showed he was ready? The answer is no. He needs AHL seasoning.

People like to value young players, not because of what they've shown, but what they have the potential to show. We like to draw and paint imaginary pictures in our heads of things that MIGHT happen, but in reality don't happen most of the time. Not every young man under 23 is Barkov or Trocheck. Yes, I know its fun to fantasize and imaginize. But please don't try to sell those fantasies as facts and ridicule anybody who dares disagree with your perfect painting.

 

[pb1300]

Yes, please - some of us a message board-challenged

On another note...when the roster is finalized, could someone send it to me in a pm? There's bound to be enough commentary on it that I'll miss it completely.

Also, did I imagine it or are the Panthers going to be playing a couple games in Europe AFTER the season has started already? Late October/early November or something? I'm hoping I was delusional and it's not happening, as it's insane to jetlag players in the midst of a season that's already started.

Yup, they are playing two games in Finland against the Jets. Wanted to go, since the flight is only about 3 hours from here, but the tickets went fast.

Florida Panthers 2018 Roster

Here is the team pretty much, without Borgstrom and McCoshen (both sent to the A). Haley and Bogs are on IR.

 

[pb1300]

Hmmm...

 

[pb1300]

Yeah, lets just keep them just for the sake of it. This is what we did in the past to ruin our prospects, play them when they werent ready.

 

[GrumpyKelly]

Yeah, lets just keep them just for the sake of it. This is what we did in the past to ruin our prospects, play them when they werent ready.

Though in the past the young guys simple were better than guys on the team. That's why they made the roster.

But now, it's so easy to send a guy down if he's not lighting it up. Borg isn't a game changer at this point, just let him develop in the ahl even if it's the whole year. Getting stronger is a lot easier to fix than lack of skill.

 

[CHGoalie27]

Guys, what are we even arguing about here?
First two lines were set; the third line is filled with young guys. Mamin is still up, presumably on the fourth line. It's his job now to outplay Brouwer and make sure that Brouwer stays in the pressbox. Sceviour has been one of this teams unsung heroes for his PK play and his ability to fill in anywhere in the lineup in a pinch; he was never losing his spot unless he broke a leg or something. So essentially it's just Lammikko over MacKenzie.

We can't have a bad start to the season again. We have a pretty tough schedule playing eight B2B gaems in the first fifteen games including against some pretty good teams like Tampa or the Jets; Hoffman is still learning the system and it looks like the D isn't quite in synch yet. Do you really toss a very inexperienced line of Mamim-Lammikko-Sceviour out there and expect Lammikko to center it when never even had an NHL call-up before? (Funny, just a couple weeks ago we voted him our 25th best prospect and now it's the highest injustice that he's not in the lineup...)

Let him play a bit more and earn the call-up. Besides, it's quite possible that some of our players get hurt during his tough schedule ahead and you'll see the kids sooner than later...

Again - they are wingers.
Nobody's being punished. And funny you talk offensive impact when Lammikko had 28 points last year in 59 games in the AHL. That's about 16 expected points in the NHL over the course of a full season using the 0.44 "conversion factor" - which is far from a guarantee. Look at Hunt's point "success" last year. Hell, look at Mamin with his four points in 26 games.
So we can start with Mamin-Lammikko-Sceviour and toss them into the b2b hell. They'll finish a few games with -2 and -3 ratings until Lammikko and Mamin get sent down because we need to shake things up a bit and they're the most expendable. We won't see Lammiko for the rest of the year and we might not see Mamin until about February when he claws his way back up - and if we're especially "lucky", Mamin's replacement will be Haley. Enjoy the Haley-MacKenzie combo for the rest of the season!
Or you can start Mamin-MacKenzie-Sceviour. Let's say they suck just as much while Lammikko is looking great in the AHL - so we call him up! If he's even marginally better than MacKenzie, he gets to stay; if not it doesn't really matter who plays. I know which scenario I prefer.
But hey, it's obvious you didn't read my post past the first paragraph so why do I even bother.

Bump. Thats just the way it is.

 

[pb1300]

Though in the past the young guys simple were better than guys on the team. That's why they made the roster.

But now, it's so easy to send a guy down if he's not lighting it up. Borg isn't a game changer at this point, just let him develop in the ahl even if it's the whole year. Getting stronger is a lot easier to fix than lack of skill.

Exactly. Im not going to rush a prospect just because he is projected to be a better player than who we have now. Maybe if we were in a rebuild, you would see Borgstrom in the top six, but given the depth of the top six, and the experience in the bottom six, not to mention how he himself knows he needs to get stronger, the best bet for all parties is to start him off in the A.

 

[CHGoalie27]

As for Vatrano, every time I catch myself saying "what the f*** is he even doing out there?" He goes and scores a goal.

Really, like every time.

 

[Gentle Man]

Sorry @Pumaconcolorcoryi, 2nd Line Player Vatrano

Whats wrong with that?

Trocheck doesnt utilize his wingers well because he needs the puck so much

Huberdeau and Hoffman need to be able to get their share of puck possession and that is not happening with Trocheck.

 

[CHGoalie27]

Would you like me to add a somewhere in there???

And your fantasy football team sucks