Trading the Hossa Contract

hawksfan50

Registered User
Feb 27, 2002
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The issue I brought up was the value of trading the Hossa contract both to us getting rid of the cap hit AND to a floor team trying to meet that escalating floor as cheap as possible.. So normally to get rid of a burden cap hit the team trading such contract has to pay a high price in picks..Thus some hockey pundits have written Hawks need to give up the #8 to get a team to take the contract off our books...BUT the contract is so inexpensive in actual Cash layout for the receiving team that it is THRY who should pay a steep price in a pick or picks to get such a"bargain" cost way of getting to the floor .

Unfortunately. ..not a lot of floor teams ..Arizona always the #1 candidate ..

So ridiculous for us to give Amy first rounder to get this done..it should be the floor team getting a whopping batman to help then hit the floor that needs to pay a price in futures.

So I think it could be as high as a 2nd rounder or maybe a 3rd and 5th or 2 4th rounders in consecutive drafts...sometime in these ranges...No 1st round ders should be involved for either side ..bit I think the value t o the floor team in cheap cost for sure check cap compliance help to get to a floor makes Chicago get more back in pick or picks than anything Chicago throws in if any.
 

ChiHawks10

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Jul 7, 2009
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Arizona is reported to be looking to get to the cap floor....we all know where the Hossa deal is going.

I wonder what the Hawks do if they move Hossa's contract? There's a lot of money available to play with at that point. Like 17m kind of money. Do you go after Tavares? Or just tackle all the holes by signing the lesser FAs?

I think I'd lean towards the lesser FAs, and being able to sign multiple of them to fill multiple holes at once... but Tavares would look good in the Indianhead. I'm still super hesitant on giving older guys long term, high AAV deals, though. It's a dilemma that I wouldn't know what to do with, and I'm glad I'm not the GM.
 

ClydeLee

Registered User
Mar 23, 2012
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I wonder what the Hawks do if they move Hossa's contract? There's a lot of money available to play with at that point. Like 17m kind of money. Do you go after Tavares? Or just tackle all the holes by signing the lesser FAs?

I think I'd lean towards the lesser FAs, and being able to sign multiple of them to fill multiple holes at once... but Tavares would look good in the Indianhead. I'm still super hesitant on giving older guys long term, high AAV deals, though. It's a dilemma that I wouldn't know what to do with, and I'm glad I'm not the GM.
 

bwana63

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Jul 11, 2014
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In what bizzaro world are we giving up assets to move Hossa's contract? Joke.

Should be able to glean some picks, hopefully a 2nd rounder plus. The contract will provide a strapped team with ~$12.7M in relief over 3 years.
 

Kevin Musto

Hard for Bedard
Feb 16, 2018
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I wonder if all it would take for Arizona to eat the Hossa contract would be giving them Duclair back
 

u2wojo

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Dec 22, 2011
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In what bizzaro world are we giving up assets to move Hossa's contract? Joke.

Should be able to glean some picks, hopefully a 2nd rounder plus. The contract will provide a strapped team with ~$12.7M in relief over 3 years.

Bettman says expectation of cap is between $79.5 and $80M which means a cap floor of 58.75-59.12.

Capfriendly shows the Yotes at 56.96 in salary for 17 players. If they fill out a roster with only league minimum/rookie contracts, they are easily above the cap floor. If you look at Carolina, they are just under 48, but will easily pay Hanifin, Lindholm, TVR, and however they fix their goaltending enough to be well over the floor. Vegas will have zero problem as they have guys they need to pay to keep and after success will not be a destination UFA's won't go to. Unless the Islanders miss on Tavares and somehow decide to go full on tank (which is highly doubtful on both accounts with Lou hired to make a splash) or Ottawa completely blow it up (which I guess is possible....but let's see how things unfold with Karlsson over the next 2 days before I buy that as being a possibility), the only team that MIGHT have an issue with the cap floor is Colorado (but even that is BARELY). They are not exactly a small market budget team though, and plopping down 6 million per for Statsny solves that in one move.

There are no teams that will struggle to reach the cap floor this coming season....that is a myth. No budget team is paying Hossa 3 million for cap that they don't need out of the goodness of their heart to help the Hawks much less giving up an asset to do it.
 

bwana63

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Jul 11, 2014
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Bettman says expectation of cap is between $79.5 and $80M which means a cap floor of 58.75-59.12.

Capfriendly shows the Yotes at 56.96 in salary for 17 players. If they fill out a roster with only league minimum/rookie contracts, they are easily above the cap floor. If you look at Carolina, they are just under 48, but will easily pay Hanifin, Lindholm, TVR, and however they fix their goaltending enough to be well over the floor. Vegas will have zero problem as they have guys they need to pay to keep and after success will not be a destination UFA's won't go to. Unless the Islanders miss on Tavares and somehow decide to go full on tank (which is highly doubtful on both accounts with Lou hired to make a splash) or Ottawa completely blow it up (which I guess is possible....but let's see how things unfold with Karlsson over the next 2 days before I buy that as being a possibility), the only team that MIGHT have an issue with the cap floor is Colorado (but even that is BARELY). They are not exactly a small market budget team though, and plopping down 6 million per for Statsny solves that in one move.

There are no teams that will struggle to reach the cap floor this coming season....that is a myth. No budget team is paying Hossa 3 million for cap that they don't need out of the goodness of their heart to help the Hawks much less giving up an asset to do it.

I stand corrected. Very good analysis, thanks.
 

u2wojo

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Dec 22, 2011
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That said, I think Hossa's deal is moveable without having to attach a premium asset (like Teravainen with Bickell's deal). You need to find a team that is unlikely to sniff the top end of the cap for the 3 years of Hossa's deal that remains and then put together some combo of a non budget in a rebuild team willing to just buy a pick or prospect or a budget team that has a contract they don't want to pay any more (player has declined or become redundant by someone else evolving on their roster).

Arizona might be a little bit of both types of teams. Acquiring Kruger made no sense (other then maybe to surround OEL with another Swede to get him to sign an extension) as he has declined badly, is over paid (even with Carolina retaining and the Hawks paying the front end of his frontloaded deal), and they have pretty good center depth (not necessarily great quality....but quantity). If newly acquired Galy is going to be a center there, Kruger makes even less sense. Instead of paying Kruger the 2 million they will owe him this year, maybe you can convince them to pay Hossa his 1 million a year and get a 3rd round pick (or a prospect they like where we are not as much in love with)?

Maybe Buffalo flips Moulson who was in the AHL most of the year and is probably done being a useful NHL'er for Hossa straight up? Buried in the AHL, Moulson is 3.975 against the cap or 1.3 less then Hossa. No LTIR wiggle room though, but you are done for good after this season as it is the last year of Moulson's deal. Moulson is only owed 3 million in real dollars so he is a wash against what is owed Hossa. However, Pegula is deep pocketed and maybe you convince him to buy a 3rd rounder for a million by retaining on Moulson. Still not ideal, but more cap room this year, no carryover bonus overages (that LTIR does not absorb), and full cap next year. Beaulieu has a 2,4 cap hit and is owed 2.5 in real money. He was a bust of a trade, will not have a role with Dahlin pushing every LD down a notch, and I can not imagine is moveable for any asset. Middle round pick and prospect with Hossa might be enough. Waive him and hope he gets claimed, or bury him in the AHL to lose half his cap and have depth for injury

If Ottawa moves Karlsson (presumably for futures and cheaper short term NHL'er(s), they are probably in full on rebuild with Duchene moving by the deadline at the latest and certainly not resigning. They would have little to no chance of sniffing the top of the cap in the next 3 years. Zach Smith is the wrong side of 30 to hang onto in a rebuild, his 19 points in 68 games last year doesn't scream great value with 3 years @ 3.25 still owed to him. There may be a point where retaining 750K on Smith and paying Hossa 3 million makes more sense then paying Smith 9.75. Smith at 2.5 for the Hawks as a 4th line center wouldn't be horrible with 2.75 more in cap space the next 3 years too.

Carolina with something around a salary retained Darling for Hossa as part of a bigger trade (I would not do this accept in something bigger where we get something we want for a little less then we are willing to pay otherwise).

Unless the Rangers go nuts in free agency, they seem to be headed toward a rebuild so top end of the cap shouldn't matter if they are smart. Belesekey is owed 1.9 per for the next 2 years in cap (and 3.5 in total salary), He is a total bust and probably not even an NHL player at this point, but flip Hossa for him, bury him in the AHL and you free up 4.5 per year the next 2 and Hossa fully gone in his 3rd year. Brendan Smith with retention by NY for Hossa in part of something bigger where we get something we want might make sense. They have 3 first rounders, 2 2nds, and Kreider would look filthy on the Hawks if you could build something that makes sense for both. Maybe something like Kreider, Smith 1.35 retained (net 3 per for 3 years to us) and a 2nd for Anisimov, Hossa, Forsling and one of our 3rds. I think Kreider is worth every bit of Anisimov and Forsling straight up (and probably more) upgrade a 3rd into the second and flip Hossa's 16 million in cap hit into Smith's 9 and let NY turn the 13 million they still owe Smith into 7 (1.35 retained plus Hossa's a million per year) while adding a center and LHD they both seem to need organizationally.

The possible landing spots for Hossa are pretty limited. not many teams that cam eat 5.25 in cap space for 3 full season. If it were only a season or two, the option become wider.
 
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bwana63

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Jul 11, 2014
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That said, I think Hossa's deal is moveable without having to attach a premium asset (like Teravainen with Bickell's deal). You need to find a team that is unlikely to sniff the top end of the cap for the 3 years of Hossa's deal that remains and then put together some combo of a non budget in a rebuild team willing to just buy a pick or prospect or a budget team that has a contract they don't want to pay any more (player has declined or become redundant by someone else evolving on their roster).

Arizona might be a little bit of both types of teams. Acquiring Kruger made no sense (other then maybe to surround OEL with another Swede to get him to sign an extension) as he has declined badly, is over paid (even with Carolina retaining and the Hawks paying the front end of his frontloaded deal), and they have pretty good center depth (not necessarily great quality....but quantity). If newly acquired Galy is going to be a center there, Kruger makes even less sense. Instead of paying Kruger the 2 million they will owe him this year, maybe you can convince them to pay Hossa his 1 million a year and get a 3rd round pick (or a prospect they like where we are not as much in love with)?

Maybe Buffalo flips Moulson who was in the AHL most of the year and is probably done being a useful NHL'er for Hossa straight up? Buried in the AHL, Moulson is 3.975 against the cap or 1.3 less then Hossa. No LTIR wiggle room though, but you are done for good after this season as it is the last year of Moulson's deal. Moulson is only owed 3 million in real dollars so he is a wash against what is owed Hossa. However, Pegula is deep pocketed and maybe you convince him to buy a 3rd rounder for a million by retaining on Moulson. Still not ideal, but more cap room this year, no carryover bonus overages (that LTIR does not absorb), and full cap next year. Beaulieu has a 2,4 cap hit and is owed 2.5 in real money. He was a bust of a trade, will not have a role with Dahlin pushing every LD down a notch, and I can not imagine is moveable for any asset. Middle round pick and prospect with Hossa might be enough. Waive him and hope he gets claimed, or bury him in the AHL to lose half his cap and have depth for injury

If Ottawa moves Karlsson (presumably for futures and cheaper short term NHL'er(s), they are probably in full on rebuild with Duchene moving by the deadline at the latest and certainly not resigning. They would have little to no chance of sniffing the top of the cap in the next 3 years. Zach Smith is the wrong side of 30 to hang onto in a rebuild, his 19 points in 68 games last year doesn't scream great value with 3 years @ 3.25 still owed to him. There may be a point where retaining 750K on Smith and paying Hossa 3 million makes more sense then paying Smith 9.75. Smith at 2.5 for the Hawks as a 4th line center wouldn't be horrible with 2.75 more in cap space the next 3 years too.

Carolina with something around a salary retained Darling for Hossa as part of a bigger trade (I would not do this accept in something bigger where we get something we want for a little less then we are willing to pay otherwise).

Unless the Rangers go nuts in free agency, they seem to be headed toward a rebuild so top end of the cap shouldn't matter if they are smart. Belesekey is owed 1.9 per for the next 2 years in cap (and 3.5 in total salary), He is a total bust and probably not even an NHL player at this point, but flip Hossa for him, bury him in the AHL and you free up 4.5 per year the next 2 and Hossa fully gone in his 3rd year. Brendan Smith with retention by NY for Hossa in part of something bigger where we get something we want might make sense. They have 3 first rounders, 2 2nds, and Kreider would look filthy on the Hawks if you could build something that makes sense for both. Maybe something like Kreider, Smith 1.35 retained (net 3 per for 3 years to us) and a 2nd for Anisimov, Hossa, Forsling and one of our 3rds. I think Kreider is worth every bit of Anisimov and Forsling straight up (and probably more) upgrade a 3rd into the second and flip Hossa's 16 million in cap hit into Smith's 9 and let NY turn the 13 million they still owe Smith into 7 (1.35 retained plus Hossa's a million per year) while adding a center and LHD they both seem to need organizationally.

The possible landing spots for Hossa are pretty limited. not many teams that cam eat 5.25 in cap space for 3 full season. If it were only a season or two, the option become wider.

Great post, man!
 

JaegerDice

The mark of my dignity shall scar thy DNA
Dec 26, 2014
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No, teams doing other teams a cap favor do not throw in assets for the 'privilege' of doing so, lol.

The Blackhawks will be adding something to move Hossa's contract, if they do. It probably won't be something huge, more like a 3rd or 4th round pick or something, but they'll be the ones adding something in a package, not the team receiving Hossa.

Yep.
 

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