Proposal: Trade Proposal Thread Part 51

[Galaxydoggystyle]

Exactly. Our GM is not rebuilding. He had a golden opportunity in February to leverage Tatar, Petry, Drouin, or Domi for a 1st-round pick, but held onto them like security blankets. Like it or not, Bergevin is going to try building on what we have. A D like Larsson might do very well here, just like Petry when he came over from the black hole in Edmonton. No, OEL isn't enough, but he'd fill one of our biggest weaknesses.

Agreed number 1Dman like OEL are very hard to get compared to wingers. Some teams are still looking for a number 1D man. Wingers are much easier to come by. Look at the leafs they have been looking for another top 4 dman for a long time now. Not a number 1dman a freaking top 4dman and they can't find any team trading one unless something changes this off season. I say if we have a chance to get OEL we do it because weber aint getting any younger and once he leaves we will be without a number 1 if we don't get OEL.

 

[L4br3cqu3]

Excuse you.

Wonder if it's in a literal sense, I know I haven't seen them play together as I was born in '80. Maybe he's as 'young' as I am.

Otherwise, yeah, those guys are the cream of the crop.

 

[CristianoRonaldo]

Who has more value?

Caufield or Norlinder?

Caufield, because he's a recent top-15 pick who had a really good first season in a bad team. Norlinder's value is difficult to establish, but I'm 100% it's not a 1st round pick, maybe not even a 2nd round pick.

The short answer is Caufield.

 

[sheed36]

Exactly. Our GM is not rebuilding. He had a golden opportunity in February to leverage Tatar, Petry, Drouin, or Domi for a 1st-round pick, but held onto them like security blankets. Like it or not, Bergevin is going to try building on what we have. A D like Larsson might do very well here, just like Petry when he came over from the black hole in Edmonton. No, OEL isn't enough, but he'd fill one of our biggest weaknesses.

MB also said in his year end presser that the Habs don't have as much cap space as people seem to think since he's looking forward 2 or 3 years from now. Trading for OEL and his 8.25m x 7 could have a major effect on what happens with his UFA's after next season and the upcoming deals for Suzuki and KK.

I just don't see MB taking on that long term 8.25m OEL cap hit after hearing him say that plus the cost it would likely take to acquire him. Also I think if MB do add a big salary it will be for a scoring winger instead of a dman.

 

[The Great Weal]

OEL is a fantastic dman. Arizona is garbage. Clayton Keller cant even crack 50 points(besides rookie year)on that awful team. Contract is worrisome, but I don't think it will be an issue for another 5 years.

 

[Galaxydoggystyle]

MB also said in his year end presser that the Habs don't have as much cap space as people seem to think since he's looking forward 2 or 3 years from now. Trading for OEL and his 8.25m x 7 could have a major effect on what happens with his UFA's after next season and the upcoming deals for Suzuki and KK.

I just don't see MB taking on that long term 8.25m OEL cap hit after hearing him say that plus the cost it would likely take to acquire him. Also I think if MB do add a big salary it will be for a scoring winger instead of a dman.

You do know Danault is basically a lock for 6m+ right? rather spend an extra 2m on OEL then give Danault that money. Also Alzner is a player that will most likely be bought out or shipped to a team looking for picks and can take in salary *gasps* well look at that looks like the Yotes have no pick until the 4th round and are missing 1st and a 2nd next draft also. Guess who has 14 picks this draft and another 10 next draft? I get what you are saying its big money but OEL is exactly what we need on the back end which would fix multiple things on this team and the biggest one is our dreadful power play.

Tatar/Drouin - Suzuki - Gallagher
OEL - Weber

That looks like a sweet combination for our power play. We have a high IQ Center a player that bangs around in the front of the net a sniper and on the back end we got a PMD and a bomb from the point. It fixes the problem of being predictable with just passing it to Weber for a one timer and players putting sticks in front of the shot.

 

[Kriss E]

I don't think the Blues would part with Dunn either but if the Blues want to keep AP they will need to move out some salary somewhere to get him re-signed so guys like Allen and Bozak look like the logical players to go. Steen as a NTC so he probably won't move. Last season the Leafs had to attach a 1st to Marleau to get him off their cap so it's also gonna cost the Blues something to move either a Allen or Bozak.

This is a very good opportunity for MB to exploit the Blues (or any team needing to clear cap) to get a very nice asset attached for taking on say Allen like he did in the Armia trade with the Jets. Allen could then be the backup to Price next season while Primeau gets the year in Laval.

Even though I highly doubt it happens hopefully the Blues really want AP back and become desperate enough to attach someone like Dunn to Allen for say their 2nd back + a B level prospect or something like that. If they won't move Dunn to help clear cap space threaten them with sending Dunn an OS up to the 2nd round pick threshold which would make it even harder for them to retain AP if they matched.

With some very valuable available cap space MB needs to be a shark and target these teams who need to clear cap and get something very good out of it. MB is in the drivers seat with some valuable cap space at his disposal this off season and he needs to take advantage of it like he did to get Armia.

There is an opportunity but it depends what the direction is. That's why having a plan is a must, which is concerning considering who's our GM.
I feel a pick is more likely to be the cost of moving salary for the Blues, giving up Dunn is big.

 

[MtlSars]

Ill admit if we can pry away Dunn with a RFA offer or very little so they can sign AP sure its a good move.

But people are saying this or Domi vs Brodin all summer.

And OEL is easily a better D than the 2 of them.

We have the cap room , we have the assets (especially since Arizona have been punished by the NHL and have no 1st draft round pick and very few picks for the next 2 years)

It would be a homerun move.

With a 2020 2021 defense of :
OEL Weber
Romanov Petry
Chiarot (Fleury Juulsen Mete whoever really)

Thats solid and then we trade one of Weber or Petry eventually to make room on D for our propsects.

We can still sign UFAs .

We can still improve on domi tatar drouin gally for our top 4 wingers.

OEL in MTL please

 

[Montreal Impact FC]

Yeah, Radulov is right up there with his biggest misses. And the worst part is that it wasn't that Bergevin simply guessed wrong, which would be forgivable. There was no guessing -- Radulov was a beast all year, including the playoff series against NYR. He was the most exciting player we had in years, probably since Kovalev. It defied all logic to let this guy slip through your fingers.

and on top of that he Bergevin had the audacity of pulling his "you Want a loyalty buy a dog" legendary quote..

that's gonna follow him his whole career.

 

[Kriss E]

Exactly. Our GM is not rebuilding. He had a golden opportunity in February to leverage Tatar, Petry, Drouin, or Domi for a 1st-round pick, but held onto them like security blankets. Like it or not, Bergevin is going to try building on what we have. A D like Larsson might do very well here, just like Petry when he came over from the black hole in Edmonton. No, OEL isn't enough, but he'd fill one of our biggest weaknesses.

Who knows what this bozo is doing...
He's probably going with status quo or close to it..

 

[Hins77]

Yeah, Radulov is right up there with his biggest misses. And the worst part is that it wasn't that Bergevin simply guessed wrong, which would be forgivable. There was no guessing -- Radulov was a beast all year, including the playoff series against NYR. He was the most exciting player we had in years, probably since Kovalev. It defied all logic to let this guy slip through your fingers.

Exactly. And knowing that bergevin like picks. He could sign him and trade him for a second picks if he wants because he has value today lol. Thats awful like management. I rather like to pay 8 millions to a guy like radulov rhan sign byron/alzner/armia at 10 millions together.

 

[sheed36]

There is an opportunity but it depends what the direction is. That's why having a plan is a must, which is concerning considering who's our GM.
I feel a pick is more likely to be the cost of moving salary for the Blues, giving up Dunn is big.

You're probably correct and that's why I said it's highly unlikely the Blues would include him in any cap clearing deal but I'd certainly be trying. Especially if AP isn't re-signed the closer it gets to when UFA's can sign and the Blues getting wind of a team making a huge offer to AP.

I'm just no sold on moving the futures that Arizona would likely need to move OEL and adding his long term contract and I haven't seen an argument for doing so in this thread that even remotely comes close to changing my mind on it.

Not often I agree with MB but him saying the Habs don't have as much cap as people think and that he's looking 2-3 years ahead and not only for next season when it comes to cap space I'll be very surprised if he traded what was needed for OEL while also taking on that huge contract but we'll see.

 

[Sorinth]

MB also said in his year end presser that the Habs don't have as much cap space as people seem to think since he's looking forward 2 or 3 years from now. Trading for OEL and his 8.25m x 7 could have a major effect on what happens with his UFA's after next season and the upcoming deals for Suzuki and KK.

I just don't see MB taking on that long term 8.25m OEL cap hit after hearing him say that plus the cost it would likely take to acquire him. Also I think if MB do add a big salary it will be for a scoring winger instead of a dman.

MB is also an idiot, we have a ton of cap space even when looking 2-3 years down the road. This offseason alone we are freeing up over 6m from letting go Weise and the buyouts/retained salary expiring. And there is plenty of "fat" that can be cut like Alzner's 4.6m, Byron's 3.4, Drouin at 5.5, even Weal at 1.4m is costing us half a million over a replacement player who is more then likely to be as good better.

And that doesn't even take into account the expansion draft where we will likely lose salary (Especially if we are willing to give up a prospect/pick to take an overpaid player), or the fact that to acquire someone like OEL we will be sending back salary, or that we might not even want to re-sign some of the upcomings UFAs since for the most part they are on the wrong side of 30.

But you're right that I can't see MB making a trade for OEL.

 

[sheed36]

MB is also an idiot, we have a ton of cap space even when looking 2-3 years down the road. This offseason alone we are freeing up over 6m from letting go Weise and the buyouts/retained salary expiring. And there is plenty of "fat" that can be cut like Alzner's 4.6m, Byron's 3.4, Drouin at 5.5, even Weal at 1.4m is costing us half a million over a replacement player who is more then likely to be as good better.

And that doesn't even take into account the expansion draft where we will likely lose salary (Especially if we are willing to give up a prospect/pick to take an overpaid player), or the fact that to acquire someone like OEL we will be sending back salary, or that we might not even want to re-sign some of the upcomings UFAs since for the most part they are on the wrong side of 30.

But you're right that I can't see MB making a trade for OEL.

I think all the UFA's coming up after next season is what MB is likely looking at and the future contracts for guys like KK and Suzuki when he was talking about his available cap during his year end presser.

We can all debate until the cows come home which of the upcoming UFA's should or shouldn't be re-signed but I think this is playing a part in any spending MB will do during this off season. IMO if he does spend it will be for a scoring winger but I'm expecting him to start next season with a bunch of available cap space again but who knows.

 

[mariolemieux66]

A big no no to OEL. 29 years old dmen signed at 8.25mil for 8 years bringing 40 points a seasons is not worth it.

 

[Gaylord Q Tinkledink]

A big no no to OEL. 29 years old dmen signed at 8.25mil for 8 years bringing 40 points a seasons is not worth it.

There's more to hockey than points.

Montreal scored 18 more goals than Arizona this season..

In the past 4 seasons Montreal has scored almost 100 more goals, which is potentially 300 more points for players. OEL averaging 10 more points over the course of those 4 seasons isn't a stretch. Now you're looking at a 50 point dman who brings more than offense to the game.

 

[mariolemieux66]

There's more to hockey than points.

Montreal scored 18 more goals than Arizona this season..

In the past 4 seasons Montreal has scored almost 100 more goals, which is potentially 300 more points for players. OEL averaging 10 more points over the course of those 4 seasons isn't a stretch. Now you're looking at a 50 point dman who brings more than offense to the game.

So in a few seasons we will have Price, Weber and OEL, in their 30's, taking 30mil in Cap Space with several years on their contracts.
Why don't we just sell Tatar, Petry, Price, Domi, Drouin and Byron for prospects and 1st round picks instead?
We aren't winning the cup by adding OEL.

 

[Sorinth]

I think all the UFA's coming up after next season is what MB is likely looking at and the future contracts for guys like KK and Suzuki when he was talking about his available cap during his year end presser.

We can all debate until the cows come home which of the upcoming UFA's should or shouldn't be re-signed but I think this is playing a part in any spending MB will do during this off season. IMO if he does spend it will be for a scoring winger but I'm expecting him to start next season with a bunch of available cap space again but who knows.

I'm aware he's talking about 2-3 years but it's simply isn't true that we would be in cap trouble then even if we wanted to re-sign all the UFAs and give raises because there simply isn't enough roster spots to do that.

For example we aren't going to get OEL but also keep Petry, Chiarot and Kulak. There isn't enough roster spots for OEL, Weber, Petry, Chiarot, Kulak, Mete, Romanov, Fleury. So if we do trade for OEL and re-sign Petry we are pretty much guaranteed to move either Chiarot or Kulak which saves you 2-3m.

It's the same at forward, we aren't going to be paying all of Danault, Suzuki, Kotkanimi, Domi 6m+ because there isn't room for them all to play center, and if we move couple to wing then there isn't room for Drouin, Tatar, Gallagher, Armia. And we already have the bottom-6 covered with guys like Byron, Lehkonen, and most people expect Caufield to be pushing for a spot 2-3 years from now.

But it's pretty obvious that MB doesn't actually understand that roster spots are limited which is why he's always signing tons of bottom line players which barely even play for us because there simply isn't room for them.

 

[Runner77]

There is an opportunity but it depends what the direction is. That's why having a plan is a must, which is concerning considering who's our GM.
I feel a pick is more likely to be the cost of moving salary for the Blues, giving up Dunn is big.

How many posts are we going to have to make about the lack of plan and direction? The same people continue to be in charge, why would there now be a plan? Do you know of any plan that has been created and ahered to in the last 8 years, other than contradictory cliches? It's just the way it is and it's the type of management we can't do anything about, no matter how many posts we keep making about "it depends what the plan is."

 

[Kriss E]

You're probably correct and that's why I said it's highly unlikely the Blues would include him in any cap clearing deal but I'd certainly be trying. Especially if AP isn't re-signed the closer it gets to when UFA's can sign and the Blues getting wind of a team making a huge offer to AP.

I'm just no sold on moving the futures that Arizona would likely need to move OEL and adding his long term contract and I haven't seen an argument for doing so in this thread that even remotely comes close to changing my mind on it.

Not often I agree with MB but him saying the Habs don't have as much cap as people think and that he's looking 2-3 years ahead and not only for next season when it comes to cap space I'll be very surprised if he traded what was needed for OEL while also taking on that huge contract but we'll see.

Well that depends. Getting closer to free agency also might mean the chances of AP walking out are bigger, so they might want to hold on to Dunn even more.
I don't think Arizona wants to move OEL anyways, and I agree, I wouldn't want to give up the pieces it would likely cost, ie Romanov-Suzuki-KK.

However, Bergevin is a moron. We have plenty of cap space, we've had some for a long time now. We're one of the best position teams when it comes to that. What is scary with his comments is it sounds like he's just going to re-sign everyone...as if our team is actually good.

 

[Galaxydoggystyle]

So in a few seasons we will have Price, Weber and OEL, in their 30's, taking 30mil in Cap Space with several years on their contracts.
Why don't we just sell Tatar, Petry, Price, Domi, Drouin and Byron for prospects and 1st round picks instead?
We aren't winning the cup by adding OEL.

Price is a negative value full stop no team is taking him that contract is the worst in the NHL. Drouin has done absolutely nothing since getting here again worth nothing. Tatar Petry and Gallagher was best moved this past dead line which again was not done. You keep preaching trying to rebuild when we have all been saying that for years now but we have MARC BERGEVIN as our GM the guy that will NOT do a full rebuild. It is either retool or do nothing. I rather have an exciting team to watch at least then be shit year after year not getting a top 5 pick.

 

[Kriss E]

So in a few seasons we will have Price, Weber and OEL, in their 30's, taking 30mil in Cap Space with several years on their contracts.
Why don't we just sell Tatar, Petry, Price, Domi, Drouin and Byron for prospects and 1st round picks instead?
We aren't winning the cup by adding OEL.

I'd really pursue Colorado to see what they would give up for Price.

 

[Galaxydoggystyle]

I'd really pursue Colorado to see what they would give up for Price.

They don't want Price no one wants Price. If MB is able to unload Price's contract without any significant retention he will be a god among gods in the GM world. 10.5m cap hit is super star Austin Matthews money. Price is a goalie that gets a bit more hotter a little more often then others thats it hes not worth 10.5m hes worth at most 8m and that is being generous.

 

[Kriss E]

They don't want Price no one wants Price. If MB is able to unload Price's contract without any significant retention he will be a god among gods in the GM world. 10.5m cap hit is super star Austin Matthews money. Price is a goalie that gets a bit more hotter a little more often then others thats it hes not worth 10.5m hes worth at most 8m and that is being generous.

What? No one wants Price?
Ya, he's overpaid, a shit load of players are overpaid in the NHL, even high end ones, that's not an argument.

 

[Galaxydoggystyle]

What? No one wants Price?
Ya, he's overpaid, a shit load of players are overpaid in the NHL, even high end ones, that's not an argument.

Sorry I should have said no one wants Price at that cap hit. Yes other players are over paid but not at goal and not by as much as 2.5 - 3.5m per season for the next what is it? 7 years?