GDT: Trade deadline 2021

[AZ Caps Fan]

Disgusted with the Vrana trade.

It is a lot to give up and that stings but Mantha is a nice addition.

 

[AZ Caps Fan]

I disagree with your assessment but I’ll defend to the death your right to post it!

I was sure you would rip me a new one. Hmm.

 

[EYEuhFRAYtee]

Hey guys we got Michael Raffl!

 

[Melkor]

Also this damn site is really annoying. Every damn deadline you come here to discuss stuff it just falls dead..One would think the problem would have been solved after so many years.

 

[AZ Caps Fan]

Also this damn site is really annoying. Every damn deadline you come here to discuss stuff it just falls dead..One would think the problem would have been solved after so many years.

There's always D&D. Or mordar, or wherever you're from.

 

[Hivemind]

Raffl is a warm body addition, and the trade made very little sense to me until I saw the subsequent Mantha trade. Raffl is basically filling the spot vacated by Panik, and he has occasionally played center so perhaps they expect him to provide depth down the middle in case Eller gets hurt again. But don't have high expectations for him. He's as white bread of a player as you can imagine, and starting to near his expiration date as a useful NHLer.

The Mantha/Vrana trade is.... uhhh... certainly something. Mantha is certainly bigger and more imposing than Vrana, so there will be a portion of the fanbase who will instantly like him. But ultimately his value to a hockey team doesn't seem remarkably different, and his cap hit certainly isn't going to represent any savings over Vrana's next deal. And the price they paid to get him was high. Maybe it works out and he clicks here, so I'll reserve some optimism. But it seems very expensive and I'm going to hate to see Vrana succeed elsewhere.

 

[Melkor]

The trade is not even near the Erat territory but I don't know Mantha enough to declare with authority he's going to produce for sure. I liked him a lot in juniors but..yeah..he hasn't been a junior in nearly a decade.

The trade is fascinating one for sure. I'd really prefer Vrana to get traded for Rakell straight up as I proposed on the trade board but hey..who knows lol, I give Mac his props for giving zero f***s about how he would look if he trades a fan favorite or this flashy type of players that always catch people's eyes. He doesn't like the guy - he drives his ass to the airport and doesnt hesitate lol

 

[EroCaps]

Mantha and Vrana have similar negative traits in terms of question marks surrounding motivation.

The difference is Mantha is bigger, cheaper, and arguably higher offensive upside if you put him with talent.

This saves them at least 3M in cap space and they are probably better. A 1st and 2nd is a little rich, but we'll see...

 

[troyerlaw]

So I see this trade as:
Mantha for Vrana and a 2nd.
A 1st to dump Panik.

Basically a wash between Vrana and Mantha. Interesting

I see mantha as a better player, right now, for the Caps. No more attitude bullshit, a guy who will be thrilled to get a chance at tge postseason, let alone a Cup. We weren’t gonna be able to afford Vrana anyway, and he just seems to get crossways with every single coach he plays for. Needs to grow up. We lose speed, but we gain actual power forward type. Mantha is massive

 

[trick9]

Boom-or-bust but they want to win now and don't seem to think paying Vrana the money he deserves seem like the way to do so.

I don't mind it. It's steep price to pay for sure. But Vrana has been bad this season and has been in the dog-house lately. Laviolette clearly doesn't trust him. He has mostly played 10-13 minutes per game for a month or so and was healthy scratched few times. Of his 11 goals 8 are against Sabres and Devils. 3 in 26 games against other teams. Mantha gives them a better chance to win now and if he pans out he's going to be a steal long-term. They also ship out Panik in the process.

 

[Barry Amsterdam]

Mantha has never had an elite playmaker with him. Give him backstrom. Im telling you watch the f out. He will be a mosnter

 

[troyerlaw]

Hey guys we got Michael Raffl!

Hahahah. Underrated comment, hidden as it is amongst the growing mass of handwringing, number crunching, hot take having

 

[Hivemind]

Mantha and Vrana have similar negative traits in terms of question marks surrounding motivation.

The difference is Mantha is bigger, cheaper, and arguably higher offensive upside if you put him with talent.

This saves them at least 3M in cap space and they are probably better. A 1st and 2nd is a little rich, but we'll see...

Mantha is not cheaper, and this doesn't save them jack shit in cap space. Vrana is not going to get paid $6M+ in a flat cap world, especially when they can point at the $6M deals that Ehlers and Guentzel signed after far more productive seasons as an upper bound during any arbitration hearings/contract negotiations. Something between Gourde's $5.16M and Mantha's $5.7M is a much more realistic figure for Vrana.

Paying a 1st and a 2nd to ditch Panik is not wise cap management.

 

[HecticGlow]

Mantha has never had an elite playmaker with him. Give him backstrom. Im telling you watch the f out. He will be a mosnter

Is he defensively responsible? Because if not there's a decent chance he'll get 13 minutes a night and third line duties where he's used to first line TOI.

 

[HoweFan]

Just here to wish Mantha all the best. You may have got a 50 goal scorer. Trouble is occasionally he has a 50 cent work ethic. Hopefully one scathing look from Ovi might straighten him out.

 

[HecticGlow]

The difference is Mantha is bigger, cheaper, and arguably higher offensive upside if you put him with talent.

This saves them at least 3M in cap space and they are probably better. A 1st and 2nd is a little rich, but we'll see...

Mantha has a $5,700,000 AAV
Vrana has a $3,350,000 AAV

In real money, they now owe Mantha $5,300,000 next year and $6,500,000 the following two years before he's a UFA.

How are they saving money exactly?

 

[troyerlaw]

Vrana is not going to get paid $6M+ in a flat cap world, especially when they can point at the $6M deals that Ehlers and Guentzel signed after far more productive seasons as an upper bound during any arbitration hearings/contract negotiations. Something between Gourde's $5.16M and Mantha's $5.7M is a much more realistic figure for Vrana.

Paying a 1st and a 2nd to ditch Panik is not wise cap management.

Vrana will indeed get $6m, is my guess. And worth noting, regarding this year’s draft class, it is generally regarded as weaker than the ones on either side of it.

it’s an expensive deal, but i agree that one of the picks is to get ride of the albatross Panik contract, the other is w/ Vrana (becoming free agent) for Mantha (signed thru ‘24 at $5.7)

 

[Ovechkins Wodka]

Just Awful. GMBM sucks at the trade deadline

 

[Barry Amsterdam]

Is he defensively responsible? Because if not there's a decent chance he'll get 13 minutes a night and third line duties where he's used to first line TOI.

Honestly hes had his work ethic called into question many times but thats overblown. Going from the wings to the caps will get him excited.

 

[troyerlaw]

Mantha has a $5,700,000 AAV
Vrana has a $3,350,000 AAV

In real money, they now owe Mantha $5,300,000 next year and $6,500,000 the following two years before he's a UFA.

How are they saving money exactly?

Vrana will get more than $5.7 is my guess. And for what he brings, consistency wise, he simply isnt worth it. Let another team overpay him.

Is it possible Vrana becomes a superstar somewhere else? Sure. Would i bet on it, absolutely not.

 

[HecticGlow]

Just here to wish Mantha all the best. You may have got a 50 goal scorer. Trouble is occasionally he has a 50 cent work ethic. Hopefully one scathing look from Ovi might straighten him out.

Hmmm... On the right team Vrana could easily be a 40 goal scorer, with underrated passing ability. He just gets lost in defensively-minded systems. Guess we'll see who it works out best for (not including the first and second round picks we just sent you... )

 

[HecticGlow]

Vrana will get more than $5.7 is my guess. And for what he brings, consistency wise, he simply isnt worth it. Let another team overpay him

You're seeing the Red Wings fans saying Mantha has had work ethic issues, right? Big assumption we're getting a consistent player in DC in return.

 

[Hivemind]

Vrana will indeed get $6m, is my guess. And worth noting, regarding this year’s draft class, it is generally regarded as weaker than the ones on either side of it.

it’s an expensive deal, but i agree that one of the picks is to get ride of the albatross Panik contract, the other is w/ Vrana (becoming free agent) for Mantha (signed thru ‘24 at $5.7)

As a UFA, maybe. As an RFA, nope.

Jake Guentzel got $6M as an RFA in the middle of a 40G, 76P season with a 79.5M salary cap.
The current cap is only $81.5M, basically the exact same. How is an RFA Vrana going to get a $6M+ salary when compared against Guentzel's deal? Or Ehlers'? Or Pastrnak's?

 

[EroCaps]

Mantha is not cheaper, and this doesn't save them jack shit in cap space. Vrana is not going to get paid $6M+ in a flat cap world, especially when they can point at the $6M deals that Ehlers and Guentzel signed after far more productive seasons as an upper bound during any arbitration hearings/contract negotiations. Something between Gourde's $5.16M and Mantha's $5.7M is a much more realistic figure for Vrana.

Paying a 1st and a 2nd to ditch Panik is not wise cap management.

Okay, let's say a similar price tag.

Every coach that has dealt with Vrana has had issues with his game, and when he's not scoring goals he's not doing much for you.

Mantha in all likelihood is going to give them more value for the money.

 

[IafrateOvie34]

Bowey traded again and Jensen is playing well. I'll give it a few years before I say the Mantha/Vrana trade is a fail. If Mantha plays to his potential and gets us deep into the playoffs, it's a win. I like Vrana and he's great for break aways and a nice snipe, however he's not getting into traffic areas. The part I don't like is giving up a 1st and 2nd for getting rid of Panik. Mantha for Vrana is an ok swap between them. What Hivemind said about Raffle. It's a warm body and he is capable of scoring a goal and nobody is missing a 5th rnd pick.