Top-100 Hockey Players of All-Time - Round 2, Vote 4

wetcoast

Registered User
Nov 20, 2018
22,247
10,126
Can any one explain Esposito winning the Lindsay/Pearson during two of Orr's peak seasons?

Just doesn't jive with the legend of Orr...

Players aren't a reliable source for award voting.

It's often better to research the season in question and make up ones own mind.

It's pretty obvious that Orr was the better player but in 71 it was

Phil 78-76-76-152 plus 69 line.
Orr 78-37-102-139 plus 124 line

In 73 it was

Phil 78-55-75-130 plus 17
Orr 63-29-72-101 plus 55

The Pearson isn't any feather in Phil's cap as voters aren't always right..
 

VanIslander

A 19-year ATDer on HfBoards
Sep 4, 2004
35,134
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The Pearson isn't any feather in Phil's cap as voters aren't always right..
The voters are the NHL players!

They're right more often than the GMs vote for the Vezina!

It is a feather in a cap. What your peers think is considered important in other professions, why not hockey?

There are reasons not to be impressed by Esposito, but his Pearson/Lindsay record isn't one of them.
 

Canadiens1958

Registered User
Nov 30, 2007
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Lake Memphremagog, QC.
On first sight that seems counterintuitive, although not necessarily wrong. Do you think it also would have been true if there was a players' award in the O6 era?

Neither. Players are too involved in the game during a season. Post retirement views are different - more mature, covering time and a larger pool of players.

The issue seems to arise out of the Orr v Esposito early debates. Orr had a history of missing games. Esposito did not. Players value playing.
 

VanIslander

A 19-year ATDer on HfBoards
Sep 4, 2004
35,134
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... Orr had a history of missing games. Esposito did not. Players value playing.
Where do you get the idea that NHL votes are biased toward the obe who played more games? NOT the greater performer? PLAYERS VALUE PRODUCTION at least makes sense.

Mario Lemieux won the Pearson/Lindsay four times despite missing games each time, 14 one year and 24 another.

The fact is: players thought Esposito played better rhan Orr those two seasons. Full stop.
 

bobholly39

Registered User
Mar 10, 2013
22,078
14,589
Where do you get the idea that NHL votes are biased toward the obe who played more games? NOT the greater performer? PLAYERS VALUE PRODUCTION at least makes sense.

Mario Lemieux won the Pearson/Lindsay four times despite missing games each time, 14 one year and 24 another.

The fact is: players thought Esposito played better rhan Orr those two seasons. Full stop.

Yeah - Hart voting too. since Espo didn't make this round maybe we can look into that more closely next round
 

Canadiens1958

Registered User
Nov 30, 2007
20,020
2,773
Lake Memphremagog, QC.
Where do you get the idea that NHL votes are biased toward the obe who played more games? NOT the greater performer? PLAYERS VALUE PRODUCTION at least makes sense.

Mario Lemieux won the Pearson/Lindsay four times despite missing games each time, 14 one year and 24 another.

The fact is: players thought Esposito played better rhan Orr those two seasons. Full stop.

VI displaying a unique ability to misunderstand the question and answer. Hint - Orr and Esposito were teammates.
 

DannyGallivan

Your world frightens and confuses me
Aug 25, 2017
7,562
10,110
Melonville
Guy Lafleur is not someone I could put over Ovechkin, as Ovechkin is probably a more dominant version of Lafleur (with some blur)...Lafleur is a playoff wagon, but it's not enough to quite get him over Ovechkin for me. They'll both be towards the very bottom of my ballot.
Fark, I'm surprised at you. You couldn't find two more different forwards than Lafleur and Ovechkin. Both in style and in the overall tookbox (Guy Lafleur's total skill set vs Ovechkin's north-south speed and shot release). And Lafleur was much better than Ovechkin.
 

Michael Farkas

Grace Personified
Jun 28, 2006
13,352
7,834
NYC
www.HockeyProspect.com
On first sight that seems counterintuitive, although not necessarily wrong. Do you think it also would have been true if there was a players' award in the O6 era?

I hate to speculate but something tells me an award pre- say...1960 or so would probably favor guys that were tough to get around. But that's just a guess based on anecdotal quotes and my own wild, unkempt speculation...
 
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