Top 10 Russian hockey players all-time(link)

Discussion in 'Russia' started by MaxV, Jan 11, 2007.

  1. TheNextOneX Registered User

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    Here's mine.

    1)Vyacheslav Arkadevich "Slava" Bykov
    2)Andrei Khomutov
    3)Sergei Makarov
    4)Vsevolod Bobrov
    5)Vladimir Krutov
    6)Viacheslav Fetisov
    7)Boris Mikhailov
    8)Valeri Kamensky
    9)Vladimir Petrov
    10)Valery Kharlamov
     
  2. Peter25 Registered User

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    My top 50. I will leave off the younger generation players such as Malkin, Ovechkin and Kovalchuk.

    1. Mikhailov
    2. Fetisov
    3. Kharlamov
    4. Krutov
    5. Makarov
    6. Petrov
    7. Kasatonov
    8. Maltsev
    9. Firsov
    10. Starshinov

    ....

    11. Tretiak
    12. Fedorov
    13. Kapustin
    14. Bobrov
    15. Bure
    16. Zubov
    17. Tsygankov
    18. Yakushev
    19. Alexandrov
    20. Bilyaletdinov

    ...

    22. Khomutov
    23. Shadrin
    25. Bykov
    26. Shalimov
    27. Luchenko
    28. Mogilny
    29. Ragulin
    30. Kuzkin

    ...

    31. Almetov
    32. Loktev
    33. Kamensky
    34. Pervukhin
    35. Sologubov
    36. Davydov
    37. Zhluktov
    38. Kovalev
    39. Zhamnov
    40. Konstantinov

    ....

    41. Malakhov
    42. Balderis
    43. Babinov
    44. Drozdetsky
    45. Khabibulin
    46. A.Yashin
    47. V.Golikov
    48. Lebedev
    49. Y.Fedorov
    50. Gonchar
     
  3. Peter25 Registered User

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    Valeri Vasilyev should of course be somewhere in 10-15 on that list.
     

  4. Top 50 ? no Larionov ?!
     
  5. cska78 Registered User

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    Larionov was the weakest forward on that line, but if you exclude him and include Kasatanov...:shakehead:amazed:
     
  6. MaxV Registered User

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    I also have a problem with Krutov over Makarov.

    Don't get me wrong Krutov was great, but Makarov was spectacular.

    Makarov was the most explosive Russian player of his generation and top 5 in the world at that time.
     
  7. VMBM Touch a mountain... m'kay?

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    Well, I guess one shouldn't criticize too much when someone makes an effort to list 50 players, BUT...

    Krutov over Makarov? Kasatonov #7? Kapustin #13? Balderis #42? :laugh:

    And where's Vasiliev? (I'm pretty sure you simply forgot him, though)

    You don't even need to list the reasons why Makarov was better than Krutov or that Kasatonov doesn't belong to top 10 - or even top 20. Let's talk about Balderis instead. He wasn't Russian per se, but since he's on the list...
    I suspect that Balderis is so low since his international career was a bit on/off nature (mostly due to his stormy relationship with Tikhonov I believe). Still, he has a claim to be the best/most dangerous Soviet forward of the late Seventies, even though I prefer Mikhailov and Petrov myself (not nearly as flashy but more important players to the team IMO).

    It's interesting that Peter25 has chosen Kapustin (clearly) and even Zhluktov over Balderis, as these 3 of course formed USSR/CSKA's feared 2nd line in the late '70s, and they sometimes rivaled and even outperformed the MPK line (1978 WC comes to mind). However, I think it was universally seen that Balderis was THE offensive star of that line. Kapustin (I love his skating!) might beat him career-wise, though (national team). Zhluktov just played longer in the Team USSR - nothing else.

    I'm one of the biggest Mikhailov fans, but having him #1 is a bit of a scretch. The biggest problem for me is that in my opinion, compared to Firsov, Kharlamov and Makarov for example, he needed good playmakers around him (more), whereas the aforementioned guys could often create their own scoring chances. Hockey is a team sport, but at least for me, when making all-time lists, it's the individual skills that play even a bigger role than normally.

    I'll give it a shot myself:

    1. Fetisov
    2. Firsov¨
    3. Kharlamov
    4. Makarov
    5. Tretiak
    6. Mikhailov
    7. Maltsev
    8. Petrov
    9. Bobrov
    10. Vasiliev
     
  8. nzdiver Registered User

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    Regarding the #10 pick. I would personally pick Fedorov over Larionov. Igor is a good choice, but I would put Sergei over him any day (higher than 10th as well).

    Talking about younsters, Alex Ovechkin will be in the list, few more years and he will be over 1000 points. What he really needs to cement himself in top5 is THE CUP
     
  9. MaxV Registered User

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    Well, Larionov vs. Fedorov is a very good argument.

    Yes, during their time in Detroit, Feds was MUCH better, but those weren't Igor's best years.

    I would say, judging by their peaks, you are right, Feds was better. But Feds' peak didn't last long. Krutov's peak was better also then Larionov, but again Igor certainly has longevity on his side.

    If I had to do this list over again right now, it might be a bit different.
     
  10. RussianHockey96 Registered User

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    Top 10 forwards all time imo.

    1 - Bure
    2 - Kharlamov
    3 - Maltsev
    4 - Makarov
    5 - Mikhailov
    6 - Petrov
    7 - Fedorov
    8 - Mogilny
    9 - Firsov
    10 - Bobrov
     
  11. RussianHockey96 Registered User

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    Tretiak 11th? Bure 15th? Mogilny 28th? No Larionov? Yikes
     
  12. Nicky Santoro Registered User

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    Bump.

    Hi, i'd like to ask any Russians here on this board 2 questions pls?



    1- I know soccer is big in Russia, but is it really way bigger than hockey? is it close or not really close..

    2- Who is the most famous Russian hockey player in Russia who fans love the most.. Ovechkin, Malkin, Datsyuk?? or even Chara, not sure though if he is considered a Russian..

    i've always wondered this. my guess would be Ovy because he is a character and a 50 goal scorer. but so tough to beat Malkin who is great and Datsyuk who is unreal. can't wait to hear the answer.


    thanks
     
  13. Caser @RUSProspects

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    1. I would say soccer is actually bigger in terms of popularity, but it is close. In terms of kids choosing the sport, soccer is much bigger, because it almost doesn't need any special equipment/rinks and also because we still desperately need more rinks (there's quite a lot of big towns where you basically can't find any rinks at all)

    2. If we are talking about fans who really follow hockey, then Datsyuk is being deservingly adored. If talking about the "fans", who are just turning the TV on to see Russia NT once a year at WC/Olympics, then Ovi is a face of the "franchise".

    Chara? The fact that he is as big as a bear doesn't make him Russian, you know :D
     
  14. Nicky Santoro Registered User

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    thanks so much, caser. i tried to google this question and could never get it. then i remembered this board. i live in a building here in mtl with 95% russians, and i've asked 4 guys this question in the elevator and i thought they were going to stab me. they looked like they had no interest in sports and didn't speak much english.

    i am glad hockey is almost as popular watching as soccer. i am in a bit of a shock datsyuk is the most popular cause he's not an outgoing player. very quiet, unlike ovi who is charismatic and controversial. i really hope russians in russia follow the NHL russians and are interested in the sc finals, etc.

    also, i would have easily put my money on Malkin over Datsyuk because he plays with sid and is sooooo amazing, too.

    thanks again.
     
  15. arion52 Registered User

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    Fetisov average player with the Devils, more of a positional player than a physical player, HOF but over-rated to a large degree.
     
  16. VMBM Touch a mountain... m'kay?

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    Well, if you are the best player on the 1980s Soviet National Team/CSKA (though some favour Makarov) in your prime, I don't think you are very overrated.
    To hell with his NHL career.
     
  17. Scotty B Registered User

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    MaxV:
    With respect, the bold part is pretty misleading imo...Fedorov was the only player to be declared NHL MVP and to win the Selke trophy as the league's best defensive FORWARD, in the same year...but that's light years from being league MVP + top defensive player (aka top defense man ). Only one guy was ever the NHL's top scorer, league MVP , playoff MVP, top defense man, and best +/-, all in the same year, and that was ROBERT Gordon ORR.

    ***

    Bobby Orr won three consecutive Hart Trophies as NHL MVP , and 8 consecutive Norris trophies as top defensive player. He also won the league scoring title twice! The ONLY NHL defense man ever to accomplish this feat. Orr’s +/- is far and away the best in NHL history. Orr’s team, Boston, scored, on average, roughly one more goal per game, than did the opposition, when he ( Orr ) was on the ice...and he was +124 one year. Think his career high for goals was something like 46, and points 139 in a single season.

    Although Orr officially retired at age 31, he was pretty much done at age 28, because of e chronic knee injuries. Orr’s last hurrah came in the 1976 Canada Cup — his one and only appearance in an international hockey tourney – where he was once again honored as MVP, despite playing on one knee!

    . Fedorov was damn good, but ( to an old timer like me ) Orr was, far and away, the greatest hockey player who ever lived. Too bad he and Bobby Hull couldn’t play in the 1972 Summit Series. And too bad we didn’t see Firsov there either!

    For the record, I would have to say that Kharlamov was the best Russian I ever saw play

    PEACE OUT
     
    Last edited: Jan 8, 2015
  18. Yakushev72 Registered User

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    You obviously have never seen any film of Fetisov when he played in the Canada Cups, NHL-Soviet Super Series, and World Championships against Gretzky, Lemieux, Messier, etc. He was always as good, and sometimes better, than NHL Hall of Fame players.

    You can't judge the quality of Soviet/Russian players by whether they stand out as leaders in the NHL. There are a lot of other forces at work beyond hockey. I remember the story published by Brendan Shanahan, who was a team mate of Fetisov's at NJ, about how much hatred Fetisov faced from by his teammates and rival teams when he first joined the Devils. They didn't want any Commies coming over and taking Canadian jobs, and his defense partners, according to Shanahan, would deliberately get out of the way so that Fetisov could be "back stabbed" when pursuing a loose puck along the boards. The Russian players of that era (it hasn't really changed much) kind of "hung back" rather than try to make themselves noticed and challenge the dominant culture. Fedorov and Bure were the first to somewhat break the mold in that era.
     
  19. Atas2000 Registered User

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    Absolutely not of course. How's Fetisov first all time? With all due respect to his tremendous career. But this about all-time Russians. There were quite some heavyweights there, quite too big for Fetisov even.
     
  20. Atas2000 Registered User

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    Oh, the swiss bias is nice, but that's far from realistic.
     
  21. Atas2000 Registered User

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    I like the approach. We should talk about the active players when they are done with their player's careers. And the only one tough to judge here is Datsyuk. I'm really tempted to put him on th list already. He is just that great.
     
  22. Atas2000 Registered User

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    1.If we're talking popularity it is way bigger. Talk about the power of promoton. We suck at soccer, and will suck at soccer for another 200 years probably. Yet it's very popular. I would go out and say nonetheless hockey has a much more commited fan community with far less casual fans.

    2.Talking active players. Ovy, Kovy, Malkin, Datsyuk is definitely everybody's top 4. Nearly every single fan would pick one of them probably. There is no clear no.1 I think. There is also a lot of regional pride to it. Ppl from Ural are definitly Datsyuk or Malkin fans for example.

    Chara is slovak. Among Russians following the NHL there is also that typicla Boston antagonism going. Some like the Bruins, some don't. And they pin it to sngle players at times. I don't like several players on the Bruins, but I think chara get's too much flak for no reason. And what's most important he's a very smart and polite guys off the ice and btw speaks Russian very well(as well as several other languages).
     
  23. Atas2000 Registered User

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    1.I'd add to that that a lot of change is going on recently. Back in my days living i a typical average russian climate zone with cold winters and hot summers we'd play scocer in summer and hockey in winter. Getting a hockey stick for your say 5th birthday was pretty normal. Outdoor hockey rinks(i.e. boards, nets) would be built up at every corner. We'd make the ice by ourselves. then it was all gone in the 90s. Right now It's different in every region. We in Tatarstan are back to that practice. Most schools have outdoor rinks set up in the winter. I personally use two of them to play with friends 2-3 times a week. There are quite a few indoor rinks too. And thus a lot of kids choose hockey. It is a result of AkBars' success obviously too and the policiy of the regional government on developing youth sports. Sadly we are probably the most bright spot in Russia in that matter.
     
  24. Atas2000 Registered User

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    hear, hear! a good one.
     
  25. Atas2000 Registered User

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    On one hand he gets underrated a lot. On the other hand the russian top 10 is so stacked, there is no shame at all in not making it.
     
    Last edited: Jan 10, 2015

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