News Article: Tomas Plekanec wants back in....
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Lots of factors...lack of experience playing a new position, lack of quality centers on the team to insulate him, ice time.
Of course, it wasn't all on Plekanec...but no doubt, the added icetime and responsibility Drouin go after Plekanec got traded, was a factor in the more consistent performance/production we saw from Drouin post-deadline.
Plekanec got to play with Brendan Gallagher all year, for years played with our best wingers and he did the same thing.
Not that you'd notice that, since it doesn't fall into your weak narrative.
Those 20 games DLR played with Galchenyuk/Lehkonen were better than any 20 games Plekanec played with Lehkonen or Hudon or Byron/Gallagher (his 2 most common linemates this year).
I mean seriously...you're going to talk about how DLR benefitted from playing with Galchenyuk & Lehkonen,
Do you know what Plekanec's most commonly used linemates were this year?
Hudon/Plekanec/Gallagher
Byron/Plekanec/Gallagher
Lehkonen/Plekanec/Gallagher
and EACH of these lines played MORE than Galchenyuk/DLR/Lehkonen.
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Garnet76
Registered User
I'm not sure if I want Thomas back. Its depends on how the offseason goes. But I believe claude would love to have him back. He still is a very good defensive player but gets too much ice time. The habs will likely strike out in UFAs and Thomas will add depth. I know its early but I dont expect the habs to be a playoff team this upcoming year.
Why? Cause it's not convenient for you?
yet here you are, just below, making an argument based around ice time?
LOL I mean come on man
Considering that Plekanec played more ES minutes than any other forward not named Max Pacioretty...this isn't surprising.
Every single player, on every single NHL team that either leads his team in ES TOI or is 2nd in ES TOI...also is, drumroll please...
1st or 2nd in ES points.
There's nothing revealing about what you posted - it's an obvious. A player who plays a lot at ES, tends to also lead his team in ES scoring.
Yet you're sitting here acting like you just discovered plutonium.
You can - but i'm not much of a believer in zone starts being much more than a footnote.
I'd rather see Drouin (or really Galcneyuk) as a center in the top 9 than Plekanec. Plekanec would have had like 10 or 15 points last season if he wasn't Gallagher's anchor until he got traded. His numbers with us would have looked more like his numbers with the Leafs: 2 points in 17 games.
Drouin played more than Plekanec the whole year!
How about he just got better at center after 60 games? Wouldn't that be more plausible than your imaginary Plekanec thing?
So Gallagher is now our best winger? Wasn't he damaged goods not so long ago?
Gallagher has a bounce-back year and career year playing with useless Plekanec but this has nothing to do with Plekanec, right? Sure man...
Sigh...up until Tomas Plekanec was traded, no other forward had more TOI on the Habs except for Max Pacioretty.
That's also what I wrote...but your ability to ignore what right in front of you prevented you from seeing it. Here, i'll post it AGAIN, see if you can catch it this time.
"Lots of factors...lack of experience playing a new position, lack of quality centers on the team to insulate him, ice time.
Of course, it wasn't all on Plekanec...but no doubt, the added icetime and responsibility Drouin go after Plekanec got traded, was a factor in the more consistent performance/production we saw from Drouin post-deadline."
I never argued Gallagher was damaged goods...in fact when most did, I argued the opposite.
So there goes that.
I can only imagine what kind of season Brendan Gallagher would of had had he not played 80% of the season with a player who can't do anything offensively.
He had a great year in SPITE of Plekanec...not because of Plekanec.
in 61 games WITH Plekanec as his center Brendan Gallagher had 21 goals 15 assists for 36pts...decent numbers.
in 21 games WITHOUT Plekanec as his center Brendan gallagher had 10 goals 8 assists for 18pts...nearly a PPG pace.
He went from .59PPG....to .85PPG
Please.
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Wow first you tell me to stop using TOI as an argument...then you use it and ask me if I under its concept.
Are you serious? lol
Up until Plekanec was traded...no, their TOI/GP was not higher.
Jonathan Drouin especially, saw his icetime rise following the trade.
Anything else?
Gallagher's numbers were even better after Plekanec got traded
Before Plekanec got traded, in 60 games he had 21 goals, 15 assists, and 36 points. That's a pace of 28.7 goals and 49 points in 82 games.
After Plekanec was traded, in 22 games he had 10 goals, 8 assists, 18 points. That's a pace of 37 goals and 67 points in 82 games.
I can't wait to see Gallagher play a whole season without Plekanec. Last year I was screaming at the TV for Julien to get him off Plekanec's line and put him with Pacioretty and Danault. This is one of many bad coaching decisions that has me thinking we have a lot of good pieces that just weren't used well. Galchenyuk should be playing center, Shaw should have been out of the top 9 much sooner, Paccioretty shouldn't have been on the half wall for half the season, Galchenyuk should have been (when they made the switch our pp went from bottom to top 5 in the league), Carr and Deslauriers should be fixtures on the 4th line wings, don't get me started on Alzner's usage and the dcore, etc...
Congratulations on winning a very small battle.
While Plekanec had seen more TOI overall, he did play 4 more games than Drouin had at that point. I'll concede that point.
It's really just a sidebar...it's not the main crux of my argument.
But if that's what you want to hang your hat on, by all means...
What about all the other arguments that I was right and you wrong on?
ES production?
Gallagher's production?
Guessing you're not going to address those huh? Just call victory because I was 30 seconds off TOI/G?
Break out the champagne I guess
Gallagher's numbers were even better after Plekanec got traded
Before Plekanec got traded, in 60 games he had 21 goals, 15 assists, and 36 points. That's a pace of 28.7 goals and 49 points in 82 games.
After Plekanec was traded, in 22 games he had 10 goals, 8 assists, 18 points. That's a pace of 37 goals and 67 points in 82 games.
I can't wait to see Gallagher play a whole season without Plekanec. Last year I was screaming at the TV for Julien to get him off Plekanec's line and put him with Pacioretty and Danault. This is one of many bad coaching decisions that has me thinking we have a lot of good pieces that just weren't used well. Galchenyuk should be playing center, Shaw should have been out of the top 9 much sooner, Paccioretty shouldn't have been on the half wall for half the season, Galchenyuk should have been (when they made the switch our pp went from bottom to top 5 in the league), Carr and Deslauriers should be fixtures on the 4th line wings, don't get me started on Alzner's usage and the dcore, etc...
Yes he produced better but the whole team started to put up more points as soon as there was no more pressure and it was a lost cause...
Just like when Chucky scored 30 the other year we tanked...
It's weird but it seems like playing with no pressure helps... Look at Vegas this year...
Again, you're using the TOI wrong because you don't take into consideration the deployment IMO.
If you think starting the majority of your shifts in the offensive zone against weaker opposition is the same thing as starting the majority of your shifts in the defensive zone against tougher opposition than be my guest...
I do take into consideration deployment...I just reach different conclusions than you do.
I don't think it's the same thing...again, I just draw different conclusions.
Zone starts only measure zone STARTS...they don't depict what happens AFTER the puck is dropped for the faceoff.
You can't wrap up all events in zone starts to just where the draw is happening and disregard all the other things that happen afterwards.
As with most stats, without context, it's just information...
It was a lost cause in November/December.
While I do somewhat agree with you regarding production in lost seasons and having to take that into consideration.
There's no doubt that Brendan Gallagher's production increased when he started playing with Drouin because he started getting better quality chances period.
You can't go on ignoring factors that don't mesh with your narrative and just propping up those that do.
Yeah look at Vegas this year. There's no pressure in the playoffs and they're killing their opponents. You make a lot of sense.
Chucky had his highest point per game two seasons ago to start the year, before he got injured. It had nothing to do with no pressure.
And last year, the main reasons they did better after the deadline had nothing to do with pressure, they were out of the playoffs long before that. After the deadline they got rid of old slow players and brought in young players Juulse, Reilly, Mete, and Alzner split from Petry, Shaw was moved out of the top 9, Scherbak was called up, and of course Plekanec being traded was a huge addition by subtraction. Then we started to suck again at the end of the season, when Pacioretty, Danault, Mete and others went down with injury. It showed how Pacioretty was still important to this team.
I'd rather we tank, but if we go with youth and speed from the start of the season, and play our forwards in the proper positions, I could definitely see us pushing for the playoffs IF our young players like Scherbak, Drouin, Galchenyuk, Hudon, Lehkonen, Juulsen, Mete, Reilly, and say Zadian are ready to step up.
Laurentide
Registered User
The fact that Drouin, playing on the top line and getting first unit power play time could only average a minute more of ice-time than Pleks, who should have been playing no higher than the third line, is a damning indictment of Julien's over-dependency on scrubs. How is Drouin supposed to create offense when he barely gets more ice time than the offensive black hole known as Plekanec? He can't score from the bench but that's where he is when Pleks is gobbling up all that ice-time. You want to know why this team is offensively challenged? This is why. Because the players who are paid to provide offense aren't getting the lion's share of the minutes. Julien is more focused on trying to prevent the other team from doing things than he is in trying to get his own team to create something.
Plekanec creates nothing. His job is about prevention only. But having him for 60 games last season prevented nothing. The roof still caved in on them. So if Pleks can't even provide this team with the one element he's supposed to be good at, what's the point of bringing him back? All he's going to do is siphon off ice-time that should be going to more offensive-minded players.
Again, i'm not big on attributing much importance to zone starts...it's just information to me, I don't draw far reaching conclusions based on a stat that has no context.
You think differently and that's fine.
The games in October/November weren't any more or any less meaningful than the games in February/March/April.
The Habs didn't play many meaningful games this year period.
So that "pressure" argument is out the window
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