Timothy "Lillypad" Liljegren Discussion || UPD 1/14/2020 -- Recalled by the Leafs and returned

[1specter]

You mean next years first right? I dont know I'd be open to dealing that if the right trade came along.

The three prospects would cost more than good value to get. Youd have to pay for one of those guys with the assumption that they are going to be more valuable to your team than they are elsewhere (and as such your willing to endure a overpayment for them)

I think Dubas probably doesn't want to deal another first since we traded away our 2019 and 2020 first rounders, making it 3 in a row if they dealt next year's too. Considering our last two first round picks resulted in Liljegren and Sandin, I can see why Dubas values keeping the first rounder.

 

[LeafsNation75]

The problem is that people are assuming that it was Durzi vs Liljegren in a ceteris paribus scenario (all else being equal). I would imagine if the package had Liljegren in it, it was probably a less enticing package overall to the Kings.

e.g. Leafs offered Liljegren + Timashov or Liljegren+2nd or something like that, vs Durzi+Grundstrom+Liljegren1st, and Kings preferred package 2.

The thing is before Dubas made the Muzzin and his name came up in possible trade talk to Toronto, everyone speculated that it would have taken either Liljegren or Sandin to get him since they were the Leafs best prospects. No one thought that Durzi might have been involved.

 

[stickty111]

I may as well post this too.

Hayes narrative on Liljegren got ruined in a span of a couple weeks. Bob was on Overdrive today, and Hayes brought up the 3 prospects Bob said was untouchable.
You could tell by Hayes's tone he was surprised Lilly was in that list.
Bob said if one of the players is Kapanen or Johnsson, thats a significant package. Those are good players. There will be other pieces but they won't be Sandin, Liljegren or Robertson.
Hayes asked is it because those players will be cheap, and Bob said yes, but also when the Leafs look into the defense next season, they have Sandin and Lilly being full time NHLers.

Hayes surprised said, really? Then added Sandin for sure, but Lilj, and before Hayes could finish saying Lilly's name. Bob said " the funny thing was over the course of this season, organizationally it would be fair to say Leafs thought Liljegren was better then Sandin in the AHL. Now of course Sandin did well in the World Juniors, and got the quick call up, and has played really well here. I think the upside is higher for Sandin. By all accounts though, Liljegren has played really well with the Marlies. In terms of the pecking order, he was kind of perceived to be maybe ahead of Sandin, but they brought Sandin up because they needed a left shot D.

 

[stickty111]

 

[ITM]

“Lilypad”...a questionable selection for a nickname?

 

[CelticDruid]

“Lilypad”...a questionable selection for a nickname?

Why?

 

[Moonman]

It's a terrible nickname.

 

[stickty111]

“Lilypad”...a questionable selection for a nickname?

Babcock called him that.

 

[Jimmy Firecracker]

Babcock called him that.

The real reason he was fired.

 

[ITM]

Why?

A lily pad floats. A lily pad is a plant. A lily pad conveys a sense of apathy, even sympathy. A lily pad is feminine, a click away from sounding like a hygiene product.

It sounds condescending, ignorant and downright dumb. Especially so when attributed to a person and player like Liljegren.

Someone mentioned Babcock came up with the name. Well it sounds Babcockian, doesn’t it? And it is...So, there’s that taint as well.

Hearing Swedish commentators pronounce his name, you’d think it meant “He who laughs at the sight of his enemies driven before him”, or , “The spirits of doom approach in his shadow” or something only a Led Zepplin song could soundtrack to...Not “Lilypad” for the love of Borje Salming!

 

[LeafingTheWay]

A lily pad floats. A lily pad is a plant. A lily pad conveys a sense of apathy, even sympathy. A lily pad is feminine, a click away from sounding like a hygiene product.

It sounds condescending, ignorant and downright dumb. Especially so when attributed to a person and player like Liljegren.

Someone mentioned Babcock came up with the name. Well it sounds Babcockian, doesn’t it? And it is...So, there’s that taint as well.

Hearing Swedish commentators pronounce his name, you’d think it meant “He who laughs at the sight of his enemies driven before him”, or , “The spirits of doom approach in his shadow” or something only a Led Zepplin song could soundtrack to...Not “Lilypad” for the love of Borje Salming!

Maybe it symbolizes the peace, purity and peace he'll bring to the Leafs. "The beautiful bloom that emerges from the mud"

All kidding aside, I agree with you. Lilypad is a terrible nickname.

 

[Bluebear]

This is sports, save enlightenment for the arts. Give him a better nickname

 

[stickty111]

Can we change the thread title?

 

[stickty111]

The last play wasn't the play I thought it was. Still a nice play. This is the one I wanted.

 

[napoleon in rags]

The real reason he was fired.

This post is not getting enough love.

 

[TML1967]

I may as well post this too.

Hayes narrative on Liljegren got ruined in a span of a couple weeks. Bob was on Overdrive today, and Hayes brought up the 3 prospects Bob said was untouchable.
You could tell by Hayes's tone he was surprised Lilly was in that list.
Bob said if one of the players is Kapanen or Johnsson, thats a significant package. Those are good players. There will be other pieces but they won't be Sandin, Liljegren or Robertson.
Hayes asked is it because those players will be cheap, and Bob said yes, but also when the Leafs look into the defense next season, they have Sandin and Lilly being full time NHLers.

Hayes surprised said, really? Then added Sandin for sure, but Lilj, and before Hayes could finish saying Lilly's name. Bob said " the funny thing was over the course of this season, organizationally it would be fair to say Leafs thought Liljegren was better then Sandin in the AHL. Now of course Sandin did well in the World Juniors, and got the quick call up, and has played really well here. I think the upside is higher for Sandin. By all accounts though, Liljegren has played really well with the Marlies. In terms of the pecking order, he was kind of perceived to be maybe ahead of Sandin, but they brought Sandin up because they needed a left shot D.

Liljgren has been the more complete player. Sandin is smart and agile, but in his own zone he still needs seasoning. Liljgren is slowly developing his offensive game, but his defensive game has been top notch at the AHL level. Very solid frame as well now.

I think people also forget that he is still only 20 (21 in April).
Most guys his age are starting their first AHL year and he is on his 3rd.
Hes on pace for 58 points this year ( 8th best ppg ever for a 20 y.o D).
As a 19 y.o AHL D, 17th best ppg all time. (Sandin this year is 2nd as of now which is part of the hype)
As a 18 y.o AHL D, 3rd best ppg for guys who played more than 10 games.

So he has been putting up good numbers in comparison offensively, he has dramatically improved his D, and his speed has taken a step forward. I dont know how much more people were expecting out of a late 1st D, but hes knocking it out of the park.

A Sandin-Liljgren 3rd pair next year makes a ton of sense.

 

[stickty111]

Liljgren has been the more complete player. Sandin is smart and agile, but in his own zone he still needs seasoning. Liljgren is slowly developing his offensive game, but his defensive game has been top notch at the AHL level. Very solid frame as well now.

I think people also forget that he is still only 20 (21 in April).
Most guys his age are starting their first AHL year and he is on his 3rd.
Hes on pace for 58 points this year ( 8th best ppg ever for a 20 y.o D).
As a 19 y.o AHL D, 17th best ppg all time. (Sandin this year is 2nd as of now which is part of the hype)
As a 18 y.o AHL D, 3rd best ppg for guys who played more than 10 games.

So he has been putting up good numbers in comparison offensively, he has dramatically improved his D, and his speed has taken a step forward. I dont know how much more people were expecting out of a late 1st D, but hes knocking it out of the park.

A Sandin-Liljgren 3rd pair next year makes a ton of sense.

Yup this is all accurate.
Somebody said it well. Sandin is the more dynamic player, but the better more developed player is Lilly. They both can handle NHL minutes. Sandin has shown he already can. Lilly could too.
I don't think many saw Lilly's defensive game improving this much and this quickly.

 

[saffronleaf]

In days of yore, from Britain's shore,
Wolfe, the dauntless hero, came
And planted firm Britannia's flag
On Canada's fair domain.
Here may it wave, our boast, our pride
And, joined in love together,
The lily, thistle, shamrock, rose
The Maple Leaf forever!

 

[Dekes For Days]

I also dislike the nickname Lilypad, though it's a hard name to find something for.

We need some Marner to rub off on him, and then we can call him Lil' Grin.

...

...I'll see myself out.

 

[The Iceman]

 

[CelticDruid]

A lily pad floats. A lily pad is a plant. A lily pad conveys a sense of apathy, even sympathy. A lily pad is feminine, a click away from sounding like a hygiene product.

It sounds condescending, ignorant and downright dumb. Especially so when attributed to a person and player like Liljegren.

Someone mentioned Babcock came up with the name. Well it sounds Babcockian, doesn’t it? And it is...So, there’s that taint as well.

Hearing Swedish commentators pronounce his name, you’d think it meant “He who laughs at the sight of his enemies driven before him”, or , “The spirits of doom approach in his shadow” or something only a Led Zepplin song could soundtrack to...Not “Lilypad” for the love of Borje Salming!

I'm sure that if Liljegren was offended by his nickname he could have easily asked his teammates to have changed it by now. Probably something really innocent and something that FANS are not privy too.

 

[ITM]

I'm sure that if Liljegren was offended by his nickname he could have easily asked his teammates to have changed it by now. Probably something really innocent and something that FANS are not privy too.

Marner played through outright coercion. Silence within a team doesn’t necessarily equate to deference. Outside a discussion on the topic we can’t be sure of anything he’s offended by or not.

Innocent? No idea. Babcock seemed to delight in uncertainty for the most part. Erring towards a certain kind of ongoing...uhm...motivation.

As a FAN, I would prefer “Meatball” to “Lilypad” and ideally “Stormbringer” or something similarly approaching Viking battleworn majesty. Almost anything to “Lilypad”.

But I confess...I understand the point. Amongst my friends we refer to Bracco as “Buttercup”, Sandin as “”Sweety Pie” and Engvall as “Goody Goody Gumdrop”.

And we’re all in a beer league. Completely normal, innocent banter...Come on my Celtic brother.

“Lilypad”!?!?!?

 

[Paradoc]

The last play wasn't the play I thought it was. Still a nice play. This is the one I wanted.

I want him called up. Why do we have to play Marincin tonight...

 

[stickty111]

I want him called up. Why do we have to play Marincin tonight...

Lilly is a righty. Dermott is a lefty. Marincin is a lefty.
Funny how all our defence injuries or illnesses have happened to LHD.

 

[Paradoc]

Lilly is a righty. Dermott is a lefty. Marincin is a lefty.
Funny how all our defence injuries or illnesses have happened to LHD.

I know, but we don't have to run 3LD and 3 RD. Marincin has little value for the team while Lilly seems ready and a game against one of the worst teams wouldn't hurt.