MR4
Registered User
- Oct 20, 2014
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Expose Holl this expansion draft, and run these 3 balanced lines:
Rielly-Dermott
Sandin-Brodie
Muzzin-Liljegren
Tribute Timothy Liljegren Discussion
- Thread starter stickty111
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Rielly-Dermott
Sandin-Brodie
Muzzin-Liljegren
Warden of the North
Ned Stark's head
Ive never seen an indication that this is true. It gets thrown around a lot, but IMO players believe they'll never be the guy that happens too.
Like, we were told the way Lou treated guys with Robidas Island would bite us, but theres nothing to indicate that has happened.
zeke
The Dube Abides
- Mar 14, 2005
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Very well said. Even on draft day it was well known that his draft year set-backs with mono would likely mean 3-4 years seasoning at lower levels. I'd say he is right on track. Seeing as though he has been ready for the NHL all year, that would have made him an NHL'er at the start of his D+4 year. Very happy with his progression thus far
A1LeafNation
Obsession beats talent everytime!!
- Oct 17, 2010
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The theme here would be Brodie > Dermott/Holl and Bogosian.
Personally I get that we struggled to puck-move on RD for years, but don't see this as a problem moving forward. I like that we can stay relatively young and tough by keeping 7 of this year's d-men as oppose to 6 of them...
Muzzin Holl
Rielly Liljegren
Sandin Bogosian
Dermott
zeke
The Dube Abides
- Mar 14, 2005
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I mean he's a fine #6 and all but I don't see any reason we need Bogo there when we can ice 6 top-4 caliber dmen instead.
Am I the only one who thought he look kinda shakey? I didn't think he had great poise with the puck and besides knocking a bunch of guys down he looks prone to bad penalties with a lot of bear hugging and holding.
I think he's a great depth option and definitely better than Ben Hutton but was far from impressive enough to put him in the line up on a regular basis (for now).
I think he's a great depth option and definitely better than Ben Hutton but was far from impressive enough to put him in the line up on a regular basis (for now).
No, the "theme" (cold hard objective truth) is that Brodie is much better than Dermott/Holl, and that Bogosian is immaterial because we can sign him to be our 7 *without* letting our best all around defenseman go for nothing.
Randy Randerson
Registered User
Nylander is less important to the forward corps that Brodie & Muzzin are to the d corps, but it's a reasonable comparison.
You don't shed core players as a contender on a whim like this, you're taking the test early and the organization has been adamant that it doesn't want to do that from the beginning of the Shanahan era.
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crump
~ ~ (ړײ) ~ ~
Well, he fell a couple of times, maybe bobbled the puck a couple of times, but I chalk that up to nerves. His gap in the neutral zone and choices when to pinch, his stick on breaking plays up, his stretch passes were very good. I don't give in to hyperbolic description much, so I would say it was a solid showing for a first game
Pretty much the only one. In my particular case though, the tint may not be as dark as it was in my first few years of leaf obsession, but they are definitely white sunglasses with a blue tine, with leafnation on the side.
Hey, WHAT an idea, would probably sell like hot cakes.
Gary Nylund
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- Oct 10, 2013
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Wait, are you saying you would trade him for Hughes? Come on now.
lol at the idea of giving up on Brodie and Muzzin - there's a reason why the Leafs are first in their division this season. Take one or both of these guys out and they're probably 2nd or 3rd in the Northern division.
I would be concerned if they were your #5 or 6 guys and taking up all that cap space, but they're only 31-32 and clear Top 4 talents. They may start to decay in their final years by 2023-2024, but they'd still be highly serviceable as your #5-6s on a SC contending team. If I were a betting man, based on how they play, Brodie likely stays in your Top 4 and Muzzin would be your #4-5 defenceman at worst. This would be offset by Sandin and Liljegren being better versions of themselves in 2 years time to close the gap, and a combo of Rielly/Holl/Dermott/FA and at least one decent upside ELC guy in Niemala/Kral/Hollowell as your #6.
I'm actually super optimistic on this team in the next 3-5 years. It feels weird, but it's ok to acknowledge this - I think Dubas has set this team up for long-term perennial success for as long as Matthews-Marner are here and there's enough cheap talent & min-signing prospects to offset future ballasts like Tavares/Brodie/Muzzin given that their likelihood to fall off a complete cliff is minimal
I would be concerned if they were your #5 or 6 guys and taking up all that cap space, but they're only 31-32 and clear Top 4 talents. They may start to decay in their final years by 2023-2024, but they'd still be highly serviceable as your #5-6s on a SC contending team. If I were a betting man, based on how they play, Brodie likely stays in your Top 4 and Muzzin would be your #4-5 defenceman at worst. This would be offset by Sandin and Liljegren being better versions of themselves in 2 years time to close the gap, and a combo of Rielly/Holl/Dermott/FA and at least one decent upside ELC guy in Niemala/Kral/Hollowell as your #6.
I'm actually super optimistic on this team in the next 3-5 years. It feels weird, but it's ok to acknowledge this - I think Dubas has set this team up for long-term perennial success for as long as Matthews-Marner are here and there's enough cheap talent & min-signing prospects to offset future ballasts like Tavares/Brodie/Muzzin given that their likelihood to fall off a complete cliff is minimal
zeke
The Dube Abides
- Mar 14, 2005
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Leaf fans have this insane need to throw away good players just because we have new good players.
Let's just forget about Bogosian and Dermott who have been solid ALL year for Liljegren who had a somewhat decent game vs a lottery team as the 6th defenceman.
I was not impressed with Liljegren's performance last night. A few questionable moves by him, one almost resulted in a bad give away in front of Rittich. Pretty disappointing, considering he was drafted before Sandin.
kb
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- Aug 28, 2009
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TopChedder
Registered User
- Oct 2, 2013
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Oh man wait until Topi Nemiela is ready lol people will want to throw away more players. I for one think having many good players is always a positive.
That's the biggest thing with Bogosian. He's a fine NHL defensemen that can play regular minutes on most teams.
But we could potentially have an elite d-core by mid-season next year once Sandin and Liljegren get some games in and you have to at least give that an opportunity to unfold. If you need to upgrade next deadline, or Bogo wants to come back as depth that's fine, but he won't make or break this defense.
Awesome post, course I cannot give it a like. BUT, I can say, awesome.
Kinda bizarre we both love Frycer, and now Liljegren, so much.
Petrus
Registered User
Maplebeasts
I See Demons!!!!!
Weird that some here didn't like his game. His breakout passes after he settled in were good. Had a 72 xGF% and 65% corsi, super good gap control and he brought a lot of physicality. I think there's a future top pairing guy the moment he gets the confidence to carry the puck at this level and shoot more. He was a bit nervous but was either the second or third best dman on the team last night.
Martin Skoula
Registered User
- Oct 18, 2017
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Yeah he seemed to fit an obvious niche of being the puck mover on a shutdown pair. He could use a bit more nastiness clearing the net but that's what pairing him with someone like Muzzin is for.
Taking away the neutral zone and buying time for the forwards to get back is an underrated defensive skillset. Holl does a good job of it but Liljegren can be better if he isn't already.
Eternal Leaf
Registered User
He had a great first game.
Good gap control, physical, and decent passing.
The depth in the top 4 is going to make it a lot easier for Sandin & Liljegren to transition into quality defensemen. They can be slowly eased into the role rather than getting tossed into the fire.
Good gap control, physical, and decent passing.
The depth in the top 4 is going to make it a lot easier for Sandin & Liljegren to transition into quality defensemen. They can be slowly eased into the role rather than getting tossed into the fire.
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