Online Series: Tiger King (Netflix)

[scott clam]

Kelci: "He fed people for free, a full Thanksgiving dinner that him and his family cooked, y'know, for the entire night prior every single year since I've been there, um, and I've been there almost 10 years. I've seen him give the jacket off his back for people, and I think that wasn't highlighted enough. Joe did a lot of messed up stuff, and that's a fact, and that's shown and now the entire world knows it, but he did a lot of good things, too."

Joe was really good at feeding his "friends" dumpster meat from wal mart.

 

[Osprey]

Joe was really good at feeding his "friends" dumpster meat from wal mart.

I agree. He didn't have to do that. He got the expired meat for the tigers, but still let his employees take what they wanted first. He could've been worse and not let them have any of it.

 

[scott clam]

I agree. He didn't have to do that. He got the expired meat for the tigers, but still let his employees take what they wanted first. He could've been worse and not let them have any of it.

Yeah, I mean at least he wasn't as cheap as Carole, right?

 

[Osprey]

Yeah, I mean at least he wasn't as cheap as Carole, right?

Right. Joe fed his friends before the tigers. Carole fed hers to the tigers.

 

[Deadpool8812]

Kelci: "He fed people for free, a full Thanksgiving dinner that him and his family cooked, y'know, for the entire night prior every single year since I've been there, um, and I've been there almost 10 years. I've seen him give the jacket off his back for people, and I think that wasn't highlighted enough. Joe did a lot of messed up stuff, and that's a fact, and that's shown and now the entire world knows it, but he did a lot of good things, too."

The EMS jacket he put on after his employee's arm got ripped off?

 

[Ozz]

Anyone catch the TV special that aired last night? I think it was on Fox. Got in on DVR and will watch tonight, probably. The Netflix bonus episode was all right, nothing surprising there but interesting enough.

 

[LightningStrikes]

I saw tiger... and tiger saw man!

 

[Motte and Bailey]

Not sure I understand the moral case for banning these exotic animal zoos from breeding a few thousand tiger cubs for entertainment in a world where billions of other animals are needlessly slaughtered every day. The irony in all of this is that because tigers are profitable they are less likely to go extinct. Having tigers in captivity isn’t bad in my view, in fact I see positives. They should always have adequate space and good conditions of course but the fact remains that their natural habitats are being destroyed and there doesn’t seem to be much hope in stopping that in the near future and keeping as much genetic diversity going is going to be crucial to their survival as a species even if it means they’re in captivity.

I think Joe is absolutely a level 10 narcissist but his stupidity and constant need to be admired put some limitations on how dangerous he really is. Carole on the other hand has no such limitation and I believe Carole is more than a narcissist she’s a complete sociopath who is by far the most ruthless person in the show. Say what you want about Joe, he’s a garbage human being for sure but he isn’t ruthless. Not even close.

The one character I thought was morally sound and actually seems like a good person is Doc Antle. It’s pretty damn telling that the only thing people have against him is he likes to sleep with multiple women who are all of age but significantly younger than him. Is that a crime? Last I checked people are allowed to form consenting relationships? Polyamory is bad when Doc does it but when Joe has 3 husbands no one cares? Doc is also the only one in the series who seems to actually be doing good work to preserve tigers in the wild. His non profit actually hires forest rangers in Asia and Africa to stop poachers from killing wild tigers. Carole spends her millions in donations on petty lawsuits over petty personal grudges and moral grandstanding that objectively resulted in the reduction of well-being of hundreds of tigers. And the zoo he runs is a million times nicer and better for the animals than Joe’s or Carole’s or anyone else’s on the show. It’s word class. I guess the producers wanted us to hate everyone in the show so they pulled some punches with Joe, pulled no punches with Carole, and invented a narrative to cast Doc in a bad light. Like, for example, at the very end when they said Doc’s zoo was “raided by authorities” was really misleading because they just give you a little tidbit of information that implies he’s guilty of something when there’s no reason to believe that he is.

 

[Motte and Bailey]

Oh I can’t understand why anyone who thinks Carole didn’t kill her husband.

If my spouse went missing and left a bunch of money I’d spend it all hiring investigators to keep looking for them. Maybe they didn’t have a great marriage, fine. That doesn’t explain the fact that she, instead of grieving or trying to find her lost husband, spent her time tampering with evidence, gathering, destroying, and fabricating highly suspicious legal documents (“upon my disappearance everything goes to Carole”) to enrich herself at the expense of the rest of his family. It might be circumstantial but Kamala Harris hinted on TV that everyone knows Carole Baskins killed her husband but there just isn’t enough evidence to convict.

 

[chicagoskycam]

Oh I can’t understand why anyone who thinks Carole didn’t kill her husband.

If my spouse went missing and left a bunch of money I’d spend it all hiring investigators to keep looking for them. Maybe they didn’t have a great marriage, fine. That doesn’t explain the fact that she, instead of grieving or trying to find her lost husband, spent her time tampering with evidence, gathering, destroying, and fabricating highly suspicious legal documents (“upon my disappearance everything goes to Carole”) to enrich herself at the expense of the rest of his family. It might be circumstantial but Kamala Harris hinted on TV that everyone knows Carole Baskins killed her husband but there just isn’t enough evidence to convict.

I don't believe they did a great job of diving into Carol's case or her husband in this doc to make a good judgement. They seemed to glaze over large parts of it. It was fairly obvious the PD did a horrible job.

 

[chicagoskycam]

Not sure I understand the moral case for banning these exotic animal zoos from breeding a few thousand tiger cubs for entertainment in a world where billions of other animals are needlessly slaughtered every day. The irony in all of this is that because tigers are profitable they are less likely to go extinct. Having tigers in captivity isn’t bad in my view, in fact I see positives. They should always have adequate space and good conditions of course but the fact remains that their natural habitats are being destroyed and there doesn’t seem to be much hope in stopping that in the near future and keeping as much genetic diversity going is going to be crucial to their survival as a species even if it means they’re in captivity.

I think Joe is absolutely a level 10 narcissist but his stupidity and constant need to be admired put some limitations on how dangerous he really is. Carole on the other hand has no such limitation and I believe Carole is more than a narcissist she’s a complete sociopath who is by far the most ruthless person in the show. Say what you want about Joe, he’s a garbage human being for sure but he isn’t ruthless. Not even close.

The one character I thought was morally sound and actually seems like a good person is Doc Antle. It’s pretty damn telling that the only thing people have against him is he likes to sleep with multiple women who are all of age but significantly younger than him. Is that a crime? Last I checked people are allowed to form consenting relationships? Polyamory is bad when Doc does it but when Joe has 3 husbands no one cares? Doc is also the only one in the series who seems to actually be doing good work to preserve tigers in the wild. His non profit actually hires forest rangers in Asia and Africa to stop poachers from killing wild tigers. Carole spends her millions in donations on petty lawsuits over petty personal grudges and moral grandstanding that objectively resulted in the reduction of well-being of hundreds of tigers. And the zoo he runs is a million times nicer and better for the animals than Joe’s or Carole’s or anyone else’s on the show. It’s word class. I guess the producers wanted us to hate everyone in the show so they pulled some punches with Joe, pulled no punches with Carole, and invented a narrative to cast Doc in a bad light. Like, for example, at the very end when they said Doc’s zoo was “raided by authorities” was really misleading because they just give you a little tidbit of information that implies he’s guilty of something when there’s no reason to believe that he is.

I don't think Tigers need to be bread with the specific intent of making money as Cubs and then living out the remainder of their lives packed in cages. A Tiger sanctuary in the U.S. would be a large swath of land closed off where they are able to roam. I have no idea what this would take or what's possible. Either the government or some billionaire could set it up. So if their natural habitat is all destroyed, we feel the need as humans to keep in cages to "save the species.." It's not really a good solution either but Joe's zoo was solely a for-profit enterprise. Doc probably falls in the same category. Carol is not breeding Tigers from what I understand anymore.

 

[bleedblue1223]

Not sure I understand the moral case for banning these exotic animal zoos from breeding a few thousand tiger cubs for entertainment in a world where billions of other animals are needlessly slaughtered every day. The irony in all of this is that because tigers are profitable they are less likely to go extinct. Having tigers in captivity isn’t bad in my view, in fact I see positives. They should always have adequate space and good conditions of course but the fact remains that their natural habitats are being destroyed and there doesn’t seem to be much hope in stopping that in the near future and keeping as much genetic diversity going is going to be crucial to their survival as a species even if it means they’re in captivity.

I think Joe is absolutely a level 10 narcissist but his stupidity and constant need to be admired put some limitations on how dangerous he really is. Carole on the other hand has no such limitation and I believe Carole is more than a narcissist she’s a complete sociopath who is by far the most ruthless person in the show. Say what you want about Joe, he’s a garbage human being for sure but he isn’t ruthless. Not even close.

The one character I thought was morally sound and actually seems like a good person is Doc Antle. It’s pretty damn telling that the only thing people have against him is he likes to sleep with multiple women who are all of age but significantly younger than him. Is that a crime? Last I checked people are allowed to form consenting relationships? Polyamory is bad when Doc does it but when Joe has 3 husbands no one cares? Doc is also the only one in the series who seems to actually be doing good work to preserve tigers in the wild. His non profit actually hires forest rangers in Asia and Africa to stop poachers from killing wild tigers. Carole spends her millions in donations on petty lawsuits over petty personal grudges and moral grandstanding that objectively resulted in the reduction of well-being of hundreds of tigers. And the zoo he runs is a million times nicer and better for the animals than Joe’s or Carole’s or anyone else’s on the show. It’s word class. I guess the producers wanted us to hate everyone in the show so they pulled some punches with Joe, pulled no punches with Carole, and invented a narrative to cast Doc in a bad light. Like, for example, at the very end when they said Doc’s zoo was “raided by authorities” was really misleading because they just give you a little tidbit of information that implies he’s guilty of something when there’s no reason to believe that he is.

The big thing is adequate space and good conditions. That just can't exist in pretty much any zoo. The more mainstream and typical zoos will likely have the "good" conditions will high quality vets and resources, but they will almost never have the adequate space that these animals should have. How many of these zoos have miles of land for the animals to travel? Lifespans tend to be significantly shorter in captivity compared to the wild in general. Animals in captivity are basically humans in prison, the social and behavioral consequences are significant.

He's absolutely ruthless. Killing animals when they don't need to be killed. And no matter how you feel about him being setup by Jeff and Allen, he still went forward with that plan.

I don't think we know enough about Doc Antle to make any conclusions with him. He was accused of killing tiger cubs once they pass their useful age. If that's true, he's pure garbage too.

 

[ArGarBarGar]

Oh I can’t understand why anyone who thinks Carole didn’t kill her husband.

If my spouse went missing and left a bunch of money I’d spend it all hiring investigators to keep looking for them. Maybe they didn’t have a great marriage, fine. That doesn’t explain the fact that she, instead of grieving or trying to find her lost husband, spent her time tampering with evidence, gathering, destroying, and fabricating highly suspicious legal documents (“upon my disappearance everything goes to Carole”) to enrich herself at the expense of the rest of his family. It might be circumstantial but Kamala Harris hinted on TV that everyone knows Carole Baskins killed her husband but there just isn’t enough evidence to convict.

Isn't there a prevailing theory that her husband got involved in drug running (hence why he would turn the transponder off his jet) and when things went south the people he worked with threw him out of his plane?

 

[bleedblue1223]

Isn't there a prevailing theory that her husband got involved in drug running (hence why he would turn the transponder off his jet) and when things went south the people he worked with threw him out of his plane?

Basically everything out there is wild theories with all circumstantial evidence at best. The truth will never be known at this point.

 

[Siamese Dream]

It'll now be up there as one of the great mysteries of our time, along with JFK, Princess Diana and Maddie McCann

 

[Motte and Bailey]

Isn't there a prevailing theory that her husband got involved in drug running (hence why he would turn the transponder off his jet) and when things went south the people he worked with threw him out of his plane?

None of his planes were missing so I don’t think that’s a viable hypothesis.

 

[ArGarBarGar]

None of his planes were missing so I don’t think that’s a viable hypothesis.

I didn't say the plane crashed, that he was supposedly thrown out of one.

 

[Osprey]

Isn't there a prevailing theory that her husband got involved in drug running (hence why he would turn the transponder off his jet) and when things went south the people he worked with threw him out of his plane?

I admit that my experience of such things is mostly limited to movies like American Made, but isn't the idea that you transport the drugs alone and return alone? There wouldn't be anyone with him on the plane who could throw him out of it, and if someone had cooked up an excuse to tag along, he would've had a tricky time throwing the pilot out of one of the those cramped planes. He would've had to have also been a pilot who could fly and land the plane and, not just that, but return it safely to where it was usually parked (since none of his planes were missing). I would imagine that drug dealers would either just shoot him and steal the plane or crash it, instead.

 

[Miguel Cairo]

I don't think we know enough about Doc Antle to make any conclusions with him. He was accused of killing tiger cubs once they pass their useful age. If that's true, he's pure garbage too.

Doc was running a sex cult that preyed on young women, I think it’s safe to draw conclusions about the guy.

 

[bleedblue1223]

Doc was running a sex cult that preyed on young women, I think it’s safe to draw conclusions about the guy.

I'm not for it, but plenty are into polygamy, so if it's consensual, then go for it. I don't think we know for sure what was consensual and what wasn't though.

 

[Miguel Cairo]

I'm not for it, but plenty are into polygamy, so if it's consensual, then go for it. I don't think we know for sure what was consensual and what wasn't though.

I have no issue with polygamy itself, but from what we saw Doc was targeting young women who were sexually and romantically inexperienced. He then made them work 100+ weeks (IIRC they were paid $100 per week, but I could be conflating that with what Joe was doing).

According to the one girl he also had her live in a cockroach infested hut and basically forced her into breast enhancement, which she agreed to just to get a few days off. Until the last episodes with Jeff and the murder for hire he was the least sympathetic character for me.

 

[bleedblue1223]

I have no issue with polygamy itself, but from what we saw Doc was targeting young women who were sexually and romantically inexperienced. He then made them work 100+ weeks (IIRC they were paid $100 per week, but I could be conflating that with what Joe was doing).

According to the one girl he also had her live in a cockroach infested hut and basically forced her into breast enhancement, which she agreed to just to get a few days off. Until the last episodes with Jeff and the murder for hire he was the least sympathetic character for me.

Yeah, I think they are all garbage, just maybe there was more to his story? I'm not disagreeing with anything you are saying though, I agree with it.

 

[BHD]

Joe was really good at feeding his "friends" dumpster meat from wal mart.

Wasn't old food from Walmart used for the restaurant as well?

 

[scott clam]

Wasn't old food from Walmart used for the restaurant as well?

yep.

 

[Miguel Cairo]

Yeah, I think they are all garbage, just maybe there was more to his story? I'm not disagreeing with anything you are saying though, I agree with it.

Yeah, it’s possible the documentary was misleading on him. I think there were a few other very misleading things in the series, so Doc could be another one. Plus most of the bad shit we heard about him came from one woman who theoretically could be lying about all of it. That said, from what I’ve read from outside sources he’s not a guy I’m inclined to give the benefit of the doubt.