Thornton says Matthews should be up for the Rocket, Selke, and Hart - PART 2

[RogerR]

Every player who signs on any team is going to bring up the cup. Hell even Taylor Hall said he was going to Buffalo to win when he signed there. Facts are, Spezza would rather not play at all then play anywhere else then his hometown team. Simmonds turned down more money to play for his hometown team.

So you feel there's no dufference now compared to when the Leafs were really bad in terms of success in signing Ontario born players?

It was quite a discussion as to why Ontario players never signed with the Leafs.

 

[danpantz]

So you feel there's no dufference now compared to when the Leafs were really bad in terms of success in signing Ontario born players?

I already said there was. You're the one who is arguing that it being there hometown had nothing to do with it.

 

[RogerR]

I already said there was. You're the one who is arguing that it being there hometown had nothing to do with it.

You argued they aren't successful, so I take it as you don't think so. No playoff round wins since 2004. You argued that point I made when I said they are viewed as a top organization.

 

[danpantz]

You argued they aren't successful, so I take it as you don't think so. No playoff round wins since 2004. You argued that point I made when I said they are viewed as a top organization.

You said that it being there hometown had nothing to do with it and it was only because of organizational success. I said that that it being there hometown and the team not being awful anymore has led to more players willing to go play at home then when they were a bottom feeder.

Do you really think the hometown thing has nothing to do with it?

 

[RogerR]

You said that it being there hometown had nothing to do with it and it was only because of organizational success. I said that that it being there hometown and the team not being awful anymore has led to more players willing to go play at home then when they were a bottom feeder.

Do you really think the hometown thing has nothing to do with it?

I pointed out how bad their success was prior to the past couple of years in signing Ontario born players.

 

[FunkyPhin]

Kinda OT but I thought this would be the best place to put it, I'm so happy Thornton is succeeding in his role. I don't think anyone expected much from him, especially not playing at a PPG level in his first 9. Showing a lot of great chemistry with Matthews and Marner at 41 years of age.

 

[Gary Nylund]

Every player who signs on any team is going to bring up the cup. Hell even Taylor Hall said he was going to Buffalo to win when he signed there. Facts are, Spezza would rather not play at all then play anywhere else then his hometown team. Simmonds turned down more money to play for his hometown team.

Case closed right there IMO. Pretty funny that anyone could not understand this.

 

[RogerR]

Case closed right there IMO. Pretty funny that anyone could not understand this.

Yes because any team picking him up very likely would be worse and would end any chance at a cup...He's 37 years-old and it's his second straight year making 700K. Pretty clear why he's there.

 

[turnagainoutlaw]

He couldn't even score on the Flames backup last night.

 

[Gary Nylund]

Yes because any team picking him up very likely would be worse and would end any chance at a cup...He's 37 years-old and it's his second straight year making 700K. Pretty clear why he's there.

Just to be clear, you believe that home town is absolutely not a factor to any degree for any player signing with the Leafs, even if they say it is a factor?

 

[RogerR]

Just to be clear, you believe that home town is absolutely not a factor to any degree for any player signing with the Leafs, even if they say it is a factor?

Thornton actually says it was nota factor at all

 

[danpantz]

Thornton actually says it was nota factor at all

Not a factor at all?

He himself said it was a little bit about his family being close

"My parents are right there about an hour away or 40 minutes away. But, really, it's because of the hockey team, honestly. This team is as very, very good team. I didn't win a Stanley Cup and I think this is a great team that can do that. There's a couple of things that helped along the way, but I really, really like this team. I love the organization. It was a little bit family but mostly hockey."

 

[Gary Nylund]

Thornton actually says it was nota factor at all

You're not answering the question - hint - I wasn't asking about Thornton.

 

[RogerR]

You're not answering the question - hint - I wasn't asking about Thornton.

I have. I believe if the team was not strong he would have never signed in Toronto. Same with Spezza, Simmons. That is 100% my opinion.
Again, I'm confused this is coming up, as this was the consensus up until Tavares signed.

 

[danpantz]

You're not answering the question - hint - I wasn't asking about Thornton.

Doesn't matter. Even Thornton himself said that his family being close was a part of it. Even if it's a small part, it's still a part and definitely not "not a factor at all"

 

[RogerR]

Doesn't matter. Even Thornton himself said that his family being close was a part of it. Even if it's a small part, it's still a part and definitely not "not a factor at all"

And if the team stunk he never signs with the Leafs.
Let me take a wild guess, Dubas gets 0 credit for these fantastic signings?

 

[danpantz]

And if the team stunk he never signs with the Leafs.

That's true, but that's not the argument, or the question you refuse to answer.

 

[RogerR]

That's true, but that's not the argument, or the question you refuse to answer.

Why would Ontario born players NOT sign when the team was bad?

 

[danpantz]

Why would Ontario born players NOT sign when the team was bad?

Because no one wants to play for a bad team.

I'm going to ask you the question one last time since you keep refusing to answer it or try to deflect by asking something else or moving the goal posts.

Do you think, despite direct quotes from the players themselves and reports stating otherwise, that playing for their hometown team had "no factor at all" in them signing with their hometown team?

 

[RogerR]

Because no one wants to play for a bad team.

I'm going to ask you the question one last time since you keep refusing to answer it or try to deflect by asking something else or moving the goal posts.

Do you think, despite direct quotes from the players themselves and reports stating otherwise, that playing for their hometown team had "no factor at all" in them signing with their hometown team?

Exactly. That's why they signed.

And can you stop acting like I'm refusing to answer your question? I have multiple times. It's simply not the answer you want. They signed with the Leafs because of a shot at the cup.

The quotes from players seem very secondary to winning a cup. Based on their quotes

 

[NK94]

Soon after Toronto plays against a mediocre NHL team Mathews doesn't put any points

It's easy to put points against Ottawa and Vancouver as you can see from the stats.

Ottawa and Vancouver have let goals against about as much as (5 teams) Colorado, Vegas, Boston, Minnesota and Tampa bay combined

You do know Matthews leads the league in 5v5 goals since 2016-17 and scored 47 last year, right? Hell, he still managed to pot 34 in a 2017-18 season where he missed 20 games due to injury.

No? Figures.

 

[danpantz]

Exactly. That's why they signed.

And can you stop acting like I'm refusing to answer your question? I have multiple times. It's simply not the answer you want. They signed with the Leafs because of a shot at the cup.

The quotes from players seem very secondary to winning a cup. Based on their quotes

LMAO. I have to hand it to you. You really don't budge. You'd rather not believe the words out of the mouths of the players themselves then to admit you were wrong when you claimed that playing for their hometown had nothing to do with them signing there.

 

[Sidney the Kidney]

I think we know Kamicola's new username.

 

[Gary Nylund]

I have. I believe if the team was not strong he would have never signed in Toronto. Same with Spezza, Simmons. That is 100% my opinion.
Again, I'm confused this is coming up, as this was the consensus up until Tavares signed.

Fair enough. I'm 100% sure you're wrong and it's bizarre to me you don't see that but hey, we're all entitled to our opinions.

Don't be confused about Tavares, there's no need. Of course quality of team is a part of it, few players want to play for a crappy team. Home town is a part of it too though so now that the Leafs are good, some players who grew up here want to play here. And that's why Spezza would retire if he couldn't play here (just the most obvious example).

No need to respond, we'll just agree to disagree here.

 

[Gary Nylund]

Exactly. That's why they signed.

And can you stop acting like I'm refusing to answer your question? I have multiple times. It's simply not the answer you want. They signed with the Leafs because of a shot at the cup.

The quotes from players seem very secondary to winning a cup. Based on their quotes

What you don't seem to get is that "secondary" factor is still a factor. You basically refuted your own argument, nicely done.