THN Prospect Rankings

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craig1

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go pierre hedin said:
I don't see why Kahnberg's not in the top 50... possibly because of age?

Neither of the others deserve to be there.


If this list is for those who have not played in the NHL (from my other posts, you can tell that a lot have played in the league, with others who have played in the league being left off) I think Cam Ward would be around 30 to 35. I can see quite a few people on this list that I would take Ward before.
 

leafaholix*

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craig1 said:
If this list is for those who have not played in the NHL (from my other posts, you can tell that a lot have played in the league, with others who have played in the league being left off) I think Cam Ward would be around 30 to 35. I can see quite a few people on this list that I would take Ward before.
Yeah, I wouldn't put him that high.

Maybe between 50-70.
 

evman150*

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Ryan Kesler at #14?

Kesler is the definition of plugger. I'm surprised he's in the top 50. I'd take almost every guy on the list ahead of him.

I don't know if I like Nystrom at 50. I believe Tim Ramholt to be a much better prospect, but that's just my opinion. I'm not a fan of pluggers like Nystrom and Kesler.
 

ginner classic

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Interesting list...I'm very surprised to see Kesler at 14...heck, I'm surprised to see him in the top 40 at all.

I could not agree more. I have not been all that impressed by him in the NHL so far. Have to remember the guy was just drafted but other than what he did in the WJC I cannot see why he has risen from his draft ranking. I certainly would not place him ahead of Stewart. What the heck do I know though?
 

kasper11

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craig1 said:
He was sent down nearly 2 weeks ago! 2 weeks is a long time to make corrections before going to press.

All that they would need to do is insert him where they arbitrarily feel he belongs, than move every one down one spot, bumping #50 off the list. This was probably done in Excel or a similar program to make it easy to make changes as it is. It would have taken 10 minutes to debate and make the changes....assuming the debate on where to rank MAF lasted 9 minutes and 50 seconds.
The list is a poll of gms/scouts. Fleury was probably not included then.
 

Pachoo

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craig1 said:
The point being, they need to be consistent. If they see the league, they are off the list, or make it under 22, or whatever! You could make the argument about injury for Horton as well...or for MAF for being back in Juniors. There is no consistency!

If the list were best players under 22, Kovalchuk and Nash would be 1, 2. The whole list would be full of guys already playing in the NHL.

I think the list is very good. If a guy has played more than 5 or 6 games in the NHL, he didn't make the list. So no Fleury, Staal, etc, but Michalek who only has been in like 4 games. What is wrong with that? Makes sense to me.
 
FacelessButcher said:
name that stuck out for me as well ahead of Maxime Ouellet and Anton Babchuk? :lol: that's got to be a joke. Anthony Stewart > Mike Komisarek? nope. Looks very heavily influenced by WJC's.

I guess I'll be the first to defend Anthony Stewart (I know Hockeycrazed is quietly waiting to have the last laugh).

Stewart brings a whole bunch of things to the table, and the WJC's was his coming out party. Drives hard to the net, hard to knock off the puck, hard shot, hard forechecker, offensively creative, skates extremely well for his size, and gives everything to the game. I don't see why that makes him a bad selection, especially at an under-rated 17. IMO he's ahead of Upshall, Kesler, and Grigorenko at the very least.
 

Vagrant

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Flames Draft Watcher said:
For consistency purposes? They put the prospects they think are the best outside of the NHL. I'm not sure what your point is, are you suggesting they'll give at least one spot to each NHL team?

Ward vs. Harding. Just a question but maybe the quality of their linemates might have played into their stats and accomplishments? As for being drafted lower, we all know that doesn't mean anything in the end. Krahn was drafted higher than either of them but you don't see any Calgary fans complaining about that. "Almost" winning a spot is also quite irrelevant.

I don't really see any insanity in this case. Have you watched a lot of both Harding and Ward and take exception because you really think Ward is the better goaltender or are you just defending your prospect because he's your prospect?

I've seen both a fair bit, but obvioulsy i've seen Ward more due to the fact that he's a prospect of the Hurricanes and i've been able to watch him compete against the other goaltenders in our system like Rob Zepp, Patrick DesRochers, Danny Boisclaire, and Kevin Weekes. There were stretches in that time that Cam played better than all of them, even as an 18 year old in camp. He's a calm, relaxed, positional goaltender with a fantastic glovehand and i've seen a lot more out of him that would lead me to believe that he's a legitimate NHL goaltender than i've seen out of Josh Harding. While Josh is a great prospect, there was a reason that Cam Ward was taken in the first round and Harding wasn't.

Red Deer is a much stronger team, yes. They boasted prospects like Jeff Woywitika and Dion Phaneuf in the past few years, but that doesn't tell the whole story. Cam, at times, carried that Red Deer team on his back for stretches with outstanding saves and consistant play. He even led them to the Championship and was named WHL goaltender of the year. He's more accomplished, more decorated, and considerably more ready for NHL action, as I alluded to with my comment about him almost making the team out of camp. I hardly see how that comment is irrelevant due to the fact that a 20 year old goaltender making the team would have been quite the accomplishment considering the depth we have at that position in the minors.

As for my comment about "consistancy purposes", lists like these usually like to include a prospect from every team just to show that they are in fact recognizing the teams exist. Cam would have given TSN and "easy out" if you will. It's just pretty obvious that the TSN crew didn't care to have any Hurricanes prospects because either they have a vendetta against the Hurricanes for knocking out Toronto and Montreal a few years back, or they simply don't cover the Hurricanes enough to know who is doing what. Maybe that is just my bitterness about having all our prospects exempt from the list, though. Homerism tends to get us all at some point. :p

I'd think that Cam Ward would make anybody's short list of prospect goaltenders. In 8 out of 10 occassions, most would prefer Ward. It's just too bad that the two of ten were the ones that made the list. ;)
 

Rabid Ranger

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evman150 said:
Ryan Kesler at #14?

Kesler is the definition of plugger. I'm surprised he's in the top 50. I'd take almost every guy on the list ahead of him.

I don't know if I like Nystrom at 50. I believe Tim Ramholt to be a much better prospect, but that's just my opinion. I'm not a fan of pluggers like Nystrom and Kesler.


That's the problem, Kesler shouldn't be limited to the "plugger" label. Comparisons have been drawn to Trevor Linden, who was an excellent player in the NHL for a long time. Kesler has a nice size, nice wheels, is defensively responsible, and has shown a much more refined game offensively than previously thought. He's an excellent prospect.
 
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Caniacforever said:
Not one single Carolina Hurricane. No Cam Ward, Magnus Kahnberg, Tomas Malec, Danny Richmond, or Mike Zigomanis. You would think that they would at least put one of those guys on the list for consistancy purposes. But I just simply can't understand Cam Ward being under Josh Harding on every one of these lists. He was drafted lower, Cam won WHL tender of the year at a younger age, and he stats are just out of this world. I don't see how a goaltender at the age of 20 that almost won a job out of camp wouldn't make the top 50 list of prospects. It's just insane.

Josh Harding is higher on the list than Ward for a good reason. Harding has developed better, and at the moment, is the better of the two. Ward plays for a very strong Rebels team, and while doing well, it's pretty hard for a goalie to struggle in Red Deer. Harding played for a very weak Regina Pats team, and now a struggling Brandon Wheat Kings. Hockey Canada thought Harding was better, as he went off to Finland. Also, I don't think Regina even won a game while Harding was out, and if they did, it was one or two. Ward could leave and the difference would be nowhere as collossal.

I could care less if Ward was drafted lower and he won the WHL tender of the year before. Harding's the better goalie now. Lindros was drafted higher than Forsberg, and he won the Hart before Foppa. Do you think Lindros is the better player because of those things? I thought not.
 

Vlad The Impaler

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Flames Draft Watcher said:
Not really all that surprising when we just had what was considered the strongest draft in the last decade is it? Those guys should jump ahead of most of the weak 2002 draft class.

I completely agree. Traditionally, the lists are a bit too weighted in favor of "fresh faces" but this year as an exception, I think the crop we just had is *deserving* of that.

The 2003 draft was unbelievable.
 

TheBrew

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man who does these things in 2001 Rita was #1 so i hope people dont put to much merit into these things
 

Vlad The Impaler

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TheBrew said:
man who does these things in 2001 Rita was #1 so i hope people dont put to much merit into these things

Exactly. The rankings are not to be taken too seriously. I like some of the rankings but others are crappy, as usual for THN.

I also find the criteria for the rankings strange. Guys like Nedorost and Komisarek are on the list while Fleury isn't.
 

thestonedkoala

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You know what? Yeah Harding wasn't taken in the 1st round, Ward was also a bottom 1st rounder too, much of that was a gamble. A lot of good goalies came out of the late 1st, to early to mid second round.
 

evman150*

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Rabid Ranger said:
Trevor Linden, who was an excellent player in the NHL for a long time.

I don't think Nuck fans will like that.

:p

As for Kesler, I've watched basically every game he's played in the nhl and I have not been impressed at all. I don't think many canuck fans have been either.
 

paul99

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Rabid Ranger said:
That's the problem, Kesler shouldn't be limited to the "plugger" label. Comparisons have been drawn to Trevor Linden, who was an excellent player in the NHL for a long time. Kesler has a nice size, nice wheels, is defensively responsible, and has shown a much more refined game offensively than previously thought. He's an excellent prospect.

Kesler was one of the leaders of the U18 US team who won gold 2 years ago in Slovakia. So he was in Finland at the last WJC. I had the chance to see him play in Finland. I also talked to him. Great player, very brilliant off the ice. IMO, he deserves this rating.
 

Rabid Ranger

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evman150 said:
I don't think Nuck fans will like that.

:p

As for Kesler, I've watched basically every game he's played in the nhl and I have not been impressed at all. I don't think many canuck fans have been either.


The truth hurts sometimes..... :p Seriously though, what I meant was Linden was more of an overall threat than he is now. Now, he's used more in a defensive role, which is fine. As for Kesler, is a cup of coffee at the NHL level enough to determine his long term future? I don't think so. Clearly though, he has the confidence of the coaching staff, and the players (in particular Linden) have been positive about him.
 
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