World Cup: Third-Place Play-off: Belgium vs. England, 7/14/2018

member 305909

Guest
There is more optimism than usual for England regarding the future. For most of the players of the current squad their best years are still ahead.

Having said that, it is more than likely that none of them in their lifetime get anywhere near the world cup-final as they did this year.
 

NyQuil

Big F$&*in Q
Jan 5, 2005
95,348
59,259
Ottawa, ON
I don't watch or know much about soccer (football) but I did enjoy watching this world cup.

My question is, with how popular the game is in England and high expectations (it seems), though I do here the "England being England" phrase why is it that they continually disappoint.

Watching the English games, it seems to me they don't have the drive the teams they're playing do, though it has to be more than just that.

For a hockey comparison, you can substitute the Toronto Maple Leafs for England and it’s pretty similar.
 

Nalens Oga

Registered User
Jan 5, 2010
16,780
1,053
Canada
f***ing Gareth Southgate. I knew this would be a loss as soon as I saw that starting line-up. Jones, Delph, Dier, Sterling in the middle instead of the wing again, etc.

More concerning than the line-up though is just how they play in general. They play like the poorly coached German team in this World Cup but they have a better striker and set-pieces. Same problem of not using their speed/countering or having off the ball movement but instead relying on possession football where they push high up the field and have no creativity so it results in an aimless cross.
 

Eisen

Registered User
Sep 30, 2009
16,737
3,101
Duesseldorf
****ing Gareth Southgate. I knew this would be a loss as soon as I saw that starting line-up. Jones, Delph, Dier, Sterling in the middle instead of the wing again, etc.

More concerning than the line-up though is just how they play in general. They play like the poorly coached German team in this World Cup but they have a better striker and set-pieces. Same problem of not using their speed/countering or having off the ball movement but instead relying on possession football where they push high up the field and have no creativity so it results in an aimless cross.
We saw that the moment they were trailing against Croatia. Nothing but high balls in the box. That being said, that team is still young and has room to grow. I wouldn't be so negative now. That's England's best result since 1990.
 

nickp91

Registered User
Jun 29, 2011
722
627
Great tournament for Belgium Thought Roberto Martinez did a good job with this team
 

gary69

Registered User
Sep 22, 2004
8,181
1,602
Then and there
****ing Gareth Southgate. I knew this would be a loss as soon as I saw that starting line-up. Jones, Delph, Dier, Sterling in the middle instead of the wing again, etc.

More concerning than the line-up though is just how they play in general. They play like the poorly coached German team in this World Cup but they have a better striker and set-pieces. Same problem of not using their speed/countering or having off the ball movement but instead relying on possession football where they push high up the field and have no creativity so it results in an aimless cross.

There's no way Southgate can justify keep on picking Sterling as a striker in the future. No team can win if one of their forwards has as bad a record as his.
 

davemess

Registered User
Apr 9, 2003
2,894
236
Scotland
England main downfall at the moment is that they are trying to play in a similar style to what Spurs & Man City are using........ but they don't have an Eriksson, Silva or a DeBruyne to pull the strings.

The balance of the team isn't right for me, asking Ali & Lingard to be half a midfielder each doesn't equal a 2nd midfielder in the team. You cannot get away with having 1 midfielder which is what England tried to do for most of this tournament.

Going forward you only pick 2 of 3 from Ali, Lingard, Sterling and you find somebody else to play central midfield alongside Henderson.

Its ironic considering how much failure England had during their time but what would you give at the moment to be able to put a Scholes, Gerrard or even Lampard alongside Henderson in a midfield two.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Stray Wasp

TheMoreYouKnow

Registered User
May 3, 2007
16,385
3,412
38° N 77° W
I find Alli and Lingard playing the roles they play to be sort of perplexing. It says they are midfielders, but I don't know if they actually do much of what you'd normally expect a midfielder to do. And to be honest, this is a problem that goes back and was one of the reasons Lampard/Gerrard always failed as well.

It feels like in the continental game, if a midfielder gets the ball he looks around and he's thinking "where do I put the ball next" and he will probably play it to another midfielder in his vicinity and so forth. In the English game, it seems like the midfielder's role is to push the ball forward himself or to hit a ball forward next. The concept of football as a chess match does not seem to have taken hold in the English game in spite of all those foreign Premier League managers.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Stray Wasp

tobo

Registered User
Jun 28, 2011
2,564
20
And after this match, our window of opportunity has closed. I just don't see us make it this far in 2020 or 2022 without a huge influx of defensive talent.
 

Alklha

Registered User
Sep 7, 2011
16,875
2,751
Really glad Belgium at least got third, particularly for the 4 lads I remember from the Genk youth teams.

As for England... I don't want to be too critical. The fans should enjoy the run they had. Those involved in the setup need to see that the biggest progress they had at this tournament was winning a penalty shootout and getting that monkey off their back. The thing that would concern me is whether or not Southgate can see significant progress as a manager with so few international games.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Stray Wasp

Alex Jones

BIG BOWL 'A CHILI!!
Jun 8, 2009
33,488
5,940
Conspiratron 9000
I find Alli and Lingard playing the roles they play to be sort of perplexing. It says they are midfielders, but I don't know if they actually do much of what you'd normally expect a midfielder to do. And to be honest, this is a problem that goes back and was one of the reasons Lampard/Gerrard always failed as well.

It feels like in the continental game, if a midfielder gets the ball he looks around and he's thinking "where do I put the ball next" and he will probably play it to another midfielder in his vicinity and so forth. In the English game, it seems like the midfielder's role is to push the ball forward himself or to hit a ball forward next. The concept of football as a chess match does not seem to have taken hold in the English game in spite of all those foreign Premier League managers.

Neither one of them are really traditional midfielders. To me the problem is Southgate trying to fit players where they don't actually play. Alli is really closer to a striker than a midfielder, and Lindgard is a winger, not someone who should be playing centrally. They are both more useful players when played in their actual position as compared to forced into a more traditional midfield role. In a more sensible world Kane and Alli would have started up top, with Alli dropping deeper somewhat behind Kane, and Sterling/Lindgard coming off the wings.

I think I said before the start of the tournament that the biggest loss for England this season was Lallana, who was the best and most elegant midfielder on the squad. Not having him was huge, and I think leaving him out was a sign of Southgate's tactical naiveté.
 

Artorius Horus T

sincerety
Nov 12, 2014
19,133
11,839
Suomi/Finland
Belgium was the best country in this world cup, one mediocre match, combined with that utter garbage France tactic
and their most likely gold changed to bronze, congrats getting bronze nevertheless.
 

Eisen

Registered User
Sep 30, 2009
16,737
3,101
Duesseldorf
And after this match, our window of opportunity has closed. I just don't see us make it this far in 2020 or 2022 without a huge influx of defensive talent.
Losing Kompany is going to hurt a lot. But the Euros are still open for him I think.
 

Evilo

Registered User
Mar 17, 2002
61,958
8,526
France
Belgium was the best country in this world cup, one mediocre match, combined with that utter garbage France tactic
and their most likely gold changed to bronze, congrats getting bronze nevertheless.
Really?
Belgium was outplayed, outshot, outchanced by both Brazil and France.
 

Venkman

Registered User
Jun 28, 2007
2,608
473
England
Neither one of them are really traditional midfielders. To me the problem is Southgate trying to fit players where they don't actually play. Alli is really closer to a striker than a midfielder, and Lindgard is a winger, not someone who should be playing centrally. They are both more useful players when played in their actual position as compared to forced into a more traditional midfield role. In a more sensible world Kane and Alli would have started up top, with Alli dropping deeper somewhat behind Kane, and Sterling/Lindgard coming off the wings.

I think I said before the start of the tournament that the biggest loss for England this season was Lallana, who was the best and most elegant midfielder on the squad. Not having him was huge, and I think leaving him out was a sign of Southgate's tactical naiveté.

Lallana was left out because he only started 3 games all season, wasn't fit enough. Lingard can play centrally, like he did for United most of the season. But it was further forward than he did for England. Agree about Alli but then there's no pace through the middle.
 

member 305909

Guest
Belgium may still be a tough nut to crack in the euros in two years time but after that this golden generation will be past its prime and Belgium may fall back to mediocrity.
 

Ad

Upcoming events

Ad

Ad

-->