GDT: There's a game at 7 pm vs Vancouver... something something

DuncanMacpherson

Registered User
Apr 6, 2010
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We're bringing back the same team next season. They'll take one more stab at it with Sutter full time in what should be a weaker Pacific division compared to the Canadian.. if that's even possible. In the mean time we'll f up our draft position this year and let Van get a better shot to draft higher.
Sounds like a recipe for long term mediocrity
 
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DFF

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Feb 28, 2002
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I know there's nothing the team can do but this is really embarassing to be playing meaningless regular season games while the playoffs start tonight and both teams aren't in lol. It's like going to a tournament and playing for 10th place while the gold medal game is on the sheet next door.

but I have more integrity going for 10th than you winning gold?
 

Villella McMeans

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Just because the vets go out doesn't mean we're throwing games. We were already a sub .500 team with them in the line-up. They've had their chance to impress and most of them made of a mess of it over a period of months. They can set their pride aside and view the game from upstairs while we see what we have with some of the younger guys

I agree that playing rookies doesn't always mean throwing games, and I'd like to see more rookies play too, but I like to believe that now that Sutter is here he's going to do whatever he thinks is best long term for this team and not be ashamed of it - he must think that Ritchie Nordstrom Stone etc will be here next year and want to use these last games to prepare for next year somehow, or that he wants to at least win the first game against Vancouver before testing rookies, who knows?
 

Villella McMeans

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but I have more integrity going for 10th than you winning gold?

Well, integrity is doing what is right and honorable no matter how embarrassing no matter what others say or do.

So, if winning gold in future means doing things now you normally would not do, then integrity is questionable.

Like Buffalo blatantly losing all those years to get high draft picks in order to try to win in future - even if they win cup soon that is why I don't like current system of rewarding losing with any sort of benefits such as higher draft picks.

I don't want to believe anyone or any team I support to want to lose for any reason - even to get McJesus or etc in future.
 
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BobColesNasalCavity

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Oct 15, 2016
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Well, integrity is doing what is right and honorable no matter how embarrassing no matter what others say or do.

So, if winning gold in future means doing things now you normally would not do, then integrity is questionable.

Like Buffalo blatantly losing all those years to get high draft picks in order to try to win in future - even if they win cup soon that is why I don't like current system of rewarding losing with any sort of benefits such as higher draft picks.

I don't want to believe anyone or any team I support to want to lose for any reason - even to get McJesus or etc in future.
We haven't played with integrity all year but now with 3 nothing games left we're going to play for it and cost ourselves a good position in the draft?
 

OvermanKingGainer

#BennettFreed #CurseofTheSpulll #FreeOliver
Feb 3, 2015
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Well, integrity is doing what is right and honorable no matter how embarrassing no matter what others say or do.

Integrity only means something if everyone has it.

No successful team in North American pro sports has ever said they kept their integrity intact.

20 years from now no one will be talking about the integrity of the Calgary Flames. They'll be talking about the multiple cups of the Penguins, Blackhawks and probably Avalanche
 
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Dack

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Jun 16, 2014
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We haven't played with integrity all year but now with 3 nothing games left we're going to play for it and cost ourselves a good position in the draft?
Well not really... we've already cost ourselves the good position in the draft. We're almost 100% picking 11th or 12th.
 
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Some Other Flame

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Dec 4, 2010
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Sometimes I wonder if people have gone so far in that they've forgotten that this is all just business entertainment. Like, where was the integrity when the organization was threatening to move if the city didn't fund them a brand new arena plus prime land for development? Where's the integrity in signing UFA's like Domingue or developing players like Philips for years and then never giving them the opportunity to show what they can do in a game? The same special posters on here constantly whine about doing things that'll drive away players from signing here but are those not examples of doing just that? Who would ever want to sign with an organization that lacks the basic integrity and honor to live up their commitments?

And this may come as a shock to some of the more juvenile members on here but if there's one thing Murray Edwards has repeatedly and consistently shown to care about it, it's money, not winning or integrity or any of that idealized fantasy.

But let's cut the BS and call a spade a spade - none of this is principled, it's really just all about instant gratification. Regardless of any potential payoff down the road, uncompetitive hockey is no fun right now and that's all that matters - escaping the right now. But that's hard to say so instead lets go with integrity and honor and all that BS because it'll make it more palatable.
 
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Volica

Papa Shango
May 15, 2012
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Integrity only means something if everyone has it.

No successful team in North American pro sports has ever said they kept their integrity intact.

20 years from now no one will be talking about the integrity of the Calgary Flames. They'll be talking about the multiple cups of the Penguins, Blackhawks and probably Avalanche

It doesn't even take that long man.

Forget 20 years, the Browns have been a f***ing terrible franchise in the NFL for decades with a few hopeful seasons here and there... They had 1 good year, and now when people talk about the Browns they talk about them being a top 5/6 Super Bowl contender rather than a joke franchise since 1990. Sports has a short memory.

f*** this integrity thing. Haven't we had enough of this bullshit with this franchise?

Guys, seriously. ZERO top 3 picks in Calgary franchise history. Zero.

It blows my mind that people haven't been able to put together that consistent contenders have multiple top picks playing on the same team? Instead they'll point to the Blues (guess what, they had a top pick and used it in a trade tree that got them key parts of their cup) or Boston (casually forgetting that they had a top 2 pick playing on that team, albeit a small role, and that one of the greatest defenders in the NHL all-time decided he was going to Boston in his prime; which happens all of never for Calgary) as teams that did it the 'right way'.

No one remembers that shit. We laughed at Edmonton for 10 years for being terrible. Now they have the best player on the planet by an absolute mile, and likely with a tiny bit of competence will be a contender for the next 5-10 years. Where are we?

The premise is clear what Calgary needs to do:
  1. Trade and expose, at minimum, Gaudreau, Monahan and Giordano.
  2. Be terrible for one or two years.
  3. Add 2 of the following: Wright, Savoie, Bedard or Mitchkov
  4. Enjoy as these value picks (Pelletier, Zary, Mangiapane, Dube) get to join these top tier talents and you see Calgary start being a major contender for the next 15 years.
 

Mobiandi

Registered User
Jan 17, 2015
20,841
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The funniest thing about competing and wanting the team to give 100% is that the Flames clearly didn't give a shit when the games mattered.

Geoff Ward might not have had enough of a reputation to handle this monstrosity we have in Calgary, but if the players actually cared we wouldn't have been blown out multiple times by awful teams like the Sens and Oilers. We wouldn't have had to cling to hope that our mortal enemies would take care of our business for us so we could have a marginal chance of making the playoffs.

It's time this team distances themselves from all these low-character players and starts turning over the page with these upcoming youth players. And it starts with meaningless games like these, which are meaningless because our vets couldn't take care of business
 

Villella McMeans

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May 3, 2021
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We haven't played with integrity all year but now with 3 nothing games left we're going to play for it and cost ourselves a good position in the draft?


Well, I don't agree Calgary didn't have integrity all year or before being eliminated from playoffs, but either way it never too late to have integrity.

Drafting higher is obviously very desirable, that is why I don't agree that the reward of drafting higher should be given for losing - hopefully the leagues figure out a better way to manage draft position in the future.

With 3 or any amount of games left, I can't imagine wanting my team to lose for any reason - including drafting higher.

That's just me, everyone is different.
 

Villella McMeans

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May 3, 2021
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Integrity only means something if everyone has it.

No successful team in North American pro sports has ever said they kept their integrity intact.

20 years from now no one will be talking about the integrity of the Calgary Flames. They'll be talking about the multiple cups of the Penguins, Blackhawks and probably Avalanche


Respectfully disagree. If everyone had integrity it wouldn't be valued as much, like if it was so commonplace like rocks on the ground then it isn't rare and appreciated.

Like if everyone was good then goodness wouldn't be as appreciated. It's the rarity of anything that makes it more remarkable and appreciated. Like if diamonds were as common as rocks found in the streets, diamonds would not be more expensive than rocks.

So, because not everyone has integrity, it more important than ever to have it and keep having it.
 

DFF

Registered User
Feb 28, 2002
22,275
6,525
Well, integrity is doing what is right and honorable no matter how embarrassing no matter what others say or do.

So, if winning gold in future means doing things now you normally would not do, then integrity is questionable.

Like Buffalo blatantly losing all those years to get high draft picks in order to try to win in future - even if they win cup soon that is why I don't like current system of rewarding losing with any sort of benefits such as higher draft picks.

I don't want to believe anyone or any team I support to want to lose for any reason - even to get McJesus or etc in future.

Is it integrity to win meaningless games with guys that you know should be replaced if you want to win or try different things to see what you need to do to have the best chance of winning when it counts?

To me integrity is do what is best for your team moving forward. These are truly meaningless games.

I could argue the NHL has no integrity playing these games
 
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TheHudlinator

Registered User
Nov 21, 2011
28,822
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Victoria,BC
Giving the kids a chance for a week isn't trying to lose its trying to see if we have someone that can help us lose less often next season. There is a massive difference between calling up an echl team for the year to try and get first overall and giving guys like Dube, Mangiapane, Valimaki, Kylington larger roles to help make decisions this offseason. Play the kids let the veterans that we can't afford to have a nagging injury this offseason start their offseason and let's get this sad last week over.
 

Villella McMeans

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Is it integrity to win meaningless games with guys that you know should be replaced if you want to win or try different things to see what you need to do to have the best chance of winning when it counts?

To me integrity is do what is best for your team moving forward. These are truly meaningless games.

I could argue the NHL has no integrity playing these games


We both have different thoughts of what integrity is, you see these last games as meaningless because we missed the playoffs, while I see these last games as less important because we already missed the playoffs - but not completely meaningless because I enjoy seeing my team win games and be happy about winning, I also find value in seeing how each player improves or not as each game is played. Would I like to see the rookies play more, of course, but the coach decides that and I trust Sutter while others don't trust him as much to make the right decisions to ensure the team improves.

It's possible that because of what Sutter is doing now will have positive effects next year, we'll just have to wait and see.

About integrity and not even playing any more games if eliminated from the playoffs, I don't agree at all.

I remember when Iginla got traded so he could win a cup, I like Iginla no matter what - cup or no cup, whatever team he goes to.

But I'll always regret that he didn't choose to stay and retire in Calgary instead of try for the cup, to me I value a player more when they spend their entire career with one team - there are less players that spend entire career with one team than the are players who have won the cup, so it's more rare than winning the cup and also to me these players have more integrity than Marleau Thornton hasek Hull etc who all wanted to go to stacked teams to help them win. It's turning into the NBA where all the players try to go to the same team to manufacture cups.

Last thing about integrity that is not related to this thread, I saw hasek in line at Bank of Montreal in Chinatown here before a game, asked for autograph and he said he doesn't give them - something meaningless of him but meaningful for me, fate allowed me to see him as an asshole, and to me as someone with no integrity as he wasn't getting any benefit giving things away for free.

So I guess I see integrity as doing what you're supposed to do no matter what, not only doing it when you're getting benefits.
 
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DFF

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Feb 28, 2002
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We both have different thoughts of what integrity is, you see these last games as meaningless because we missed the playoffs, while I see these last games as less important because we already missed the playoffs - but not completely meaningless because I enjoy seeing my team win games and be happy about winning, I also find value in seeing how each player improves or not as each game is played. Would I like to see the rookies play more, of course, but the coach decides that and I trust Sutter while others don't trust him as much to make the right decisions to ensure the team improves.

It's possible that because of what Sutter is doing now will have positive effects next year, we'll just have to wait and see.

About integrity and not even playing any more games if eliminated from the playoffs, I don't agree at all.

I remember when Iginla got traded so he could win a cup, I like Iginla no matter what - cup or no cup, whatever team he goes to.

But I'll always regret that he didn't choose to stay and retire in Calgary instead of try for the cup, to me I value a player more when they spend their entire career with one team - there are less players that spend entire career with one team than the are players who have won the cup, so it's more rare than winning the cup and also to me these players have more integrity than Marleau Thornton hasek Hull etc who all wanted to go to stacked teams to help them win. It's turning into the NBA where all the players try to go to the same team to manufacture cups.

Last thing about integrity that is not related to this thread, I saw hasek in line at Bank of Montreal in Chinatown here before a game, asked for autograph and he said he doesn't give them - something meaningless of him but meaningful for me, fate allowed me to see him as an asshole, and to me as someone with no integrity as he wasn't getting any benefit giving things away for free.

So I guess I see integrity as doing what you're supposed to do no matter what, not only doing it when you're getting benefits.

first let me say I don’t disagree with your integrity or even your definition of it. Every one integrity is different.

what I disagree is the people saying what Sutter is doing now is for integrity. First at all there is nobody paying to see these games, I doubt if anyone even care if they win. There is really not much left for the team except to see what they have moving forward. Playing guys that won’t or shouldn’t be back is not the right thing to do. Doing what is best for the team is integrity. I am not saying they should throw the game but winning should not be the main focus. Winning in this situation is not the same as winning when it counts so can’t say it’s even a learning experience. It’s actually the opposite if they think this team can win if they win these last 4 meaningless games.
 
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Villella McMeans

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first let me say I don’t disagree with your integrity or even your definition of it. Every one integrity is different.

what I disagree is the people saying what Sutter is doing now is for integrity. First at all there is nobody paying to see these games, I doubt if anyone even care if they win. There is really not much left for the team except to see what they have moving forward. Playing guys that won’t or shouldn’t be back is not the right thing to do. Doing what is best for the team is integrity. I am not saying they should throw the game but winning should not be the main focus. Winning in this situation is not the same as winning when it counts so can’t say it’s even a learning experience. It’s actually the opposite if they think this team can win if they win these last 4 meaningless games.

I agree that winning now is not the same as other situations, we have different views on what Sutter is doing now, you are more critical of him while I have more trust in his methods.

I know most don't think many of the vets should be here next year, I disagree - and maybe Sutter believes that the vets will return next year too so he's playing them so they know what to expect next year.

Specifically, I hope Stone Lucic Ritchie Nordstrom and Nesterov are all here next year - Ritchie is slow but as 4th liner is good enough, Nordstrom and Nesterov both give lots of effort, if Nesterov can stand up McJesus like he did before that be good. Stone has been effective plays strong and I like his taking lots shots especially on power play.

Personally, I'd like to see them play Rinaldo more, he's tough and fast - on 3rd or 4th line he'd be good.

The team plays noticeably better under Sutter, that's what I've noticed, short passes along the boards and safer plays - less exciting for others but I'm fine with it. So I'm very hopeful for next year, and I'll still watch every game as I always do, I've even gone to preseason games - so every game has some interest for me, even if most don't care anymore.

One thing I can't stand is the team play when we pull goalie, we're horrible and can't even control play - I'm used to old days when our goalie wouldn't be pulled until we are deep the their zone with full control of puck, but now every team pulls goalies before puck even dropped.
 

Unlimited Chequing

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