Theo Fleury Versus Luc Robitaille

[DitchMarner]

Just vote for the better player, taking into account peak, prime, longevity, talent, accomplishments, awards etc.




Bracket A:



LeClair (4-3: defeated Nolan, Amonte, Brind'Amour and Roberts; lost to Mogilny, Fleury and Tkachuk in round one. 3-2: defeated Weight, Damphousse and Kovalev; lost to Elias and Robitaille in round two.)
Naslund (4-2: defeated Bondra, Bertuzzi, Kovalev and Demitra; lost to Alfredsson and Elias in round one. 2-3: defeated Palffy and Weight; lost to Mogilny, Shanahan and Fleury in round two.)

Palffy (4-1: defeated Bondra, Nolan, Demitra and Damphousse; lost to Robitaille in round one. 2-3: defeated Kovalev and Weight, lost to Naslund, Alfredsson and Brind'Amour in round two.)
Elias (4-1: defeated Hejduk, Naslund, Tkachuk and Recchi; lost to Alfredsson in round one. 3-2: lost to Fleury and Shanahan, defeated LeClair, Damphousse and Bondra in round two)

Fleury (4-0: defeated Kovalev, Marleau, Roberts and LeClair in round one. 3-2: defeated Elias, Bondra and Naslund; lost to Hossa and Shanahan in round two.)
Robitaille (4-0: defeated Hossa, Palffy, Recchi and Brind'Amour in round one. 2-2: lost to Shanahan and Alfredsson, defeated Mogilny, LeClair, received a bye in round two.)

Mogilny (4-3: defeated Whitney, LeClair, Marleau and Tkachuk; lost to Recchi, Shanahan and Hossa in round one. 2-3: defeated Kovalev and Naslund, lost to Robitaille, Alfredsson and Brind'Amour in round two)
Bondra: (4-3 defeated Nolan, Hejduk, Whitney and Demitra; lost to Palffy, Naslund and Kovalev in round one. 3-2: defeated Damphousse, Brind'Amour and Zhamnov, lost to Fleury and Elias in round two.)

Brind'Amour (4-3: defeated Weight, Damphousse, Bertuzzi and Koivu; lost to Kovalev, Robitaille and LeClair in round one. 3-2: defeated Zhamnov, Palffy and Mogilny; lost to Bondra and Hossa in round two)

*Receives a bye




Players who have advanced to the next round:


Shanahan (4-0: defeated Tkachuk, Recchi, Hossa and Mogilny. 4-0: defeated Robitaille, Elias, Naslund and Fleury in round two.)

Alfredsson (4-0: defeated Naslund, Hejduk, Elias and Marleau in round one. 4-0: defeated Hossa, Robitaille, Palffy and Mogilny in round two.)

Hossa (3-2: defeated Recchi, Tkachuk and Mogilny, received a bye; lost to Robitaille and Shanahan in round one. 4-1: defeated Fleury, Brind'Amour Kovalev and Damphousse; lost to Alfredsson in round two)



Eliminated players:


Nolan (0-4: lost to LeClair, Bondra, Palffy and Whitney)
Allison (0-4: lost to Zhamnov, Tanguay, Yashin and Smyth)
Recchi (1-4: defeated Mogilny; lost to Shanahan, Robitaille, Hossa and Elias)
Amonte (1-4: defeated Gagne; lost to LeClair, Hejduk, Roberts and Whitney)
Gagne (1-4: defeated Smyth; lost to Amonte, Zhamnov, Yashin and Tanguay)
Bertuzzi (1-4: defeated Whitney; lost to Roberts, Marleau, Naslund and Brind'Amour)
Smyth (1-4: defeated Allison; lost to Roberts, Gagne, Whitney and Weight)
Hejduk (2-4: defeated Amonte and Tanguay; lost to Elias, Alfredsson, Bondra and Kovalev)
Tanguay (2-4: defeated Allison and Gagne; lost to Marleau, Weight, Hejduk and Zhamnov)
Roberts (3-4: defeated Smyth, Bertuzzi and Amonte; lost to Fleury, Marleau, Koivu and LeClair)
Tkachuk (3-4: defeated Demitra, LeClair and Weight; lost to Shanahan, Hossa, Elias and Mogilny)
Yashin (3-4: defeated Allison, Gagne and Zhamnov; lost to Demitra, Koivu, Damphousse and Weight)
Whitney (3-4: defeated Smyth, Nolan and Amonte; lost to Bertuzzi, Mogilny, Bondra and Zhamnov)
Koivu (3-4: defeated Yashin, Zhamnov and Roberts; lost to Weight, Damphousse, Demitra and Brind'Amour)
Marleau (3-4: defeated Tanguay, Bertuzzi and Roberts; lost to Fleury, Alfredsson, Mogilny and Damphousse)
Zhamnov (4-3: defeated Allison, Gagne, Tanguay and Whitney; lost to Demitra, Koivu and Yashin in round one. 0-4: lost to Brind'Amour, Weight, Damphousse and Bondra in round two.)
Weight (4-3: defeated Koivu, Tanguay, Smyth and Yashin; lost to Brind'Amour, Damphousse and Tkachuk in round one. 1-4: lost to LeClair, Kovalev, Naslund and Palffy; defeated Zhamnov in round two.)
Damphousse (4-3: defeated Koivu, Weight, Yashin and Marleau; lost to Brind'Amour, Kovalev and Palffy in round one. 1-4: defeated Zhamnov; lost to Bondra, LeClair, Elias and Hossa in round two)
Kovalev (4-2: defeated Damphousse, Brind'Amour, Bondra and Hejduk; lost to Fleury and Naslund in round one. 1-4: defeated Weight; lost to Palffy, Mogilny, Hossa and LeClair in round two.)

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[Flamesjustwin]

It is Fleury quite easily.

 

[JackSlater]

Fleury was more dynamic and certainly looked better, but at some point Robitaille's actual production has to outweigh that.

 

[FireItup]

Fleury was more dynamic and certainly looked better, but at some point Robitaille's actual production has to outweigh that.

Well actually, no. Fleury averaged more points per game then Robitaille.
Player Comparison Finder | Hockey-Reference.com

 

[Hockey Outsider]

That's because Fleury retired at age 34, while Robitaille played 307 games past that age (which lowered his per-game average). If you compare them through age 34, Robitaille is well ahead (1.10 PPG vs 1.00 PPG), while missing fewer games.

Robitaille has 9 of the top 13 seasons between them (based on where they ranked in the scoring race each year). I agree with JackSlater, there are some positives in Fleury's favour but Robitaille was so much more productive that he should be ranked ahead.

 

[DitchMarner]

Voting ends tomorrow night.

 

[feffan]

That's because Fleury retired at age 34, while Robitaille played 307 games past that age (which lowered his per-game average). If you compare them through age 34, Robitaille is well ahead (1.10 PPG vs 1.00 PPG), while missing fewer games.

Robitaille has 9 of the top 13 seasons between them (based on where they ranked in the scoring race each year). I agree with JackSlater, there are some positives in Fleury's favour but Robitaille was so much more productive that he should be ranked ahead.

Context is needed. For example Fleury led his team in scoring 7 seasons. Robitaille 6 seasons. And Fleury didn´t get to play 6 seasons with prime Gretzky. So even if Robitaille could drive his own offense, his raw point totals and PPG are obviously inflated. Of course, no Gretzky and Robitaille would probably lead his team a few more times in scoring. So it goes both ways. But his PPG and point totals would probably drop. Add that Luc had almost 4 more prime years in the 80´s, while Fleurys prime more was during the DPE. Fleury a few more seasons as you count it.

In the end - to me Fleury was regarded the greater player at the time during when their primes collided. And not just for one season. For a period of 10 years. Not a completlet different level. But big enough difference to have him quite easy ahead of Robitaille even if Luc had a longer career.

 

[Hockey Outsider]

Yes, the fact that Robitaille had two more years in the wide-open eighties inflates his numbers relative to Fleury. Feel free to calculate an era-adjusted point-per-game metric if you'd like. What I find more relevant is Robitaille having 9 of the top 13 seasons between them (based on where they ranked in the scoring race each season).

I don't think Robitaille benefited much statistically by being Gretzky's teammate. He was the type of player who needed the pressure (and ice time) of being his team's best forward to excel. In his first year with Gretzky, Robitaille actually scored 13 fewer points than the year before (playing two fewer games). The only time he ever scored more goals or points than in 1988 (the year before Gretzky joined the Kings) was 1993, when Gretzky missed half the season. The next season, Gretzky returned and won the Art Ross, and Robitaille's production plummeted.

Fleury's a great player and I see some arguments in his favour. He did better in Hart voting, was a scrappier, grittier player, and was a better playoff performer. But Robitaille had a considerable edge in peak production, and that`s enough to push him ahead.

 

[DitchMarner]

Robitaille wins and moves on.