The Vegas Golden Knights Have Added an Entire 1st Line in Just 9 months

[blinkman360]

People a retconning hard over Vegas, because almost everything Vegas touched turned to gold in ways even Vegas wasn't expecting. That is very unlikely to be repeated. Seattle should be setting their sights ones Vegas' original plan, try and build a decent team that doesn't get blown out of the building every night while building through the draft on a longer term 3-4 plan before competing for the playoffs.

Let's go back and look again. Vegas were not even expected to make the playoffs going into their first year. McPhee went into the draft intending to build for the future, trade players at the deadline etc. When asked if he thought the team would have turned out this good, McPhee's own words "No. We sure worked hard at this. We were as well organized as a group could be, and the objective was to be as good as we could be. No one expected this."

Let's take a look at Vegas' expectations. without the modern retconning

The Hockey writers had them at #31.


The NHL.com writers had them missing the playoffs.
TSN had Vegas a 31st.
TSN's "bold prediction/hot take" was Vegas not finishing 31st.
ESPN had them at 31
CBS had them at 30.
USAtoday had them shockingly high at #25!
ETC

HFBoards expectations were no different, Vegas would suck.

No one would expect an expansion team to make the playoffs, let alone the Cup finals. That still doesn't mean Seattle shouldn't expect to pick up some young quality NHLers through the expansion draft that they can build around while stocking up on high draft picks. Vegas would have a stacked system right now if they weren't this good out of the gate - they just realized their window opened immediately so they cashed in on some futures to improve their odds.

Even if Seattle ends up lower 3rd out of the gate, that just means they'll have the prospect system that Vegas doesn't. They'll get their top-5 pick in year one, plus a couple more firsts and seconds that year I'd imagine, and maybe even some extra first and second rounders the following year.

Just looking at my team - the Isles - they'll probably end up having to leave a defenseman like Pelech or Mayfield unprotected. Maybe even a guy like Cizikas depending on how some of the youth develops from now until then. I'm sure many other teams will have guys like that available as well. Seattle will have their choice between those players or kids trying to crack the lineup(for the Isles, guys like Ho-Sang, Dal Colle, Bellows). Probably young "backup" goaltenders with #1 upside who are just blocked on their current team as well.

So yeah, while that most likely won't yield anywhere near the immediate results that Vegas has experienced, it will still be a pretty damn good situation to be in. One with a lot of hope for that fanbase.

 

[Kotkaniemi15]

I don't disagree at all.

It is a good quality to know when you've made a mistake, and to do what is in your power to correct that mistake, even if it risks illuminating that mistake in the short term.

Although, I wouldn't argue that McPhee got value for Tatar. I think that Tatar had negative value when dealt to MTL. MTL would have probably still done a 2nd+Suzuki for Pacioretty if the Tatar to VGK trade never happened.

It was still a good move to know when to cut bait to clear that cap space and move on.

Tatar became amazing for MTL though. He had a better year than Pac and the Habs got Suzuki and a 2nd. Bad move for VGK.

 

[Finlandia WOAT]

If they tried to "rebuild" at the start, they'd be 2-3 (and I think 2 is very kind) years out before they were a respectful hockey club,

GMGM going all in right now. It paid off beyond his wildest dreams last year, the time to go for it and be embarrassingly bad later is now.

What's scary is, McPhee and Gallant may have bought enough time that they'll be around after Vegas gets around the inevitable talent crunch from investing everything now.

 

[LeHab]

Yep and I think a lot has to do with him not being the go to guy that he was in Mtl! He’s the same like Kessel an awesome complimentary scorer but not someone to carry the load

Pacioretty was a very streaky player in Montreal - 5 goals in 5 games then 10 dry. Good guy but should definitely not be counted on to carry a team.

 

[LeHab]

Tatar became amazing for MTL though. He had a better year than Pac and the Habs got Suzuki and a 2nd. Bad move for VGK.

Sounds to me like a good move for both teams. Vegas got short-term support while Tatar is fitting very nicely in Montreal. Time will tell if Suzuki amounts to anything.

 

[Disappointed EP40]

Not many teams have the kind of assets (draft picks and prospects) that Vegas has. I mean, they can even afford to overpay like they did in the Pacioretty deal, give a lot of prospect depth, and still keep a very deep prospect pool.

The NHL wanted them competitive from year 1 and they made the expansion draft rules in consequence. That doesn't make GMGM a genius though.

To credit the process and not the people here is a joke.

If you tell me out of 10 times, how many teams would be build the way the Knights are the answer would be one.

Full marks for shrewd moves when needed, taking risks when needed, and putting together this team. I can tell you Jim Benning wouldn't have put together half the team this is with the expansion rules.

And if you think Seattle is going to be competitive out the gate like Vegas, I'd bet against it.

 

[Disappointed EP40]

Trade him away then

wtf kinda stupid logic is this ? if he's the fourth best player, trade him?

what are you even on about

 

[Kotkaniemi15]

Sounds to me like a good move for both teams. Vegas got short-term support while Tatar is fitting very nicely in Montreal. Time will tell if Suzuki amounts to anything.

Not really. Pac had a meh season. The Habs got a player better than Pac plus Suzuki and a 2nd. Bergevin fleeced GMGM.

 

[Windy River]

People complain about their depth all the time and fans/media talk about how hard it is to acquire high end forwards.

Vegas has gone out and added 3 players who coincidently happen to be their 3 best forwards since July.

Props to GMGM.

Pacioretty - Stastny - Stone are absolutely fantastic to watch in all three zones.

People complain about Vegas’ depth? I know it’s early days for them as a club, but I thought they were already known for having pretty much nailed down the ‘high performing team without superstar power’ thing...

 

[CupInSIX]

Pacioretty has been 10x more useful in 3 games than Tatar was through 4 playoff rounds last year.

Vegas will have an extremely hard time rebuilding eventually because theyre trading 75% of their picks and prospects

Not quite.

 

[Channelcat]

Still living off all those assets acquired in the expansion draft. The system is far too generous now.

 

[McXLNC97]

Crazy that they are exempt from the Seattle expansion. That was a masterful negotiation.

Well they ain't getting any expansion money from Seattle, so that's what they had to settle for.

 

[Uncle Scrooge]

I can't make myself give GMGM as much credit for the expansion draft as some people do.

When a hockey fan like myself makes a mock draft in 2 hours, and ends up having over 50% of the players they picked right, that tells you their job was pretty easy. And they had an entire staff working on it all year long.

And even the trades that you couldn't predict, were non-brainers for the most part. I mean, is there an easier position to make a trade than what Vegas had? Teams were going to lose something anyway, so by default Vegas was going to win all the trades with the only exception of passing on a good player to trade for a worse one. Which they didn't do.

But what i give GMGM a ton of credit for, is how well he recognized changes have to be made and that he can't just sit back and feel good with a team that had 90% of it's players see career years.

Last years Vegas team could be down 3-0 to the Sharks right now if im being honest - if they even make the playoffs. Dodged a bullet with Neal, Haula been hurt all season (and even if he was healthy he's probably back to playing like a 3rd liner if you look at last years playoffs and start of this season), Karlsson line turned from a line that carried this team to your typical 2nd line. Fleury wasn't as dominant and the team didn't work nearly as hard as they did last year.

But here they are, in the playoffs and looking like a strong team. And the line he went out and put together is a huge reason why.

I mean, it's easy to attract players to Vegas right now because who wouldn't want to play there. So in that sense it's not been difficult for GMGM. But you still have to be aggressive to get things done.

 

[TomasHertlsRooster]

Pacioretty was a very streaky player in Montreal - 5 goals in 5 games then 10 dry. Good guy but should definitely not be counted on to carry a team.

Way different. Kessel was the best player on his line in 2016. Pacioretty is the 3rd best player on his line with Vegas.

 

[Grigowski]

29 other teams could have acquired Stone but they didn't.

Wrong. There´s something called salary cap. So no, 29 teams would´ve loved to get Stone, but a few were able too.

 

[CookiesAndMilk]

How can you not love a team which has Flower as its #1.

I was skeptical about that franchise at first. Who would have thought that this whole thing will work out the way it did? They play icehockey in a f***ing desert. Yet they field some of my favourite players (Fleury, Marchessault, Stone, Smith) and it's really hard for me to not like them. Don't get me started on Gallant, always thought he is a fantastic coach.

So here I am and have to agree, that they do great work all around. I'm just wishing my Oilers could pull off the same thing once.

 

[MAHJ71]

... said the guy with a cannon in his avatar.



(I'll show myself out)

haha, well played

 

[nbwingsfan]

It already has. Signing Stone put them over next years cap. Plus they still need to resign William Karlsson in addition to 2 more players to get them to the minimum roster size. To sign Karlsson and fill a full 23-man roster, they will need to shed close to $10 million in AAV.

It will be a tough off season but it shouldn’t see a big change for them. Smith seems like an obvious one to go. A $5M cap hit isn’t a huge take for most teams looking for depth but also is not a huge loss for Vegas either. I can’t see Karlsson looking for much more than what he already got this season too.

Adding Gusev/Glass should take off a lot of the pressure from losing players as well.

 

[Empoleon8771]

It has already been addressed, but I really don't see how people still think the lottery was giving too much to the Knights. The Knights got as much as they did because teams lined up to do stupid things to protect players they didn't want to give up. Vegas got off as well as they did because about 6 teams made bad deals with Vegas that ended up fantastic for the Knights. Those 6 teams resulted in Vegas getting Smith, Marchessault, Haula, Tuch, Theodore, Gusev, Karlsson, Stone (from Brannstrom, who was picked with the Islanders 1st rounder) and Pacioretty (from Suzuki, who was picked with Winnipeg's 1st rounder via the Columbus deal). You can even include the Penguins deal which got the Knights Fleury, although I think they were going to take Fleury regardless of the deal. Carrier was also taken as a part of a deal, although that deal was so small that I think you can basically disregard it.

Looking at their team right, Vegas "only" got Schmidt, Miller, McNabb, Eakin, Nosek, Bellemare, Merrill and Engelland purely from the expansion draft. Everyone else was a result of either free agency, waivers, expansion draft deals or other trades. Would Vegas be as good had they not made the deals with Anaheim, Minnesota, Columbus, NYI and Florida? Almost definitely not.

 

[bert]

Tatar became amazing for MTL though. He had a better year than Pac and the Habs got Suzuki and a 2nd. Bad move for VGK.

Yeah looks terrible for them right now!

 

[holy]

Well he is a top goal scorer (top 10 since 2012) in this league. It's just unfortunate that Montreal fans turn agaisnt their players like it's nothing.

Man, don't blame the fans for what happened there. He shouldn't have been made captain. It's a management issue.

Good for him, though. Knew he'd have an alright time on a good team. He's done well with crap before.

 

[WhatTheDuck]

He’s a Panarin level talent

Stone > Panarin

 

[ReginKarlssonLehner]

The fact that they'll likely be adding Glass and Gusev next season is quite scary.

Erik Karlsson, too.

 

[PurpleMouse]

Looking at their team right, Vegas "only" got Schmidt, Miller, McNabb, Eakin, Nosek, Bellemare, Merrill and Engelland purely from the expansion draft. Everyone else was a result of either free agency, waivers, expansion draft deals or other trades. Would Vegas be as good had they not made the deals with Anaheim, Minnesota, Columbus, NYI and Florida? Almost definitely not.

100%. It's amazing how much teams gave Vegas for basically no reason. Teams were given the chance to make deals with Vegas before the draft and seemingly felt obliged to just because they could.

Someone should do a mock of what Vegas would look like just picking guys in the draft and not any side deals.

I think they're success is equal parts favourable draft rules, good management for Vegas, and bad management in the rest of the league. Two of those factors make Vegas competitive, but take away any one of them and they aren't a Cup contender.

 

[CauZuki]

Man, don't blame the fans for what happened there. He shouldn't have been made captain. It's a management issue.

Good for him, though. Knew he'd have an alright time on a good team. He's done well with crap before.

Oh please , we've been critical of him way before he was named captain , casperetty and all that...
Mostly it was his style of play that changed after the Chara injury , he remodelled his game to be less effective in terms of puck retrieval and became a more "efficient" sniper.
At one point he was saying that running around the ice is not always the most effective way of doing things and some took that as a shot towards Gallagher.