The PP...scheme or personnel?

[BobbyJet]

Every team uses different systems/schemes for their PP. They all have different strategies, different strengths, and different weaknesses.

I get sick and tired of hearing out-of-town commentators comment about how Hawks should have a great PP with the personnel they have. It's been going on for quite a while and tells me the biggest problems are with the systems used and the players employed. Keith at the point being the prime example but over the years we have seen less talented guys like Kopecky and Shaw who had no business being out there. They had net presence sure but not the skill to finish. Talented players can't play on the perimeter all night, even on the PP, and expect results in the NHL.

 

[ChiHawks10]

I get sick and tired of hearing out-of-town commentators comment about how Hawks should have a great PP with the personnel they have. It's been going on for quite a while and tells me the biggest problems are with the systems used and the players employed. Keith at the point being the prime example but over the years we have seen less talented guys like Kopecky and Shaw who had no business being out there. They had net presence sure but not the skill to finish. Talented players can't play on the perimeter all night, even on the PP, and expect results in the NHL.

Who is this directed at? Who is an out of towner?

 

[Pez68]

Who is this directed at? Who is an out of towner?

He's talking about TV broadcasts. lol

 

[ChiHawks10]

He's talking about TV broadcasts. lol

Lol. Thought it said commenters. Reading too fast.

 

[LordKOTL]

The problem with the Hawks' PP is that...nobody ****ing moves.

More like welded into place...but I like the cut of your jib.

 

[jls24]

Just heard Scotty Bowman on NHL radio and he brought up the terrible pp last year. Then he said something about "the next coach" and a more modern system.

 

[RememberTheRoar]

Just heard Scotty Bowman on NHL radio and he brought up the terrible pp last year. Then he said something about "the next coach" and a more modern system.

Interesting. Can someone find a transcript or link to the audio?

 

[BK]

Just heard Scotty Bowman on NHL radio and he brought up the terrible pp last year. Then he said something about "the next coach" and a more modern system.

Interesting.

 

[hawksfan50]

But it takes no genius to figure out that any PP qb who shoots 1% is an idiot for putting that player at the point on the Po..it cannot happen. ..yet stubborn Q keeps giving Keith the feature time on the #1 unit.. You cannot keep failing and not make changes or remove the problem... Keith has had plenty of ioprtunity on the porch for several years now and it is a disaster. ..Somebody else Must be given the chance to run it and fire the bomb that get to the net ..not get blocked or miss the net..

Q refuses to believe Keith is no longer what he once was...It would help if Q took away his position minutes and instead demanded Keith defend better by actually confronting puck carriers instead of attempting weak stic-cjrvk waives as they get NY him and to our net ..

 

[BobbyJet]

But it takes no genius to figure out that any PP qb who shoots 1% is an idiot for putting that player at the point on the Po..it cannot happen. ..yet stubborn Q keeps giving Keith the feature time on the #1 unit.. You cannot keep failing and not make changes or remove the problem... Keith has had plenty of ioprtunity on the porch for several years now and it is a disaster. ..Somebody else Must be given the chance to run it and fire the bomb that get to the net ..not get blocked or miss the net..

Q refuses to believe Keith is no longer what he once was...It would help if Q took away his position minutes and instead demanded Keith defend better by actually confronting puck carriers instead of attempting weak stic-cjrvk waives as they get NY him and to our net ..

Ironically, Keith was shooting well in the preseason. At times he looked like he turned back the clock 5 years in that regard. Hopefully, that will continue but you can bet that Q will continue with DK on the #1 PP unit. If he returns to the old Keith our PP will suffer. On the other hand I am looking forward to seeing Seabs. He was definitely looking more confident and quicker in preseason.

 

[BK]

Ironically, Keith was shooting well in the preseason. At times he looked like he turned back the clock 5 years in that regard. Hopefully, that will continue but you can bet that Q will continue with DK on the #1 PP unit. If he returns to the old Keith our PP will suffer. On the other hand I am looking forward to seeing Seabs. He was definitely looking more confident and quicker in preseason.

Maybe he learned from Boqvist and HJ? I am kind of not kidding.

 

[Pez68]

Just heard Scotty Bowman on NHL radio and he brought up the terrible pp last year. Then he said something about "the next coach" and a more modern system.

Lol.... Scotty is great. Gives no f***s.

 

[bobbythebrain]

Will joker get a chance on the 1st unit PP?

 

[hawksfan50]

Scotty B. sees there is a problem...but Q let it fester for 3 seasons refusing to bench Keith off that role ..and Hawks Gans had to witness so many point shots get blocked or miss the net...No coach should be so loyal to any vet that long when therevisv0bvious failure to do the role tasked...

Now wexarex4xoected to believe Keith will "rebound"...Rebounding to play better defense than -29 from last season is possible perhaps by simple attitude change ...Keith focusing and willing to compete a lot harder..so yes that is possible ..But becoming an elite PP qb point such that the Hawks become a dominant and scarey PP is much much harder to believe can happen. ..How will Keith get his shots through and on target ? Simple Will and want is not gonna make it happen if there is no evidence of the ability to get shots through and with accuracy on target either to beat goaluescnoutright outright or at least create a lot more rebound chances...If you cannot get your shot through iron net enough of the time....that D point is going to be pretty useless to make your PP have a decent chance of success.

Q has to give another guy a chance to be THE GUY at the point on the PP...

 

[LordKOTL]

Will joker get a chance on the 1st unit PP?

I hope so, but who knows. Lat year he was mobile, had a quick pass and wrister from the point, and could hit a 4x6. He looked very conservative and tentative this preseason though.

 

[pvr]

I disagree. You just need to setup the ****ing PP correctly, with SHOOTING OPTIONS. The Hawks setup is so predictable, because you only ever have two possible shooting options. This is a great video that shows the large majority of Washington's PP goals have little net front presence. They pretty much never have a guy just standing around in front of the net. They are scored because the puck is constantly moving, and every guy on the ice can take a one-timer.....

That’s it in a nutshell. Hawks just stand around. There also was a Bruins sequence where they didn’t score but there were a bunch of opportunities because everyone was moving. Creats confusion on defense...hard to keep track of everyone and players get open.

 

[JaegerDice]

Joel Quenneville has had some of the deepest rosters in the league at his disposal, and short of a few sh% spikes, has never managed to ice a PP that was better than mediocre (as measured by shot and chance generation per 60 minutes of 5v4 ice time).

It's entirely systems driven, and at some point people in the media will surely have to stop making excuses for him and pinning it on assistant coaches.


All that said, a strong PK is faaaaaaaaaaar more important than a strong PP, so if I had to choose a point of emphasis, it would be the PK.

 

[Pez68]

There's a time and a place for the drop pass. The issue the Hawks have is.....they only ever have two guys come back into the zone to regroup.... Their forwards are typically standing still at the opposing blue line. You HAVE TO MOVE UP ICE AS A UNIT. Their struggles on the power play are actually an extension of their struggles gaining the zone at even strength.

Most teams run a 1-3 PK. Meaning they stack their blue line and have one rover in the neutral zone.

1) The D should be leading the PP breakout from behind his net.
2) You should have two forwards back in the zone, in addition to your other "D" in front of your net. These forwards need to be LOW in their zone. Not standing around at the ****ing blue line. Because they are moving up the ice with the guy carrying the mail.(This should be Joker and Gus, on EVERY SINGLE POWER PLAY). The guy carrying the puck has to be a guy who is a threat to lug it all the way into the zone.
3) You setup like this, and typically you won't have ANY forecheckers coming into your zone to pressure, because they can get burned and caught way too easily. It relieves pressure and gives you a clean breakout.
4) All three guys leave at the same time. Timing is key. You pick a side, and that's the side you attack. The guy lugging the puck is forcing their rover to commit to him, and then hitting one of the wingers moving up ice with him. The other "defenseman" on the ice is a safety valve, coming up behind your puck carrier. The last forward on the ice is spreading out their 3 defenders on the blue line, and looking to cut through them.

This isn't rocket science. This is the basic power play breakout we ran when I coached HIGH SCHOOL, and it's still the breakout that a large majority of NHL teams run.

 

[Panzerspitze]

There's a time and a place for the drop pass. The issue the Hawks have is.....they only ever have two guys come back into the zone to regroup.... Their forwards are typically standing still at the opposing blue line. You HAVE TO MOVE UP ICE AS A UNIT. Their struggles on the power play are actually an extension of their struggles gaining the zone at even strength.

Most teams run a 1-3 PK. Meaning they stack their blue line and have one rover in the neutral zone.

1) The D should be leading the PP breakout from behind his net.
2) You should have two forwards back in the zone, in addition to your other "D" in front of your net. These forwards need to be LOW in their zone. Not standing around at the ****ing blue line. Because they are moving up the ice with the guy carrying the mail.(This should be Joker and Gus, on EVERY SINGLE POWER PLAY). The guy carrying the puck has to be a guy who is a threat to lug it all the way into the zone.
3) You setup like this, and typically you won't have ANY forecheckers coming into your zone to pressure, because they can get burned and caught way too easily. It relieves pressure and gives you a clean breakout.
4) All three guys leave at the same time. Timing is key. You pick a side, and that's the side you attack. The guy lugging the puck is forcing their rover to commit to him, and then hitting one of the wingers moving up ice with him. The other "defenseman" on the ice is a safety valve, coming up behind your puck carrier. The last forward on the ice is spreading out their 3 defenders on the blue line, and looking to cut through them.

This isn't rocket science. This is the basic power play breakout we ran when I coached HIGH SCHOOL, and it's still the breakout that a large majority of NHL teams run.

Now we just need to replace Quenneville's "optics" with yours...

 

[hawksfan50]

Well if a high school coach can run a pp better than Q and his staff then we need to hire a high school coach to run it and Fire Q..

It is disgusting...disgusting that any NHL team should go 4 minutes of a pp with ZERO shots on goal...it is beyond disgusting!

 

[BobbyJet]

Joel Quenneville has had some of the deepest rosters in the league at his disposal, and short of a few sh% spikes, has never managed to ice a PP that was better than mediocre (as measured by shot and chance generation per 60 minutes of 5v4 ice time).

It's entirely systems driven, and at some point people in the media will surely have to stop making excuses for him and pinning it on assistant coaches.


All that said, a strong PK is faaaaaaaaaaar more important than a strong PP, so if I had to choose a point of emphasis, it would be the PK.

We heard that tired old line from the commentators once again in last night's game ....about how a team with so much skill on the 1st PP unit can manage to be so inept with the man advantage?. And once again the poor coaching gets no mention. Meanwhile, the same commentators trip over themselves giving accolades to Q throughout the game. It's laughable.

 

[Blue Liner]

There's a time and a place for the drop pass. The issue the Hawks have is.....they only ever have two guys come back into the zone to regroup.... Their forwards are typically standing still at the opposing blue line. You HAVE TO MOVE UP ICE AS A UNIT. Their struggles on the power play are actually an extension of their struggles gaining the zone at even strength.

Most teams run a 1-3 PK. Meaning they stack their blue line and have one rover in the neutral zone.

1) The D should be leading the PP breakout from behind his net.
2) You should have two forwards back in the zone, in addition to your other "D" in front of your net. These forwards need to be LOW in their zone. Not standing around at the ****ing blue line. Because they are moving up the ice with the guy carrying the mail.(This should be Joker and Gus, on EVERY SINGLE POWER PLAY). The guy carrying the puck has to be a guy who is a threat to lug it all the way into the zone.
3) You setup like this, and typically you won't have ANY forecheckers coming into your zone to pressure, because they can get burned and caught way too easily. It relieves pressure and gives you a clean breakout.
4) All three guys leave at the same time. Timing is key. You pick a side, and that's the side you attack. The guy lugging the puck is forcing their rover to commit to him, and then hitting one of the wingers moving up ice with him. The other "defenseman" on the ice is a safety valve, coming up behind your puck carrier. The last forward on the ice is spreading out their 3 defenders on the blue line, and looking to cut through them.

This isn't rocket science. This is the basic power play breakout we ran when I coached HIGH SCHOOL, and it's still the breakout that a large majority of NHL teams run.

You all should listen to what this man has to say about the hockey.

 

[coolhand]

The pp is out of synch. Guys dump in with the others standing at the blue line, and then get beat to the puck. Either carry it in or dump it in but the wingers need to be moving not standing still. Last night the Leafs had all 4 lined up at the blue line. The Hawks should have been charging the line and dumping it in and beat them to the puck. The leafs were also pressuring the puck every chance they got, making the Hawks make quick passes, which they usually screwed up and gave the puck away.

 

[BobbyJet]

Up until last night the PP's biggest problem was the set-up, not getting the puck to net, and movement, or lack thereof.
Last night, Babcock exposed another flaw in Q's so-called PP system, the entry. By standing up at their blue line, the team's entry speed was nullified. When the Hawks did finally dump it in, the Leafs defense was on the puck first. Just an awful display.

 

[BK]

A big issue with the PP (other than the lack of movement) is that Keith doesn’t have to be respected from the point and he it not deceptive at all. When Boqvist/HJ were with PP1 it forced the PKers to spread more as they were a threat. This helped open everything up. They also had the ablitity to skate the puck into the zone while that is not really DK’s game.