The players must vote ..

[struckmatch]

That proposal was rejected. Everything goes back to square one, as they say in the business.

Just because a proposal is rejected, doesn't mean its off the table, unless the side states its off the table.

 

[SENSible1*]

That proposal was rejected. Everything goes back to square one, as they say in the business.

The NHL's position on this issue is crystal clear, scare-mongering tactics by the PA and their apologists notwithstanding.

 

[Brent Burns Beard]

If the PA agreed to negotiate cost certainty, only on the condition of meaningful revenue charing, and lowered UFA age, the league would be more than willing to agree to that. All the players have to do is concede a salary cap, and then the owners will basically give them lowered UFA, and meaningful revenue sharing.

if the owners were at all willing to share meaningfull revenue then they wouldnt make the claim that a luxury tax "doesnt work".

it "doesnt work" for them because a luxury tax with teeth is revenue sharing and a luxury tax without teeth is not cost certainty.

dr

 

[hockeytown9321]

NFL has a different labour supply. Rosters are much larger which gives teams the option to screw down wages. There are more players available to fill out rosters, in the NHL once you get down below NHL level there is big drop off.

NFL teams have different team needs. There is no equivalent QB position in the NHL (possible exception of goalie). How much would an elite QB get if they were on the field for 40% of the time their team has the ball and reserve QBs took up the other 60%? Even Mario and Wayne had to leave the ice and let other lines take over the scoring.

Despite this the Vick ($130m/10 years, $13m/y) and Manning ($98/7 years, $14m/y) only take up about 17-18% of their teams $80m+ budgets. $14/y out $80m

Who is going to pay Pronger $10m out of a $35m budget? That's 28-29% of budget. That blows away whatever Vick and Manning are getting in percentage terms and, no offense to Pronger, QBs are much more vital components of their teams than #1 D. Pronger is just another cog, a good cog, but still just a cog.

OK, then. What about the NBA, which also has a cap? Superstars still get tons of money there. Even Memhet Okur got $50 million from Utah, and he's no superstar.

 

[me2]

OK, then. What about the NBA, which also has a cap?

1. Larry bird rule.
2. Luxury tax.
3. Plenty of other exemptions.

None of which exist under Bettman's proposed hard cap.

Superstars still get tons of money there.

Superstars will still get plenty in the NHL, just less than they used to.

Even Memhet Okur got $50 million from Utah, and he's no superstar.

Reap what you sow.

 

[struckmatch]

if the owners were at all willing to share meaningfull revenue then they wouldnt make the claim that a luxury tax "doesnt work".

it "doesnt work" for them because a luxury tax with teeth is revenue sharing and a luxury tax without teeth is not cost certainty.

dr

No, the main reason they don't want a luxury tax because it isn't a FIXED relationship between expenses and revenues. They want to guarantee a portion of their revenues to players, and they don't want a lot of fluctuation in that, and what teams spend on their respective payrolls.

IMO, its not unfair at all for the players to ask the opwners to help themselves as well. If the owners didn't accept that bargain, that the players would consider cost certainty only if meaningful revenue sharing took place, they'd be idiots.

 

[Brent Burns Beard]

No, the main reason they don't want a luxury tax because it isn't a FIXED relationship between expenses and revenues. They want to guarantee a portion of their revenues to players, and they don't want a lot of fluctuation in that, and what teams spend on their respective payrolls.

IMO, its not unfair at all for the players to ask the opwners to help themselves as well. If the owners didn't accept that bargain, that the players would consider cost certainty only if meaningful revenue sharing took place, they'd be idiots.

well then they are idiots. NYR, TOR, BOS, PHI, and DET do not want to share meaninng revenue with CRL, NSH, EDM and PIT so they would not be suporting Bettmans lockout if thats what teh result was going to be.

DR

 

[hockeytown9321]

Superstars will still get plenty in the NHL, just less than they used to.

Which is my point. Superstars will still get a ton of money, and teams will have less to give everyone else. Everyone else suffers more becuase of the cap. A cap hurts everyone who is a not a superstar. The original post about the players refusal of a cap said its about protecting guys like Pronger. Its not.

 

[eye]

Which is my point. Superstars will still get a ton of money, and teams will have less to give everyone else. Everyone else suffers more becuase of the cap. A cap hurts everyone who is a not a superstar. The original post about the players refusal of a cap said its about protecting guys like Pronger. Its not.

The big name agents make 90% of their income from 10% of their clients. Agents and Goodenow care more about the 10% elite than they do about the 90% minority. Goodenow is the kind of person that will not swallow his pride and compromise unless players pick up the phone and insist that he compromises.

 

[hockeytown9321]

The big name agents make 90% of their income from 10% of their clients. Agents and Goodenow care more about the 10% elite than they do about the 90% minority. Goodenow is the kind of person that will not swallow his pride and compromise unless players pick up the phone and insist that he compromises.

So why aren't the players picking up the phone? Has Goodenow had all of their phones disconnected?

 

[djhn579]

So why aren't the players picking up the phone? Has Goodenow had all of their phones disconnected?

Goodenow has an answering system on his phone...

"If you are a NHLPA players representative, please enter your 37 digit security access code now..."

"If you are not a players representative, but are a player, please press 1 now..."

After pressing 1...

"If you would like to hear words of encouragement from the union leaders, please press 1 now..."

"If you would like helpful hints on how to insult Bettman and the owners in the press. please press 2 now..."

"If you have any other questions, please press 3 now..."

After pressing 3...

"If you would like to contribute money to the union fund, please press 1 now..."

"If you made a statement to the press that is contrary to the unions position and would like assistance clarifying your statements, please press 2 now..."

"If you have any other questions, please press 3 now..."

After pressing 3...

"If you would like to contribute to the 'Feed Modano's Dog Fund', please press 1 now..."

"If you would like to hear Mr. Goodenow sing his favorite lockout owner bashing songs, please press 2 now..."

"If you have any other questions, please press 3 now..."

After pressing 3...

"If you would like to praise Mr. Goodenow for his handling of the lockout, please press 1 now..."

"If you have a problem with how Mr. Goodenow is handling the lockout, please stand by for the next available representative..."

After waiting for 15 minutes, listening to William Shatner's greatest hits, you are transfered to a message service in some unknown middle eastern country...


(I'm sure Goodenow's got a lot more layers to his answering service...)