The Oilers when McDavid's not on the ice

[Sugi21]

I won't argue that he hasn't had his defensive lapses, but that's going to come with playing 24+ minutes a night of high-speed hockey.

Using his plus-minus against him is also invalid. The Oilers empty net GF to GA is awful. They've score 2 and allowed 10 or something like that. Not to mention McDavid is still a positive on a negative team.

He has absolutely been worth the 12.5 this year.

not to nit pick but he’s actually making $15 million this season!!!

 

[Stoneman89]

McDavid on Tampa wouldn't have 80 points... that's absurd.

McDavid playing with RNH or Draisaitl's is already incredible. It's not like McDavid is playing with scrubs.

A big reason the Colorado line has gone awesome is chemistry. Not just talent. Find someone that has chemistry with McDavid & Draisaitl or Nuge McDavid or just run Nuge McDavid Drai and while McDavid + line mates will improve but only marginally.

McDavid with Hall was terrible. Oil and water. Just didn't work as an example.

McDavid is not even close to being any type of problem on this team. There are a whole whack of guys that have not performed up to any type of standard. Reider, Lucic...etc...

 

[TB12]

Sometimes I read what people write about McDavid and I really feel we don’t deserve him in Edmonton.

Unbelievable.

 

[space321]

I question McDavid because of his gross cap hit. That's a lot of coin in one guy. Sure plus minus isn't a good stat but with the eye test it "currently" paints a poor picture for McDavids relative effectiveness.

However I am not questioning his abilities. Everyone knows he is amazing. Generational... at this exact point in time... That's actually a tough sell. So many ahead in the scoring race. So many outplaying his relative effectiveness.

If he comes back like he did last year at this point, great. But if he doesn't. That's bad.

Overall this team isnt as bad as so many make it out your be either. Right now I feel like our team is a remake of the Minnesota Wild when the only talented player they had was Marion Gaborik. A whole team coached to basically have one guy as the offensive catalyst and everyone else is coached just to clog up the game.

And as mentioned not having 3/4 of your top 4 defenders will hurt any individuals stats and eye test significantly. A true excuse for McDavid but also proving my point. One players does not make a team.

I think it's pretty obvious McDavid is "struggling" right now for whatever reason while still playing good to great hockey.

No reason to get all melodramatic and insinuate I want him traded.

I like the lines from last game. Hope Hitchcock goes back to that for at least another game. But if that doesn't work either I would love to see the big three run thier own lines. Spread the wealth out and get those guys earning thier pay.

Spooner McDavid XXX (Rattie, Zykov, Marody, whoever)
Rieder Draisaitl Chaison
Kharia Nuge Puljujarvi
Lucic Brodziach Kassian

Force McDavid to earn his pay and equally important get all 4 lines at a point where they can contribute. Play more as team.

Wow lol you're basically wrong on every single point you're trying to make...

First of all, the Wild team under Lemaire absolutely SUCKED. They made one miracle run and that's it. It's funny how you use that team as a comparison to say this current roster is not as bad as some think. When in fact it really is just that bad.

Second, is it reasonable to expect McDavid to lead the scoring race with his pathetic supporting cast? Outside of Draisaitl (maybe RNH) there isn't a single player on this roster than can compliment McDavid's play. Look at the leading scorers and you'll notice the trend where they have a consistent set of good teammates (including defensemen) who are capable to generating offense. Frankly it's amazing that McDavid has scored as much as has so far.

As for his defensive play, I have to disagree again. He's prone to losing coverage in the defensive zone, but he's elite at backchecking and stick checking. By my eye test, he's very effective at forcing turnovers or straight up taking away pucks from other players on the backcheck. He loses his man in front of the net sometimes, but to me that's a small price to pay to have a player of his calibre. +/- is a horrible stat to use to judge defensive effectiveness, more often than not it's his linemates/defense pairing's fault that the puck doesn't get out of our zone and ends up in our net.

 

[space321]

not to nit pick but he’s actually making $15 million this season!!!

When people say make ____$$, it's a colloquial term for cap hit, because salary doesn't matter, it's the cap hit that counts. Just so you know.

 

[Beerfish]

McDavid has long stints where he forgets to play two way hockey.

As an impact player he is far less effective than people here will ever admit. He is barely a positive player this year through almost half the year. With 52 points in the bank and typically always playing with Nuge or Draisaitl thats pretty bad.

He played this way last for stretches but finished extremely strong two way. He is not playing as well this year overall compared to last.

I can't help but feel he lets tge scoring race muddy up his two way game sometimes. Ironically enough, to me it seems his best point production clearly happens when he is playing good two way hockey.

Not sure if its cheating or lack of awareness but the last x games he has been down right bad in his own zone.

To be fair. Nurse and Larsson are obviously struggling without Russell and Klefbom. So there is a trickle down effect from those injuries.

But! Its also fair to McDavid has not been worth his absurd 12.5 million contract this year so far. Hope he can turn it around in the new year.

What utter nonsense. He is the best player in the world being hamstrung by a team with almost zero talent around him other than draisaitl. Especially on defense that has literally no one to get him the puck. He makes guys like pat maroon and chaisson look like good offensive players.

If you are going to rake on mcdavid as you have above I'd love to see your assessment of the other top players in the game almost all of whom have way better support.

 

[McTedi]

I question McDavid because of his gross cap hit. That's a lot of coin in one guy. Sure plus minus isn't a good stat but with the eye test it "currently" paints a poor picture for McDavids relative effectiveness.

However I am not questioning his abilities. Everyone knows he is amazing. Generational... at this exact point in time... That's actually a tough sell. So many ahead in the scoring race. So many outplaying his relative effectiveness.

If he comes back like he did last year at this point, great. But if he doesn't. That's bad.

Overall this team isnt as bad as so many make it out your be either. Right now I feel like our team is a remake of the Minnesota Wild when the only talented player they had was Marion Gaborik. A whole team coached to basically have one guy as the offensive catalyst and everyone else is coached just to clog up the game.

And as mentioned not having 3/4 of your top 4 defenders will hurt any individuals stats and eye test significantly. A true excuse for McDavid but also proving my point. One players does not make a team.

I think it's pretty obvious McDavid is "struggling" right now for whatever reason while still playing good to great hockey.

No reason to get all melodramatic and insinuate I want him traded.

I like the lines from last game. Hope Hitchcock goes back to that for at least another game. But if that doesn't work either I would love to see the big three run thier own lines. Spread the wealth out and get those guys earning thier pay.

Spooner McDavid XXX (Rattie, Zykov, Marody, whoever)
Rieder Draisaitl Chaison
Kharia Nuge Puljujarvi
Lucic Brodziach Kassian

Force McDavid to earn his pay and equally important get all 4 lines at a point where they can contribute. Play more as team.

Wow!! Describing McDavid as a "struggling" player needing to be forced to earn his pay is a total troll job. He is arguably the best player in the league and we don't deserve him.

 

[McTedi]

not to nit pick but he’s actually making $15 million this season!!!

I would argue he is better value at that amount than his entire team with the exception being Chiasson.

 

[Aerchon]

Lol.

Apparently a lot of people on here don't deserve McDavid. If... If he leaves after his contract is up, a lot people are going to be relieved they don't have the pressure of being this guy's fan anymore.

Seriously people. Some of the responses here read like I insulted your significant other rather than critiqued a professional hockey player. It's not even like I said he was bad. Just not as good as I would like for the cap hit he makes in comparison to the players currently outperforming him.

 

[talitintti]

McDavid's +/- at even strength (minus empty net situations) is +10.

He keeps on dominating the goal differential in a team that gets dominated in goal differential when he's not on ice. Edmonton has outright been the best team in the league for the last three seasons when McDavid is on the ice, and one of the worst when he's not.

 

[McTedi]

Lol.

Apparently a lot of people on here don't deserve McDavid. If... If he leaves after his contract is up, a lot people are going to be relieved they don't have the pressure of being this guy's fan anymore.

Seriously people. Some of the responses here read like I insulted your significant other rather than critiqued a professional hockey player. It's not even like I said he was bad. Just not as good as I would like for the cap hit he makes in comparison to the players currently outperforming him.

If it was warranted I guess, you are way off base though and McD quite likely wins the same awards as last year.

 

[Aerchon]

If it was warranted I guess, you are way off base though and McD quite likely wins the same awards as last year.

Kind of my point. If the awards were handed out today he would get zero hardware while getting paid the most by a significant margin. While playing on a line and a PP with legit nhl talent.

McDavid is good. McDavid is great. But he is paid to be the best and he currently is not.

Not trolling. Apologies for poking this sore subject.

 

[talitintti]

McDavid is good. McDavid is great. But he is paid to be the best and he currently is not.

He's 4th in scoring after 35 games. Your point would be better if he was 20h or 30th, but chances are he wins every available award if he scores the 121 points he's on pace for.

He's not ever going to outperform the field through every 35 game stretch so you cannot end up but dissapointed in him if that's what you expect.

 

[The Hound]

Sometimes I read what people write about McDavid and I really feel we don’t deserve him in Edmonton.

Unbelievable.

Closet Leafs and Cansucks fans

 

[GOilers88]

Lol.

Apparently a lot of people on here don't deserve McDavid. If... If he leaves after his contract is up, a lot people are going to be relieved they don't have the pressure of being this guy's fan anymore.

Seriously people. Some of the responses here read like I insulted your significant other rather than critiqued a professional hockey player. It's not even like I said he was bad. Just not as good as I would like for the cap hit he makes in comparison to the players currently outperforming him.

So you think a players value fluctuates with the points standings? That's essentially what you've said. That you don't think he's currently worth his contract because there's five guys in the league with more points. This is exactly where he was last year. 9 points behind Kuch for league lead at Christmas. Everyone knows how that went. Here we are a year later and he's 9 points back at Christmas.

If he goes on a tear after the break like he did last year, is he suddenly worth his contract again?

Your line of reasoning is so flawed that it has to be a bad troll job.

 

[Sugi21]

I would argue he is better value at that amount than his entire team with the exception being Chiasson.

Can’t argue that and as for Chiasson he’s gotta be one of the best bang for buck contracts this season

 

[ConnorMcMullet]

not to nit pick but he’s actually making $15 million this season!!!

It's his 12.5 million cap hit that counts against the team. His actual salary is irrelevant to how much the team can spend.a

He'd still be worth 15 million though.

 

[McRpro]

Sometimes I read what people write about McDavid and I really feel we don’t deserve him in Edmonton.

Unbelievable.

Most of us don't have idiotic opinions on McDavid though.

 

[Sugi21]

It's his 12.5 million cap hit that counts against the team. His actual salary is irrelevant to how much the team can spend.a

He'd still be worth 15 million though.

I know it’s his cap hit but it’s inaccurate to say he’s making $12.5 (cap hit) this season when he’s making $15 million (real money)... hence the “not to nit pick” comment and yes McDavid is worth every penny!

 

[Shaquille Oatmeal]

Wow. McDavid bashing? Really?
He's not leading the league in scoring but he's not that far back. It's almost as if his numbers reflect how much the refs allow the other teams to cheat.

 

[pabst blue ribbon]

McDavid on the ice: oilers outscore the opposing team by a lot

McDavid off the ice: the opposing team outscores the oilers by a lot

 

[Llamamoto]

So you think a players value fluctuates with the points standings? That's essentially what you've said. That you don't think he's currently worth his contract because there's five guys in the league with more points. This is exactly where he was last year. 9 points behind Kuch for league lead at Christmas. Everyone knows how that went. Here we are a year later and he's 9 points back at Christmas.

If he goes on a tear after the break like he did last year, is he suddenly worth his contract again?

Your line of reasoning is so flawed that it has to be a bad troll job.

He's actually only 7 points behind Rantanen, with two less games played, (one less, because he missed a game).

But yeah, I agree completely with everything you said.

 

[yababy]

Against TBAY:

McDavid -3
Nugent-Hopkins -3
Adam Larsson -4
Darnell Nurse -4

Yet...
"As the (Tampa Bay) game went on we got a little bit exposed with what lineup we’re dressing right now,” said Hitchcock.

I'd say the Oilers star players got a bit exposed to just how poor they are on defence.

 

[Stoneman89]

Kind of my point. If the awards were handed out today he would get zero hardware while getting paid the most by a significant margin. While playing on a line and a PP with legit nhl talent.

McDavid is good. McDavid is great. But he is paid to be the best and he currently is not.

Not trolling. Apologies for poking this sore subject.

Your opinion. And you have the right to be wrong. Which you are in this case. He actually could have had more $$$, and it didn't happen. Without him , this team is absolute trash.

 

[oobga]

Sorry if this has been hashed out several times already (as I suspect it has), but the Oilers are obviously not good without McDavid. In fact, they're barely average at this stage with him, possibly below average.

I'm just wondering, what are the actual numbers with and without McDavid on the ice, in terms of goals for and against (I'm not into any of that silly Corsi nonsense).

@Woodguy55 has been giving a running tally





Not bad at all so far under Hitch in terms of the McDavid off numbers. Losing Klef/Russell has obviously thrown a wrench in everything though. Team has been getting hammered in terms of our share of scoring chances since those guys went down.

Tableau Public

by this 5-game rolling average we have been the worst performing team in the league for expected goals % lately. Numbers cratered starting Dec 11th when our D was decimated.