Speculation: The Official Tank Thread

[The Zetterberg Era]

I'm now officially calling this season "Slouching Standings, Hidden Tank."

I know he isn't around as much lately, but my guess is Flashy could help you with this gem of an idea.

 

[DetroitRed]

There are a lot of guys who Blashill can't seem to get to perform. And it's not just all the players on the team who come up on fire and then go into a sophomore slump under Blash. It's also two assistant captains, among several others making up about half the team. But, my god, Mrazek and Larkin. Remember them? WTF.

They are quite a ways out of the wild card race now, remembering there are like two weeks before the trade deadline. I don't like the word "tank," but I'm hoping they will now go into a more serious mode of rebuilding. It's time to sell, if possible. But I wouldn't bother to fire Blashill just yet. It's too late.

 

[Filppula]

4th. Colorado, Arizona, and Winnipeg are below us. Dallas and Vancouver are just barely ahead of us.

It's weird. It's like the entire Western Conference is trying to tank. They sure picked the wrong year for it.

Winnipeg? Since when did they sink so low?

 

[Unfriendly Ghost]

Winnipeg? Since when did they sink so low?

Looks like a 4 game losing streak.

 

[newfy]

I just think it sends a bad message to the team. Why would our players want to continue to play here when the team is basically saying they are ok with losing? A lot of our team is either tied up in long term contracts or are on ELC. I don't think wanting to lose would set right with these players.

Meh, the players didnt get the message to show up for about 3/4s of the season. Who cares what message they get. Maybe someone like Nolan Patrick can come in and give them the message that playing like **** for a whole season isnt going to happen anymore

 

[obey86]

Winnipeg? Since when did they sink so low?

They're still tanking. Only 4-6 more years of tanking for Winnipeg and they'll be a playoff team.

 

[jkutswings]

They're still tanking. Only 4-6 more years of tanking for Winnipeg and they'll be a playoff team.

Barring an offseason for the ages, going forward I'd wager that Winnipeg wins a playoff round before Detroit does. Their needs are easier to find.

 

[Bench]

They're still tanking. Only 4-6 more years of tanking for Winnipeg and they'll be a playoff team.

Right before the moved Ladd, they weren't trying to tank at all. The team just busted. You know, like the Wings are this year. Except when they busted, they decided to move on from an expensive veteran handcuff contract to a player like Ladd. The Wings tend to double down on those sorts of things.

 

[TheMule93]

They're still tanking. Only 4-6 more years of tanking for Winnipeg and they'll be a playoff team.

They're not tanking.... no team except Arizona is tanking this season.

 

[Ezekial]

The need a netminder, bad.

They're tied for 6th in GF right now, #1 in GA.

 

[obey86]

Barring an offseason for the ages, going forward I'd wager that Winnipeg wins a playoff round before Detroit does. Their needs are easier to find.

Yawn. I think it's near impossible to say where either team will be 2-3 years down the road.

 

[Heaton]

Yawn. I think it's near impossible to say where either team will be 2-3 years down the road.

Goddamn, if Winnipeg doesn't win a little bit with Wheeler, Sheifele, Laine, Ehlers etc... in the next couple years something is seriously wrong.

The Wings have... Mantha? Maybe Larkin? I'm not sure either Mantha or Larkin are better than the guys I mentioned for Winnipeg.

 

[obey86]

Goddamn, if Winnipeg doesn't win a little bit with Wheeler, Sheifele, Laine, Ehlers etc... in the next couple years something is seriously wrong.

The Wings have... Mantha? Maybe Larkin? I'm not sure either Mantha or Larkin are better than the guys I mentioned for Winnipeg.

I'm not sure why you are judging how good a team will or won't be 2-3 years down the road based on a few of the players on the team NOW. A lot can change in just a few seasons. There's an entire roster, the players have to fit together and have chemistry, have a coach that plays their style, etc. Players exceed expectations, players don't meet expectations, players get injured, a player doesnt live up to his contract, a player leaves in FA, a player comes out of nowhere and exceeds his contract, etc.

Unfortunately people around here continually fail to realize there is significantly more to putting a competitive team together than having a couple big names/high picks. Every team that is bad with a bunch of high picks is always the next big thing. More often than not people are incorrect in predicting the next great teams.

 

[obey86]

Goddamn, if Winnipeg doesn't win a little bit with Wheeler, Sheifele, Laine, Ehlers etc... in the next couple years something is seriously wrong.

The Wings have... Mantha? Maybe Larkin? I'm not sure either Mantha or Larkin are better than the guys I mentioned for Winnipeg.

I mean, looking at their roster this season Winnipeg arguably has 5-7 players better than the Wings best player. And yet they are still terrible and neck and neck with the Red Wings in the standings.

Goes to show there is much more to putting a team to gather than just slapping together a bunch of talent.

 

[Retire91]

The East was easier they said... then why are we in last ****in place lol

I hope this new arena comes with a new team

Moving to the East covered up the decline. The streak would have been long since over in the old division.

 

[obey86]

Moving to the East covered up the decline. The streak would have been long since over in the old division.

Meh, I don't know about that. The Wings are usually pretty competitive against the West compared to the East.

Even this year when the Wings are absolutely terrible they are actually 9-9-1 against the West compared to 13-15-9 against the East.

 

[Bench]

More often than not people are incorrect in predicting the next great teams.

I think you're confusing "predicting the Cup winner" with predicting great teams. People love to flaunt the unpredictable nature of the sport, as if all outcomes are equally likely because Washington, St. Louis, and Tampa haven't won a Cup. Oh goodness. Well if they can't win, why even brother getting elite talent. But they have consistently iced great teams that have had a chance to win it all.

And holy hell, where were you during all the hype trains around Chicago and Pittsburgh? Soon as Crosby/Malkin and Toews/Kane were drafted for each team it was CHOO CHOOO HYPE TRAIN ENGAGED the entire damn time. Or was that too easy to predict so it doesn't count?

 

[obey86]

I think you're confusing "predicting the Cup winner" with predicting great teams. People love to flaunt the unpredictable nature of the sport, as if all outcomes are equally likely because Washington, St. Louis, and Tampa haven't won a Cup. Oh goodness. Well if they can't win, why even brother getting elite talent. But they have consistently iced great teams that have had a chance to win it all.

And holy hell, where were you during all the hype trains around Chicago and Pittsburgh? Soon as Crosby/Malkin and Toews/Kane were drafted for each team it was CHOO CHOOO HYPE TRAIN ENGAGED the entire damn time. Or was that too easy to predict so it doesn't count?

I'm not talking about the Tampa Bays or Washingtons. Those teams have lived up to expectations more often than not. I'm talking about the Edmontons (for a good five seasons until this year) or other teams that continually pick top 5-top 10 and numerous people talk about how talented they are and how they are going to light the league on fire. Right now there are 4 teams alone in the Atlantic that according to most pundits are super young, super talented, and supposedly going to be championship contenders for many years to come (TB, Buffalo, Toronto, Florida). Obviously, they can't all meet those expectations.


So because it happened once or twice out of numerous times it means it's easily predictable? It's not. And with Chicago, I think you're using major hindsight anyways. I'm not sure anyone was predicting a modern day dynasty after they drafted Kane and Toews. Penguins I agree with, but they also drafted two generational talents back to back, which is obviously not normal.

 

[Zetterberg4Captain]

wasnt the quote " the Jets would win a playoff round before detroit.."???

how is that then intentionally misconstrued into winning a cup or being a great team?

 

[Pavels Dog]

Goddamn, if Winnipeg doesn't win a little bit with Wheeler, Sheifele, Laine, Ehlers etc... in the next couple years something is seriously wrong.

The Wings have... Mantha? Maybe Larkin? I'm not sure either Mantha or Larkin are better than the guys I mentioned for Winnipeg.

For what it's worth, Larkin's having an awful year but will still finish with about the same numbers Scheifele had at the same age, and he was better than Ehlers last season. And Mantha's doing fantastic, very underrated even by Wings fans. He's 2nd to only Laine in ES P/GP among rookies, basically he's posting numbers comparable to the elite wingers of the league at even strength.

Mantha: 0.63 ES P/GP
Tarasenko: 0.63
Wheeler: 0.58
Marchand: 0.62
Benn: 0.57
Hall : 0.58
Ehlers: 0.64

He's flying a bit under the radar because the Wings are so goddamn bad on the man advantage.

 

[Bench]

I'm not talking about the Tampa Bays or Washingtons. Those teams have lived up to expectations more often than not. I'm talking about the Edmontons (for a good five seasons until this year) or other teams that continually pick top 5-top 10 and numerous people talk about how talented they are and how great they are going to be in a few years.

Oh, so a few misses erases the hits and becomes "more often than not." If we add up the teams that people genuinely hyped vs the busts, I think you'll find mostly the busts are Edmonton and a few budget franchises with tighter pockets. That doesn't constitute a majority as you implied.

Then there's the "Hey, I'm still relevant, right? Right?" franchises like Vancouver, Calgary, and soon to be Detroit. They are in this nebulous in-between where nobody expects much of anything one way or another.

Additionally, there's been a very vocal criticism of Edmonton's drafting and acquisitions since the beginning. The naysayers were always there.

 

[Bench]

wasnt the quote " the Jets would win a playoff round before detroit.."???

how is that then intentionally misconstrued into winning a cup or being a great team?

It's not. The argument is that usually you can spot the rising teams a mile away. His argument was "who knows" and that anything can happen between now and then, with people being wrong more often than they are right.

And while outliers exist, my argument remains the majority of the time it's been quite clear which teams are poised to take the next step. I don't think it's all that random or unpredictable at all. The momentum of a winning franchise isn't 0 to 60 all at once, it's a gradual acclimation of moves you see gaining steam each year.

 

[Heaton]

I mean, looking at their roster this season Winnipeg arguably has 5-7 players better than the Wings best player. And yet they are still terrible and neck and neck with the Red Wings in the standings.

Goes to show there is much more to putting a team to gather than just slapping together a bunch of talent.

They also happen to be in one of the toughest divisions in the league though. But that doesn't excuse their poor record.

 

[obey86]

wasnt the quote " the Jets would win a playoff round before detroit.."???

how is that then intentionally misconstrued into winning a cup or being a great team?

Fair enough as that is true that was said, but i'm not sure that really matters in the big scope of things. if winnipeg wins a playoff round next season but and the Wings don't but in 2 years after that the Wings are championship contenders and the jets are back out of the playoffs does it matter?

I mean, the Dallas Stars have won a playoff round more recently than all but 7 teams in the NHL. HAsn't done them much good as they are now competing for a top 5 pick. So who cares?

 

[obey86]

It's not. The argument is that usually you can spot the rising teams a mile away. His argument was "who knows" and that anything can happen between now and then, with people being wrong more often than they are right.

And while outliers exist, my argument remains the majority of the time it's been quite clear which teams are poised to take the next step. I don't think it's all that random or unpredictable at all. The momentum of a winning franchise isn't 0 to 60 all at once, it's a gradual acclimation of moves you see gaining steam each year.

Are you saying there was consensus the Blackhawks would be perennial championship contenders when they drafted Kane and Toews...before they even ever made the playoffs?