The Official Tank Thread / Draft Lottery Thread

[Adam Michaels]

Last night was good for Habs:

Leafs beat Ducks: While Leafs are far ahead of Habs, moving 2 points further ahead is always welcome. They sit 17 points up. But more importantly, concerning the LA 5th to become a 4th, Ducks lose and Kings still hold the 3rd spot in the Pacific Division. As we speak, Habs get back the same exact pick they gave to LA for Dwight King (which would be an early 4th round pick).

Isles lose in OT to Preds: An Islanders win was preferable, but a loser point is better than nothing. NYI are now 8 points ahead of Habs. Though MTL have 1 game in hand.

Oilers beat Bolts: The most desired result came to fruition. Oilers are even in points with Habs at 50, but they have 2 games in hand. More to Edmonton's advantage, they have 1 more ROW than Habs, which even if they played the same amount of games, would work in Oilers' advantage.

The only non-desired result was the Rangers losing to Stars in regulation. NYR sit 5 points ahead of Habs with the same amount of games played. It would have been nice to have them at least get a loser point. But with the other 3 games going Habs' way in one way or another, I guess we can live with this result.

 

[Adam Michaels]

Desired results tonight:

Habs are off so a chance for teams to get points while Habs stand pat.

Sabres beat Ducks: Not that Buffalo is able to catch up with Habs, but moving closer can't hurt. Also, another Ducks loss will help keep LA in the 3rd spot of Pacific Division for the draft pick.

Canes beat Flyers in OT: Canes with the win move 8 points ahead of Habs (but Habs would hold a game in hand). And Flyers with a loser point would also move 8 points ahead of Habs (with the same amount of games played).

Jackets beat Caps: With the win, CBJ moves 10 points ahead of Habs with the same amount of games played.

Sens beat Devils: Sens can come within 5 points of Habs with the win and still hold 1 game in hand.

Wings beat Bruins: With the win, Wings would move 2 points up on Habs and still hold 1 game in hand.

Canucks beat Panthers in OT: With the win, Canucks tie Habs in points at 50 with the same amount of games played. Canucks hold the advantage with the ROW, so they'd move ahead of Habs. With the loser point, Panthers move 1 point ahead of Habs and would still have 2 games in hand.

Flames beat Hawks: This one is a little more complex. The lower the Hawks drop in the standings, the higher their 2nd round pick becomes. If Flames win, they knock LA off the 3rd spot in the Pacific Division, however, LA would still be in a Wild Card Spot. However, if both Ducks and Flames win, LA is out of a playoff spot after tonight. So it's ether a Flames win and a Ducks loss or vice versa.

 

[Peanut]

Desired results tonight:

Habs are off so a chance for teams to get points while Habs stand pat.

Sabres beat Ducks: Not that Buffalo is able to catch up with Habs, but moving closer can't hurt. Also, another Ducks loss will help keep LA in the 3rd spot of Pacific Division for the draft pick.

Canes beat Flyers in OT: Canes with the win move 8 points ahead of Habs (but Habs would hold a game in hand). And Flyers with a loser point would also move 8 points ahead of Habs (with the same amount of games played).

Jackets beat Caps: With the win, CBJ moves 10 points ahead of Habs with the same amount of games played.

Sens beat Devils: Sens can come within 5 points of Habs with the win and still hold 1 game in hand.

Wings beat Bruins: With the win, Wings would move 2 points up on Habs and still hold 1 game in hand.

Canucks beat Panthers in OT: With the win, Canucks tie Habs in points at 50 with the same amount of games played. Canucks hold the advantage with the ROW, so they'd move ahead of Habs. With the loser point, Panthers move 1 point ahead of Habs and would still have 2 games in hand.

Flames beat Hawks: This one is a little more complex. The lower the Hawks drop in the standings, the higher their 2nd round pick becomes. If Flames win, they knock LA off the 3rd spot in the Pacific Division, however, LA would still be in a Wild Card Spot. However, if both Ducks and Flames win, LA is out of a playoff spot after tonight. So it's ether a Flames win and a Ducks loss or vice versa.

I feel like I’m reading Mayor_Bee annual elimination number thread good job Adam

 

[bobholly39]

Desired results tonight:

Habs are off so a chance for teams to get points while Habs stand pat.

Sabres beat Ducks: Not that Buffalo is able to catch up with Habs, but moving closer can't hurt. Also, another Ducks loss will help keep LA in the 3rd spot of Pacific Division for the draft pick.

Canes beat Flyers in OT: Canes with the win move 8 points ahead of Habs (but Habs would hold a game in hand). And Flyers with a loser point would also move 8 points ahead of Habs (with the same amount of games played).

Jackets beat Caps: With the win, CBJ moves 10 points ahead of Habs with the same amount of games played.

Sens beat Devils: Sens can come within 5 points of Habs with the win and still hold 1 game in hand.

Wings beat Bruins: With the win, Wings would move 2 points up on Habs and still hold 1 game in hand.

Canucks beat Panthers in OT: With the win, Canucks tie Habs in points at 50 with the same amount of games played. Canucks hold the advantage with the ROW, so they'd move ahead of Habs. With the loser point, Panthers move 1 point ahead of Habs and would still have 2 games in hand.

Flames beat Hawks: This one is a little more complex. The lower the Hawks drop in the standings, the higher their 2nd round pick becomes. If Flames win, they knock LA off the 3rd spot in the Pacific Division, however, LA would still be in a Wild Card Spot. However, if both Ducks and Flames win, LA is out of a playoff spot after tonight. So it's ether a Flames win and a Ducks loss or vice versa.

Sabres beat Ducks. Agreed, never liked the Ducks anyways

Canes beat flyers. Agreed. No OT needed though
Jackets beat Caps. Agreed. NJ is more likely to shit the bed and drop out of race, so let's have Columbus beat and lap them so NJ can start falling off
Sens beat Devils. Yup, agreed. Time for Devils to fall out of playoff spots altogether.
Wings beat Bruins. Agreed. We don't fear the wings, and Boston losing is always a good thing. Makes them ripe for the picking come playoff time.
Canucks beat Panthers. Again, agreed. I don't fear Panthers either, so if you want OT, go for OT. No worries.
Flames beat Hawks. Eh - i'll give you that one. I personally would think it funny if Hawks make the playoffs, and i dislike the Flames, but i'll be nice and let you have it.


Okay so doing all of this, by night's end we're at:

Sabes/Ducks - no matter to us.
Flyers - 1 loss, so when we beat them thursday it's down to 5 points behind them with 0 games in hand. We're getting close!
Jacket/Caps - both divisional playoff spots, so we don't care
Devils lose - give it a month, we'll beat them in the standings. Big nosedive in standings from NJ incoming, wait and see
Detroit - not a threat, we'll beat them anyways, so who cares.
Panthers 1 OT point. Agreed. let the teams ahead think FLA is the real threat, and not notice us coming for them till it's too late. FLA will be our camouflage. Good thinking
Flames/Hawks. No effect either way

 

[Adam Michaels]

Sabres beat Ducks. Agreed, never liked the Ducks anyways

Canes beat flyers. Agreed. No OT needed though
Jackets beat Caps. Agreed. NJ is more likely to **** the bed and drop out of race, so let's have Columbus beat and lap them so NJ can start falling off
Sens beat Devils. Yup, agreed. Time for Devils to fall out of playoff spots altogether.
Wings beat Bruins. Agreed. We don't fear the wings, and Boston losing is always a good thing. Makes them ripe for the picking come playoff time.
Canucks beat Panthers. Again, agreed. I don't fear Panthers either, so if you want OT, go for OT. No worries.
Flames beat Hawks. Eh - i'll give you that one. I personally would think it funny if Hawks make the playoffs, and i dislike the Flames, but i'll be nice and let you have it.


Okay so doing all of this, by night's end we're at:

Sabes/Ducks - no matter to us.
Flyers - 1 loss, so when we beat them thursday it's down to 5 points behind them with 0 games in hand. We're getting close!
Jacket/Caps - both divisional playoff spots, so we don't care
Devils lose - give it a month, we'll beat them in the standings. Big nosedive in standings from NJ incoming, wait and see
Detroit - not a threat, we'll beat them anyways, so who cares.
Panthers 1 OT point. Agreed. let the teams ahead think FLA is the real threat, and not notice us coming for them till it's too late. FLA will be our camouflage. Good thinking
Flames/Hawks. No effect either way

The Flames/Hawks and Ducks/Sabres games only matter concerning the LA Kings. In the Mitchell trade, Habs got a conditional 5th pick. The condition is that if LA qualify for the playoffs, the Habs get back the 4th round pick they gave to LA in the Dwight King trade last year. Flames and Ducks can push LA out of a playoff spot if they both win.

Flyers and Canes in OT means both teams get points, giving them both a chance to move further ahead of Habs in the standings.

 

[ECWHSWI]

Sabres beat Ducks. Agreed, never liked the Ducks anyways

Canes beat flyers. Agreed. No OT needed though
Jackets beat Caps. Agreed. NJ is more likely to **** the bed and drop out of race, so let's have Columbus beat and lap them so NJ can start falling off
Sens beat Devils. Yup, agreed. Time for Devils to fall out of playoff spots altogether.
Wings beat Bruins. Agreed. We don't fear the wings, and Boston losing is always a good thing. Makes them ripe for the picking come playoff time.
Canucks beat Panthers. Again, agreed. I don't fear Panthers either, so if you want OT, go for OT. No worries.
Flames beat Hawks. Eh - i'll give you that one. I personally would think it funny if Hawks make the playoffs, and i dislike the Flames, but i'll be nice and let you have it.


Okay so doing all of this, by night's end we're at:

Sabes/Ducks - no matter to us.
Flyers - 1 loss, so when we beat them thursday it's down to 5 points behind them with 0 games in hand. We're getting close!
Jacket/Caps - both divisional playoff spots, so we don't care
Devils lose - give it a month, we'll beat them in the standings. Big nosedive in standings from NJ incoming, wait and see
Detroit - not a threat, we'll beat them anyways, so who cares.
Panthers 1 OT point. Agreed. let the teams ahead think FLA is the real threat, and not notice us coming for them till it's too late. FLA will be our camouflage. Good thinking
Flames/Hawks. No effect either way

I like the way you think. #2018HabsPlayoffsIbelieve. #GoHabsGo. #RealFansWantPlayoffs

Jackets could be the team finishing 8th, you're totally right it's fine if they get point(s), doesnt matter...

remember when we demolished the Wings in back to back games ?? took them what, 2 weeks to pass us in the standings... but hey we'll beat them next time we face them, guaranteed to finish ahead right ??

Yup, good thinking, teams ahead of the Habs, like the Panthers, getting point(s) will only help... who would have thought!!

 

[bobholly39]

Jackets could be the team finishing 8th, you're totally right it's fine if they get point(s), doesnt matter...

remember when we demolished the Wings in back to back games ?? took them what, 2 weeks to pass us in the standings... but hey we'll beat them next time we face them, guaranteed to finish ahead right ??

Yup, good thinking, teams ahead of the Habs, like the Panthers, getting point(s) will only help... who would have thought!!

The only teams i'm concerned about right now are:

Philly. NYI. NJ

Rangers suck and will drop out.
FLA won't make it regardless
Det won't make it regardless
Carolina always finds a way to be on the outside looking in.

So I figure if we can pass Philly, NYI (and bonus - NJ if they fall off enough) - other teams will be lapped over in the process.

NYI sit in the last wildcard spot and are pacing for 88 points on the year right now. A totally reachable objective by us.

 

[ECWHSWI]

The only teams i'm concerned about right now are:

Philly. NYI. NJ

Rangers suck and will drop out.
FLA won't make it regardless
Det won't make it regardless
Carolina always finds a way to be on the outside looking in.

So I figure if we can pass Philly, NYI (and bonus - NJ if they fall off enough) - other teams will be lapped over in the process.

NYI sit in the last wildcard spot and are pacing for 88 points on the year right now. A totally reachable objective by us.

NJ has a 12 pts lead on the Habs with 2 games in hand... they are ahead of Colombus (you know, the team you don't care about for some magical reason).

aint that amzing, all these teams will miss while the Habs (who are games below .500) will magically start winning games and beat team 8 or 9 pts ahead.




rebuild : the ONLY smart solution.

 

[bobholly39]

NJ has a 12 pts lead on the Habs with 2 games in hand... they are ahead of Colombus (you know, the team you don't care about for some magical reason).

aint that amzing, all these teams will miss while the Habs (who are games below .500) will magically start winning games and beat team 8 or 9 pts ahead.

back to reality Bob, back to reality...


rebuild : the ONLY smart solution.

I just have a suspicion that NJ will drop out of the playoffs. Not holding my breath (nor do I need to). Both Columbus and NJ can make it - we're gunning for the last spot, so they are mostly inconsequential.

You can't expect every team ahead of you to lose every game they have, that's unrealistic. I figure Philly and NYI are the 2 biggest threats to the wildcard race. If we catch them - it means we also caught and passed the others in the process.

Also - you can't rebuild within the season. Let's wait and see what happens first. How exactly do you go about rebuilding in February? You can't purposefully lose games, doing so should warrant getting us banned from the league altogether.

 

[habtastic]

I'm confused. Are we STILL trying to make the playoffs? With THIS team?

Please, bring on the losses. Let the kids play. Let's have some sort of success this season.

 

[bobholly39]

I'm confused. Are we STILL trying to make the playoffs? With THIS team?

Please, bring on the losses. Let the kids play. Let's have some sort of success this season.

The problem is - letting the kids play will lead to more victories (look at this weekend as example).

The vets have been so rotten than bringing up some young talent will make us win games/put us back in the playoff race.

 

[ECWHSWI]

I just have a suspicion that NJ will drop out of the playoffs. Not holding my breath (nor do I need to). Both Columbus and NJ can make it - we're gunning for the last spot, so they are mostly inconsequential.

You can't expect every team ahead of you to lose every game they have, that's unrealistic. I figure Philly and NYI are the 2 biggest threats to the wildcard race. If we catch them - it means we also caught and passed the others in the process.

Also - you can't rebuild within the season. Let's wait and see what happens first. How exactly do you go about rebuilding in February? You can't purposefully lose games, doing so should warrant getting us banned from the league altogether.

sure, let's wait so after missing the PO we can also lose Plekanec for nothing instead of getting something in a trade for him, Same for any other player who's contract ends, let's wait... worked wonders with markov and Radulov last summer you know...

same for Pacioretty, let's wait another season and lose him for nothing instead of getting picks and prospects for him...


I really like your thinking, do not get extra picks ever, do not get young - cheap - talented players ever, and do not pick early ever...

great recipe for improvement, I smell a cup winning team as soon as next year with Drouin - Danault - Plekanec - Froese as Habs C...

 

[bobholly39]

sure, let's wait so after missing the PO we can also lose Plekanec for nothing instead of getting something in a trade for him, Same for any other player who's contract ends, let's wait... worked wonders with markov and Radulov last summer you know...

same for Pacioretty, let's wait another season and lose him for nothing instead of getting picks and prospects for him...


I really like your thinking, do not get extra picks ever, do not get young - cheap - talented players ever, and do not pick early ever...

great recipe for improvement, I smell a cup winning team as soon as next year with Drouin - Danault - Plekanec - Froese as Habs C...

You're jumping to conclusions though. I never said we shouldn't trade those guys. I'd be all for doing so if we get the proper return/value.

I'd love for Pacioretty to be traded (assuming proper return though). Same for Pleknaec, and others. No problem there.

I just still want the team to win after the trades. And I believe that our young players getting more time/important roles would actually contribute to us winning more games.

Oh and - I DO smell a cup winning team next year if things go our way. But our #1 center will be Tavares, who you forgot to list =p

 

[sandviper]

First, thanks Adam for putting the tank watch for tonight. Having tried (and typically failing) a few times, I know how hard it is to track the desired outcome of each match, especially when results impact us more than just the tank itself.

I think its obvious what the team needs to do but whether they actually do it, who knows? Plekanec should be a no-brainer, especially if we're still out of a playoff spot by TDL (which we should be). I mean, if we are out of the playoffs and we KEEP Plekanec, Bergevin should be fired at 3:01 PM that day or whenever the TDL ends.

Trading Pacioretty is a tougher one. There's going to be some decent wingers available on TDL day and I don't want to give the guy away. I do think he is the best option though given he still has a year after this season so he is essentially good for 2 cup runs or defences. I'd be asking for a high-end center prospect, a 3/4th line NHL ready player under-25 and a 1st round pick at the minimum.

Price and Weber are guaranteed to not be moved. I'd also expect Petry, Alzner and Shaw to still be wearing Habs jerseys at the end of the day, though the last two I think would be due more to teams not wanting those contracts rather than us wanting to keep them.

 

[ECWHSWI]

You're jumping to conclusions though. I never said we shouldn't trade those guys. I'd be all for doing so if we get the proper return/value.

I'd love for Pacioretty to be traded (assuming proper return though). Same for Pleknaec, and others. No problem there.

I just still want the team to win after the trades. And I believe that our young players getting more time/important roles would actually contribute to us winning more games.

Oh and - I DO smell a cup winning team next year if things go our way. But our #1 center will be Tavares, who you forgot to list =p

these are your own words : Also - you can't rebuild within the season. Let's wait and see what happens first.

let's wait and see FIRST...

well, the trade deadline is in February Bob... you can't wait and see the (game) results AND then plan moves for the deadline Bob, the're only 3 weeks left before TDL...

you're settling for mediocrity Bob, that'ok, that's your right...

but most would like to see real skills on the team for once, some would like to see this team as a serious contender... and the only way for it to happen is trough REBUILD.

Habs tried mediocrity the last 25 years and they succeeded in being mediocre. Let's try something else now...

 

[bobholly39]

these are your own words : Also - you can't rebuild within the season. Let's wait and see what happens first.

let's wait and see FIRST...

well, the trade deadline is in February Bob... you can't wait and see the (game) results AND then plan moves for the deadline Bob, the're only 3 weeks left before TDL...

you're settling for mediocrity Bob, that'ok, that's your right...

but most would like to see real skills on the team for once, some would like to see this team as a serious contender... and the only way for it to happen is trough REBUILD.

Habs tried mediocrity the last 25 years and they succeeded in being mediocre. Let's try something else now...

again you're making assumptions.

I've never once said we should be buyers at the trade deadline, or that we shouldn't sell or trade assets where it makes sense.

And i'm not settling for mediocrity. That's you and everyone else. "hey let's lose on purpose and hope NHL takes pity on us for sucking and rewards us with picks". That's mediocrity imo.

Where did I say anywhere in any of my posts anything you disagree with concerning the trade deadline? Did I say we should trade to make a push for playoffs? Or that we shouldn't trade away Pacioretty or Plekanec for proper return? I have no issue with any of that.

You can't lose on purpose in this league. And I believe this team can win games (even if we trade pieces away). Enough so to maybe make a comeback towards the playoff race.

That's the only difference

 

[LastWordArmy]

In theory? Sure.

But in 1996, it didn't matter if the Florida Panthers faced the Avalanche or the Red Wings. They were getting steamrolled. Same with Washington in 98. They really didn't belong in the final, a weak Eastern Conference allowed it, and the result was pretty clear. It wasn't until the Devils started spending money that the East got a contender again, after Pittsburgh basically imploded.

The devils won in 95. So much for the theory that the east couldnt win in the mid to late 90s.

 

[LastWordArmy]

Wait... am i in the tank thread or the playoff chase thread

 

[Price is Wright]

The devils won in 95. So much for the theory that the east couldnt win in the mid to late 90s.

That wasn't what I was saying? The early to mid 90s were dominated by the east with Pittsburgh, Montreal, New York and New Jersey winning. Then Quebéc moved to Colorado and the power in the conference shifted to the West as Pittsburgh started losing control, New York quickly fell apart, Montreal even quicker, and the Philadelphia Flyers were a pretender disguised as the strongest cup contender. Only New Jersey really realized they had to the skills to go all in and they eventually did so at least one team in the east was a powerhouse. Otherwise the West dominated until the Red Wings and Avalanche teams got old.

If you look at the best teams in the east in the mid to late 90s most of them were teams that didn't have their stuff together. Sure, Buffalo could have been a contender if they actually built a team around Hasek but instead just relied everything on him and he almost carried them to the Cup. The best in the east was basically as good as the second tier West teams like St. Louis. Otherwise it was a forgone conclusion that either Detroit, Colorado or Dallas was winning.

 

[LastWordArmy]

I don't buy that just because a team didn't actually win, that means the Flyers were not a contender in the late 90s, or that the Lightning were not a contender when they made the Finals, same with any number of teams.

 

[Omar]

You're jumping to conclusions though. I never said we shouldn't trade those guys. I'd be all for doing so if we get the proper return/value.

I'd love for Pacioretty to be traded (assuming proper return though). Same for Pleknaec, and others. No problem there.

I just still want the team to win after the trades. And I believe that our young players getting more time/important roles would actually contribute to us winning more games.

Oh and - I DO smell a cup winning team next year if things go our way. But our #1 center will be Tavares, who you forgot to list =p

You’re still on this without explaining your plan if Tavares doesn’t sign here.

 

[jaffy27]

The problem is - letting the kids play will lead to more victories (look at this weekend as example).

The vets have been so rotten than bringing up some young talent will make us win games/put us back in the playoff race.

All losing teams will let their kids play and they will all accumulate points

 

[Habs Halifax]

You’re still on this without explaining your plan if Tavares doesn’t sign here.

My personal plan if Tavares does not sign with us would be to have another off year where we run with youth and test them. I don't care if we head into next season with cap space as we need to target big fish assets. If we can't get Tavares and maybe another piece like Backlund or trade for McDonaugh (we can afford both if we trade Shaw or Alzner), I would like us to go with a young team and perhaps another top 10 pick in the 2019 draft.

 

[bobholly39]

You’re still on this without explaining your plan if Tavares doesn’t sign here.

How is my plan any different than yours?

 

[The Great Weal]

I would want to tank the next 2 years. Getting one of Dahlin/Hughes/Lafreniere would be so nice.